Doronicum Magnificum : Leopardbane Have you grown this?

Only if we can work out a trade! I'll dmail you.

Happy, for the "drab period," I have Baptisia and Shasta Daisy to get through thelull before the July blooms hit. Baptisia is also called "False Indigo" and "Rattlebush," the latter because when the flowers fade, they form these neat lumpy pods on the tall stems that can rattle in the wind. False Indigo has the bluest blue flowers you can find, and lovely blue-green foliage for the entire summer!!

Shasta Daisies are big and virgin white ray petaled blooms--look great in the shade. They do well with morning sun and afternoon shade, like Leopard's Bane. You can cut both False Indigo and shasta daisies for vases--they have strong stems. I don't have a picture of mine, sorry.

I need to divide both of these plants, so D-mail me if you want any.

I love false indigo -- but I don't get quite enough sun for mine to be splendid. It is only just doing ok. I'd forgotten about shasta daisies, though; I'd better winter sow some. I do remember that they do ok in a partly shaded environment. When you get around to doing your dividing, if you can't find room in your own yard for them, I'd love to take them off your hands! Thanks for the offer! But I plan to plant some seeds, so I should be in good shape.

Hi Folks - I just read this thread through and was excited to see some new folks posting. Welcome all. I too have to agree that Hart is very special. Visiting her home last year was one of my highlights. That is why I really want to get together with this group of great people again. I won't be making it to Seed Swap, but will be there in spirit. You all have fun though.

Happy, just wanted to thank you again for being so gracious at last years swap and allowing John and I to take home the Japanese Maple that you brought. How very special that is to us. He finally planted it last fall and we are looking forward to watching it grow in to a real beauty. hope, hope, hope

Thanks to all who posted, I enjoyed reading. Good luck on finding some really spectacular shade plants, Happy.

Ruby

Thanks, Ruby, and you are very welcome -- I'm glad the maple has found a good home.

Happy, I have daisies coming out of my ears!! I will leave them on your doorstep!!

So, you have indigo, already??? Your garden may be a lot like mine. If you started them from seed, I think it will take a couple of years to get them to flower because it took mine about 2-3 to develop flowers. They are somewhat shrubby, woody in nature.

I also have variagated Bishop's weed, a lovely bright-colored ground cover (good for shady spots.) Foxgloves, lobelia (cardinal flower) and Oriental lilies also do well with shade. I have a bunch of lilies!!

I think my shade is too dense for lilies. And too dry for cardinal flower, though I might try it there. I'm going to plant foxglove seeds -- they would look great there. Thank you for your kind daisy offer, foxnfirefly! I have a bunch of seeds, so I should go ahead and plant them -- one can never have too many daisies!

But bishop's weed -- the unvariegated kind has been the scourge of my yard. If I could add up the hours I have spent weeding out just bishop's weed . . . well, I don't want to think about it! It is the most invasive plant I have every encountered, bar none. So even though the variegated kind is lovely, I avoid it like the plague!

Foxy, I want to see you show up next Saturday sporting that look -- daisies coming out of your ears! Sounds like my kind of person! :-)

LOL!!! Why, of course, you are the biggest plant swapper in the area, Critter!!! It now looks like I may be able to come to your fathering on the 23rd because the party I was anticipating that weekend has finally been slated for the 29th. I just need to see if DH will do it or I need to find another ride. I will try to get the answer for certain by the end of the weekend and post on your "Think Spring" thread. I can pull some daisies for that......

Happy, so you have Bishop's weed--the non-varigated type? I would say it is vigorous but not invasive. At least not in my yard. But you can't plant it with small tender perennials because it will cover them and choke them out. It is good under trees and other areas where you can't grow anything else . Here's a bed where I underplanted lilies with varigated Bishop's Weed. It started to choke out my columbines, which are very delicate plants. They don't compete with this stuff......

Here's one of my foxgloves....they were stunted last summer, probably because of the late frost exposure and then the murderous hot summer. Not sure I am going to see them again. I will have to get more. Good plants for part-shade.

Your foxglove are lovely. No, my bishops weeds is invasive beyond belief. I will never be able to rid my yard of it completely, though I pull it out whenever I see it. The roots are unbelievable -- look like spaghetti.

I agree. When we bought this house I got a yardful of it. It is horrible stuff-it's everywhere!
There is also a little of the variegated kind here but you'd never know they were related by the difference in their behavior. The all-green variety is rampant.

Yes, they are two different plants, however related. I didn't mean to divert the topic of this thread to noxious weeds, though. Forgive me for that. Varigated Bishop's Weed is a ground cover that I have used and it has worked for me. It attracts bees, butterflies and birds, as well. The other one that Happy may have is probably the one called goutweed.

I do wish to share a link to the USDA's Natural Resources & Conservation Service Plants Database which deals with culturally significant plants and those that are "threats." The site states which plants are identified as "NW" and if they pose a threat to natives or culturally signficant plants. If they pose a threat, then the Federal Government or the State will decide on a means of control, meaning banning or prohibiting the plant from cultivation. Here's the link:

http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=AEPO

Regarding the foxgloves, the "gloves" on that one were so big that you could put your finger in them with wiggle room. Unfortunately, they didn't get as tall and majestic as hoped for to go in the back of the border. I forgot what variety they were........

Fox, these aren't different plants, they're the same plant but one is variegated. Even my garden books recommend growing the variegated, which is a bit less aggressive, only in areas where the roots will be contained.

Might want to read the comments in the plant files:
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/546/

I agree on the unfortunate tendency to call anything that will eventually spread invasive, but in this case it's probably deserved and apparently very difficult to eradicate once it has spread.

By the way, if you do have the variegated, the non-variegated is so extremely aggressive it's recommended that if you have any within your clump that reverts to the solid green that you root them out.

I wouldn't wish the unvariegated version on my worst enemy.

Happy, no one would want a maintenance nightmare, for sure, and I understand that you have one with the non-variegated type of BW. That is unfortunate!

IHart--t's the "same" plant in species, but the variegated BW is a cultivar that is less aggressive and is better containable. It is not the one that has earned its ban. That's the difference. I guess I can't do it justice by saying that because of the "invasive" tendancy. But in my opinion, the variegated kind is as "bad" or as good as English ivy, ajuga, bamboo and periwinkle, and many types of grasses. All of these are groundcovers used to fill areas that are otherwise difficult. They just need restraints and control. Better to say, if you can't keep them up, don't plant them. While you may rather ay, don't plant them because they are bad. Variegated BW can be controlled by planting near a concrete path, rock wall, etc. I have mine contained in a rock bed. I was surprised that lilies and other things thrived there. I have had the same plants for 4 years and now, want to move on and experiment with other things....

Don't misunderstand; I have heard from lots of people that the variegated find is perfectly manageable, and it is very very pretty. My response is based on my own experience with the variegated kind -- it just makes me shudder to even think about it.

Fox, both are Aegopodium podagraria. Being a variegated variety doesn't make it a different plant any more than roses of different colors are different plants.

I have some growing around my pond, but it can't go anywhere from where it's planted and my soil is so rocky and dry, things that go wild elsewhere grow slowly there.

There's also a big difference between a vigorously spreading plant that is easy to pull up and contain, like ajuga, and one that is almost impossible to eradicate once it gets established. English ivy is another perfect example of the latter.

LOL... I understand Happy's point. After a running battle with a some junipers in the foundation planting (eventually removed & replaced) at the townhouse, I can't look at a juniper of any kind...

Hart: English ivy had better be possible to eradicate -- we just stripped a large bed of it. Sigh.

Happy, I'm so sorry. It will come back because it's impossible to get out all the little root pieces and each of those will make a new plant. Probably the only way, if you can, is to wait until it comes back up and spray it with Roundup, then keep spraying it with Roundup.

I had it in the beds at my old house and tried for years to get rid of it with no luck.

Sigh. I really avoid Roundup.

It's really hard to get rid of without Roundup. Think of it as a limited application... There are a few things I have to use it on around here (thistles, bindweed) because there's just no other way to get on top of them. As long as you're not spraying it everywhere constantly or spraying it right on a creek bank, I think you're OK.

It's the principal of the thing. I really value the wildlife in our yard, and hate to do anything to harm it. So I use a lot of elbow grease instead of chemicals. We've actually done well with getting rid of ivy. Bishops weed remains by a long margin the only thing that has really foiled me, but it is also impervious to Roundup -- bounces back. I could do repeat applications, but to avoid spilling it on neighboring plants is so time consuming that I don't bother.

I'm not a purist, but we do try hard. I am thinking of using a little roundup this spring on the onion grass, though; we have some big outbreaks.

I do understand. My activity has been limited enough the past couple of years that I've had to resort to chemical controls more than I'd have preferred... and even so, the Johnson grass is running amok in the orchard.

Happy, I'd happily take all that ajuga you're killing. LOL

The worst ivy problem I've ever seen is at SO's parents' house, all along the bed that runs the length of their yard. They never planted the stuff - it crept over from next door. His mom spent a fortune hiring a crew to come in and try to uproot the stuff a couple of years ago, which was pretty much a waste of time and money.

There are so many shrubs and perennials interplanted, I don't know how it will ever get eradicated. And of course it's still next door so it will just run back over eventually anyway.

I try to avoid using chemicals whenever possible, but I've found it's the only way to get rid of some things.

Hart: I'm not killing ajuga -- I love it -- but I do have tons of the unvariegated kind it you want some. And a good bit of pretty variegated types. Let me know.

My step-son has been pulling out the ivy, and I guess he's done a pretty good job. But he's been working on it over a long while, rather than just doing it in one day -- that may be the advantage, so he pulls it out as it starts up again. Maybe the strain we have isn't as aggressive. But I have an area where I pulled it out several years ago, and while it does recur, as long as I stay on it it is manageable, just annoying. Unlike bishops weed!

I'm sorry, Happy, having a senior moment above and confusing bugleweed with bishop's weed. That I don't need. I'm trying to get enough ajuga and lamium to plant all along that slope next to the driveway. It's impossible to mow and the weedy grasses growing there are awful looking. I've been moving my daylilies there too so that hopefully someday it will be pretty instead of an eyesore.

I've been pulling all those grasses out by hand too but I've ended up using some Roundup too. It's too hard to get all the roots out and keep the grasses from coming back. It's slow going. I've gotten about half the length done and I hope in the spring to finish the other half.

There are plenty of ivies that aren't as bad as English ivy. I hope that's what you have.

Hart: I think daylilies on a slope are a glorious sight! The next time we meet at a swap, I'll bring you a bunch of ajuga for your hill!

Thanks, Happy. That would be great!

I hope the daylilies do well there. It's kind of dry but it's actually better soil than in my old bed up in the yard. The weeds sure do thrive there.

Hello Hart - Haven't talked with you for a while. While reading these posts I am envisioning your yard. I had so much fun at your place last year. It was definitely a high light of the year for me and I have so missed the other get togethers that the group has had since then.

You have definitely done a lot of work around your place. I was getting tired just thinking of you tackling the slope and all the work that is involved. Ha-ha, If I am thinking of your work, I can pretend that we don't have any to do here.

I have a load of seeds that I need to begin doing something with. I was just thinking a bit ago about whether I am going to have space. Hopefully in a while when it is time to actually begin planting things, I will be able to use the two fairly large bins of compost that we have been making this past year. Truth be told, a lot of work is done around here too.

Well, just wanted to give you a holler. Everyone take care and have a good week coming up.

Ruby

Hi, Ruby. So good to hear from you. How are you feeling?

I wish I could think of an easier way to do that slope but it's just steep enough that it has to be done by hand.

We did get a lot done last year - building the chicken house, building the new shed, putting in the vegetable garden again. I didn't get a lot done in the flower beds, though, except for getting all the wonderful plants from the swap planted, some more irises planted out front and some bulbs in the fall. And another chunk of the slope dug out and planted. Oh, and getting the sedums planted in the slope behind the patio. Hopefully the irises will do well and I'll have lots of those for a future swap.

I envy you all that compost. I have a compost bin but it's so dry here and I don't turn it so it takes forever to make compost. Getting one of those doodads to turn it should be put on my must do list for this year.

I do have lots of rabbit manure from the bunnies, which I plan to use in the flower beds and vegetable garden this year. The chicken litter goes in the compost bin.

I have lots of seeds too and I need to get busy getting the indoors seed starting started. Can't do it too early because we won't have our last frost until June.

While out in back yard earlier doing doggie dooty, I also saw where quite a few rabbits have been using our yard for a bathroom. I set out 3 primrose in one of the garden beds. Yippie, got to dig in dirt and it felt good. Actually dug so deep that I needed to put most of the soil back in hole before putting plants in. The two small back beds were covered with our first composting efforts last fall. They will be really nice to plant in pretty soon. There are already some perennials in one of the beds though.

Hopefully John will have the walkway out front done by planting time this year. I probably won't be planting much in it, but at least I will be able to get to it to tend it. I was unable last year. If all the day lilies that he planted last year bloom this year, it will be gorgeous. He did three rather large beds.

Oh yeah, I bought a leaf shredder and last Saturday on one of our 70 degree days, I was out chopping up leaves and thin sticks that littered the yard. It is goind to be so nice to chip up all the things that normally take forever to rot. We ought to be turning out dirt a lot quicker now. ha-ha

Thanks for checking in Hart. Good to hear from you.

Ruby

I wish we had more leaves in our yard. The black walnuts and cherries have such small leaves, they don't amount to much. Hopefully once the hybrid poplars we planted get big enough we'll have leaves from them.

I have a chipper I got years ago through the Valley Trader, but nothing except branches around here to chip. The shredded leaves and branches make a wonderful mulch. SO brought a huge truckload home from work one day and the bed where he put it has the nicest soil in the yard now.

BTW, a lot of people think you can't use things you've just chipped because it will rob the plants of nitrogen as it breaks down. They know now as long as you don't dig it into the existing soil, that won't happen and it's fine to use right away.

I'm so glad you'll be able to do hands-on gardening this year. I know how much you missed it last year.

When speaking of my chipper in another forum, someone pointed out that using this as straight mulch on plants would harm them. Which way did he go George, which way did he go? Not sure how will be used. I will do as you suggested. It is mainly to be used for compost any way. and we use another supplier for much to cover other beds. John also made several trips last year and the year before getting truck loads of mulch. We will have a fairly good size of mulch from last year.

If I am able to sneak out front without exciting the dogs too much, I will go around today and see how the front beds are doing. I haven't been in front yard for several months now. I bet I have all kinds of things peeking out.

Ruby

That's what everyone was told for years. Newer research has shown it's not true. Even the old advice was only talking about wood chips, not shredded leaves, though.

It's amazing the things that are starting to sprout up already if you look closely.

I saw a forsythia bush beginning to bloom yesterday.

My chickens are molting. Sure sign of spring. LOL

I noticed yesterday if you look closely at the tree branches, even from a distance you can see buds are starting to swell.

I don't remember what it was, but one of the seeds I used to get every year always said on the packet to plant when the maple buds were the size of mouse ears. I always got such a kick out of that.

The bluebirds are back from wherever they hide all winter and are checking out the bluebird boxes, the robins are back from wherever they hide all winter and are pecking around in the yard. They must know something we don't know.

It has probably been about a month or so, but one day I looked in my back yard and there were literally at least a hundred robins picking at something in the ground. They didn't stay long, about two minutes or so. It was a most unusual sight for sure. About the time they started to fly off, another type of bird with about the same size group landed and stayed about the same amount of time.

A friend was here and neither of us could get over how many birds there were. I am glad that they found my yard worthy of stopping on what was sure to be a long trip for them. They should be back home now, but probably questioning whether they didn't push the return flight a bit this year.

I don't know why we see such huge flocks of robins in the spring. Sometimes there are so many it looks like starlings.

They don't always migrate in this area but hang out in the woods all winter where you don't see them.