It can be fun to breed your own zinnias - Part 6

Well, really anything that fell out of its seed coat or I took out and there were several kinds. It's too long ago to remember precisely because I use to grow tons of stuff but like you said, they were dried seed, not green. I remember hollyhocks for one, maybe clematis...

Hi Loretta,

If you think it would be advantageous to your dahlia breeding to get seedlings to come up quicker, I suggest you try the green seed technique, and also its extension, growing embryos extracted from green seeds.

Zinnias normally germinate very quickly, in just a few days, sometimes as few as two, so the embryo technique is a minor advantage for me. But I routinely harvest green zinnia seeds. Mainly because they are "ready" six weeks or more earlier than the conventional "brown head" zinnia seed harvest.

ZM

Dahlias are pretty quick too but its fun to experiment.

Hello everyone,

Our weather has recently been considerably cooler than average for this time of year, which is causing me to hold off on in-ground planting for a few days until the soil gets a bit warmer. I did plant a bed of Razzle Dazzles and their germination was considerably delayed by the cool weather, although I do have some RD seedlings up now.

Recent pictures of indoor exotics are attached. As I continue to intercross Razzle Dazzle specimens with exotic specimens the two strains may "merge", but that remains to be seen. Hoping for warmer weather so that I can put a lot zinnia seeds in the ground.

ZM

Looks like you've done well with the tubulars. I'm wishing you lots of warm weather ZM, enough so it spills out onto Michigan! :)

Oh yeah! I like the last one.

We are still enjoying seeing pictures of what you have growing ZM. I especially like your 5th picture above with the yellow edging. I have not been online at Dave's Gardens in a little while (my serious gardening time). I have about 5 good rows of zinnia in the gardens now with anticipation of several more. The tallest of my zinnia plants are probably 3 inches. They are slow with all the cool weather. My scabiosa zinnia are in one garden. Then I have cool colored zinnia (from my pink/purple saved seed) in another, then I have warm/hot colors (I call my firecracker bed) in another. Then in yet another bed I have a mix of my special saved seed. I'm waiting in anticipation...... Oh, and in one other bed, in with some perennials I planted a zinnia that looked to me to have a hint of BLUE.

Hi Brenda,

This is also a very busy time for me, transitioning from indoor growing to outdoor growing. I have planted only one bed of outdoor zinnias so far, due to our freakish cold weather and cool soil. It has finally germinated fairly well, but only in the cotyledon stage.

I hope your blue does well, even if it isn't true blue. Bluish lavenders look good in their own right. And, if you do get a true blue mutant, that would be fantastic. You should be able to make some money off of it, and you would be famous in the zinnia world. I have been teased by blue-lavender zinnias from time to time. At one time I had a sky blue until the sun got to it, and it turned blue-lavender. The GMO people have created blue roses, and eventually they will get around to zinnias. More later.

ZM .

I'm crossing my fingers for you Brenda.

Your lavenders are still beautiful, I especially like the rippled petals from the first photo ZM.

Most interesting.

Pretty bluish lavenders.

Hello everybody,

Some of the hybrid zinnias I transplanted into my garden are in bloom now, and I am attaching a picture of one that has an interesting new flower form. The inner half of the petals are tubular and the outer half is open and down-rolled to create a pointed effect. Today it produced a good yield of pollen, and I used all of it, to self pollinate a few surgically exposed stigmas on the parent bloom, and also to cross-pollinate it with several different bloom forms. I am also planting new seed beds as fast as I can. I hope to have my outdoor zinnia garden planted by July 9th.

ZM

That certainly is an interesting flower form, I like it. I was wondering if you do anything to protect a specifically pollinated bloom from being cross pollinated again by other pollinators that might be hanging around in your garden? Are Zinnias promiscuous?

ZM - Back to the hybridizing forum and I must say that is an interesting yellow zinnia with tubular petals.

Of the zinnia that I planted (with what I thought was a hint of blue), very FEW germinated and are growing.

I have deadheaded a few zinnia already, that did not appear to be up to speed. I have one really good looking scabiosa. As I mentioned, I have several areas of zinnia up and growing and my largest of areas that I plant still a tad too wet.

#1 pix - This is it, where the rows are 300 ft long. Last June was a wet one and that is when this pix was taken - June 19. Guess it's not as late as I think for planting. I call this my Wetland Garden as the wetland body of water is seen in the far distance. The area I'll be planting is the worked area between the road and the wetland (water). As you can see in the picture there is still some water still standing in far end of garden.

#2- Is my Wetland Garden last October and believe it or not there are a lot of zinnia to choose from there. Other flowers as well. NO deer issues with zinnia - never!!! I'm not as tedious and meticulous with my hybridizing as ZM - hum. . . .

#3 -

#4 - 2014 - Late October - just ahead of frost.

Woops - I hit "post reply" too quickly. Here is the #4 photo - Late October - just ahead of frost. One of my favorites.

Hi Robin,

Zinnias are promiscuous, as you say, because they are open pollinated by a variety of insects, including honeybees, bumblebees, carpenter bees, and several other bee species. There are butterflies and day flying moths that sip zinnia necter, as do hummingbirds, but those all hover above the bloom and access the nectar with a long proboscis (moths or butterflies) or bill (hummingbird). And the nectar sippers don't usually carry any pollen with them like the bees can..

The zinnias that are presenting pollen florets usually get self pollinated, but the zinnias that are not presenting pollen florets occasionally get cross pollinated by bees but that is very "hit and miss" so they frequently don't get pollen. I very rarely protect a zinnia bloom from insect pollination, but when I do I use a homemade "hairnet" like in the first photo. Most of the time when I deploy a hairnet it is to protect the bloom from seed eating birds, like finches. Sometimes I protect the whole zinnia plant by draping nylon screening over its zinnia cage and securing it with safety pins, like in the second photo.

Incidentally, I think I have mentioned this before, but you can frequently improve your view of a Dave's Garden photo by right-clicking on it and select "View Image" from the pop-up menu. Depending on the file size of the photo, you will get a larger view of the image. And then, for the best viewing, you can then make your full screen available to the image by clicking your F11 key, which will hide your browser's heading material. Not all photos will get larger from the F11 key, but most of mine do. Hit F11 again to restore your browser's heading and hit the back arrow in the browser heading to get back to your "normal" DG view. All of this sounds a bit complicated, but after you do it a few times it becomes "second nature".

I am headed to my zinnia garden now to do some pollinating and planting.

ZM

I have another method of viewing bigger photos-
1- I also right-click on the image, to get it in it's own screen, this also usually fixes those with a sideways presentation.
2- hit F11 but you do not have to do this
3- Ctrl +, each time you do this it gets a bit bigger!, to shrink do Ctrl -, or Ctrl 0 which returns it to original size with just one click.

Hi Pistil,

Thanks for bringing up the Ctrl + method for magnifying an already full screen photo. That technique can magnify an image to much larger than full screen, but you have scroll bars that let you move your view over various parts of the image. That technique is very useful for studying tiny details in an image. If you get too much magnification with Ctrl +, you can use Ctrl - to de-magnify the image in stages.

ZM

Thanks for the information ZM, it's great to know that the cross pollination from insects, etc. after you have cross or self pollinated isn't a big issue. I've started hybridizing Daylilies and wondered if I had to protect a bloom from further pollination by insects.

Hi Brenda,

That zinnia probably didn't put out many pollen florets and hence not a lot of stigmas got fertilized. If I notice a situation like that developing with one of my favorite breeders, I hand self it with whatever pollen florets it does produce or, in the absence of pollen florets I will cross it with "similar" specimens.

By "deadheaded", do you mean that you removed the whole plant, thus "culling" it? Deadhead usually refers to removing spent blooms, and in your context that doesn't seem to fit.

Your photos indicate that you have a lot more zinnia space than I do, and that you grow a lot more zinnias than I do. I probably do more pollinating and cross-pollinating than you do. And I am working with the progeny of a couple of significant mutations. You can take advantage of your large zinnia population by carefully inspecting each zinnia bloom, looking for unusual characteristics or possible mutations.

I am attaching a photo of a recent specimen that had unusually small tubular petals.I have since exposed the stigmas on several of its tubular petals, so the bloom currently looks rather messy and nothing like that photo..

ZM

ZM

Most interesting specimen. Thanks for sharing. Keep up you great work (well some people would call it work). Such a pleasure for me to work with the zinnia. Yes, you do such intricate work with the zinnia and you are right I am not near that intricate with mine. Though - all the thousands of zinnia blooms I grow, I feel like I see every single bloom and always have my eye open for some something spectacular.

Here are some of the prettiest of my first bloomers this year - took photos this morn - It is good to be sharing zinnia photos again. Thanks for introducing me to the scabiosa type zinnia. These were my 2015 saved seed - the results of what I had worked with last year. These are quickly becoming a favorite.

To clarify - when I talked about deadheading - I was only taking the bloom away from the plant. Not quite ready (but probably will) pull some of the entire plants out. OUCH!

The last photo is my hubby tilling my Wetland Garden where the largest number of my zinnia will be planted. He just told me it is "Ready to Plant". Oh boy!

brenda, when he comes in from tilling, make sure you are playing the country song by Kenny Chesney "She Thinks My Tractor's Sexy"!

OH CUTE!

Wow, Brenda! Am I jealous! I was just happy my husband mowed the lawn yesterday! And those are very beautiful flowers. All from your seeds?

I'm raising my coffee cup and saying, "here's to great Husbands and great Zinnias"!

All my saved ZINNIA seed are on or in the ground as of about 8:45 last eve. It was just about too dark to see what I was doing, but I'm happy to say that I got them all in the ground. WHOP-PEE, now the wait is on. Should start having those beautiful blooms in about 2 months.

Hope everyone is having a very pleasant "Father's Day" ☺

Here! Here!
Looking forward to the zinnia show!

Loretta - As for my tidbit of the "Zinnia Show", the above mentioned Wetland Garden is my very last and the largest of 5 gardens that I am/have planted this year and I have zinnias in all 5 of the gardens. At present I have zinnia's blooming in 4 of the gardens. There was just something about planting the last zinnia seed Saturday night and not having any zinnia seed on hand. It will be like starting all over when it is time to special select my zinnia seed (for next year) from the gardens later this year. I always get all carried away (I like um ALL). Come October I'll be sharing flower seeds with the local garden club - I hope it will be a fun event for the members.

ZM - I have not heard much out of you lately. Actually I had trouble finding this thread. I know you must have some wonderful zinnia blooms to share.

I've just came in from my zinnia patches and these are the best of the best blossoms that I have right now from hybridizing and saved seeds. . Thought you could enjoy some of my creative work. Earlier in a prior post I mentioned that I had saved seed which I thought I could see an hint of blue. Well I don't think that's going to happen. So far - offspring of that one just looks to be purple and only of medium size.

I'm already excited about some of the sizes of my this years zinnia. The larger ones fascinate me and I'll definitely use them for hybridizing.

Well, I sure enjoyed your creative work Brenda! I like the color graduation on the last one.

All beautiful but I'm partial to the last one! Such beautiful colors! Do know the parents of this one?

Mipii & Loretta - Thanks for the feedback on that (color graduation as you mentioned) on that last zinnia photo. Glad you noticed! Sometimes the age of a bloom will give a little bit of a multi color, but that is a brand spanking new bloom. That was a real surprise and no I do not know the parents. I'm not the record keeper that ZM is. At present I'm watching a zinnia plant with such dark (blackish) buds that I can hardly wait for it to open up so I can drool over it.

Last eve I went popping ugly zinnia blooms off with my fingers and it was just before dark. If you have ever noticed, sometimes the bees like to hide/sleep under the zinnia blooms. Well I had went the full length of a couple rows popping heads here and there and had my hands full of spent tops and then all of a sudden there was something with all 6 legs grasped onto the end of my finger - I glanced down and it was one of those bees. I threw zinnia tops everywhere - and boy was I lucky not to get stung. Live and learn!

LOL Brenda, that was a harrowing experience I'm sure. I don't even like when Japanese Beetles hang onto my finger, man they can grip. Fortunately your Bee must have been sleepy.

My thought exactly - sleepy bee.

Hi Brenda,

I have been busy planting zinnias and chopping weeds. Our native grasses really try to take over. I have been doing succession planting and multi-tasking, so only a few of my zinnias are in bloom yet. I agree with you about big flower size being desirable. Many of my "exotic" zinnias tend to be a bit small, so I cross them with larger zinnias, hoping that recombination can keep the exotic look while making the bloom bigger.

The zinnias in your first, third, and fourth pictures have good uproll on their petals, which makes them good breeders. Your second picture has good size and petal form and something a bit different with its center. The zinnia in your last photo has great multicolor pastel blending and big size. Hopefully it will produce a lot of blooms and a lot of selfed seeds towards establishing it as a strain. It could produce variations on itself that would be equally desirable.

Your fourth zinnia shows that single zinnias can look good, and it has nicely "toothed" petal ends.I am getting toothed petal ends from a variety of sources, including crosses between my Razzle Dazzles and conventional zinnias. I saw a rain storm moving in this afternoon, so I hurriedly snapped a few photos before the storm hit. In my haste I accidentally got my camera set for day-date tagging, which I didn't intend to do. But at least the tags are accurate. I don't plan to do that on future pictures.

The winds from the storm were bobbing my zinnias around, and I tried to steady them with my left hand while holding the camera with my right hand. My thumb may show in some of those pictures.in today's series. The storm looked threatening, but yielded very little actual rain. The weathermen predict that we will get some heavy rains in the next few days. There might even be some rain on the Fourth. More later.

ZM

ZM - Glad you are back so we can share and critique zinnia shots. It's that time of year, especially for me (I expect zinnia blooms now and for at least 105 days). Baring wind & rain storms. I'll probably bore people with my zinnia. Oh but what FUN! Back to wind & rain - hope your yesterdays winds turned into more of a breeze and a nice rain, than an all out storm. If you are like us, you could probably use a little rain - just not heavy quantities. That should make the weeds grow - ☺. Your zinnia photo's did not look to be swaying at all when your pictures were taken. I must comment that your 2 pink zinnia in the above photo look like they consist of mini calla lilies (those tubulars). Of your yellow/orange zinnia above - you really have the toothed edges going on. And the tubular cactus - interesting.

You know I may still have some Mexican Zinnia seed. I just don't like those as well. It is almost like they are not zinnias. Since I still have a little bare spot in one of the gardens - I may have to stick a few of those seed in the ground and watch them grow and try hybridizing with a few of those.

All my other zinnia seed are in the ground and growing & blooming like crazy except for my last planting (the biggest planting) - they are just coming through the ground (not even a good stand last time I looked). They are calling for 60% chance of rain here Sunday - so I'll be playing stand off with the weeds in that newly planted area of mine.

Enjoy those zinnia and keep on sharing,

brenda

Hi Brenda,

I cranked my shutter speed up to 1/2000th on some of those. It was windy, and getting worse by the minute. I really should learn more about my camera -- I have several books on it. But we have impending heavy rain tomorrow and the next day, so I will try to get some more zinnias planted today.

With regard to the Mexican zinnias, the Whirligigs arose from interspecific crosses with them, and crosses with Whirligigs and larger zinnias can lead to some interesting results. I am attaching a picture from yesterday showing an example of that.

I so look forward to more messages and pictures from you. Your big zinnia grow-out has great potential. More later.

ZM

ZM,

Here's hoping you had great success getting the zinnia planted ahead of the rains. That is sure a good way to plant (ahead of rain). Were you planting plants or seed?

Interesting photo of the result zinnia from using the Mexican zinnia. The pink in that zinnia must have been picked up from whatever you were hybridizing with. I did go ahead and plant a few of the Mexican zinnia, as mentioned, since I had some space all worked and ready making it so easy for planting. Just a very small area.

I'll enclose a couple pictures of two of my gardens with rows of zinnias. The planting with the two rows (first two pictures - same) was planted 4/18/16 and has came along quite nicely. The single row is on higher ground and it is doing quite nicely. It has been raining here today and more rain is expected Sun & Mon. We were pretty dry, so that is a good thing.

I've been down checking the Wetland Garden planting that was done on the 18th of June and I must say it is coming along SLOW - maybe if we don't get heavy rains, just good moderate moisture, the germination and growth will progress a little faster.

Keep working with those zinnias,

brenda

Hi Brenda,

I did get a bed of Burpeeanas planted (using some old seeds) just before the rain hit. I was getting rained on as I took my tools to the garage. I think we have had the last of the rain for a while, so I will be "mudding in" some zinnia seeds today. I am posting a few of the June 30th pics again today. Your zinnias look well nourished and healthy. And, wow, you have a lot of them. That increases your chances of finding something good, so look them over closely. You might have an interesting mutant. I'm off to prepare a zinnia bed in the mud.

ZM.

I agree with ZM, your beds make me want to go out and nourish my own. I love your vistas Brenda!

ZM, you have the best mutants!

Rain & uncertain weather must be making it to Illinois as we are under a tornado watch until 10 p.m.. I was taking a nap when the weather radio went off about an hour ago, so ahead of the rain there was a couple things I really wanted to do. Heck with the nap, I jumped up and transplanted a few plants and did a little fertilizing ahead of the coming rain(s). I was sprinkled on, but that is pretty nice. Next I may go out with my camera and see what's new in the zinnia areas.

ZM - That first photo above of the coral/orange tubular zinnia is a real dandy - what a beautiful color. The # 3 photo looks like a scabiosa with the lower petal removed - interesting. As for mudding in seed - hum! Good luck with that.

Thanks Mipii for the great encouraging words. I guess we encourage each other - That's a GOOD thing.