We're looking at keeping a small flock, just for the two of us. If we can find someone willing to slaughter, we'll have dual-purpose meat & egg chickens. I'm willing to learn how to clean & pluck, but I don't think either of us can butcher!
I've read some about keeping chickens and of course there's always the "to keep your chickens laying during the winter" feed this much and keep the lights on so many hours a day section. I'm wondering if free-range chickens can find enough to eat without supplemental feeding, and forget how many eggs they lay (if any) for the winter months. We have 4 acres, most of it moderately to lightly forested. Our goal is to produce what we can on our place, using only what we have here if at all possible.
Would love to hear from anyone who has experience or knows someone who tries to run their flock this way. Want to know what we're getting into before we jump!!
Thanks.
Free-range chickens & supplemental feeding
I don't think you can count on most egg producing breeds to survive and lay eggs without supplemental feeding--although the more they free-range the less you will have to feed. I think it is possible to grow and store a lot of the feed they need yourself--but that is if you have the land and water to do it.
I'm sure there are those out there who have given this a lot of thought--maybe in the Homesteading forum?
hi, great questions! if you aren't concerned about their winter egg production, then you should consider a bird for its winter hardiness and meat production. which breed/breeds you want should be the first consideration.
for lighting, you need to start them on 12/12 by about three weeks of age. then when they are laying, they ned 14 hours of daylight, so a light bulb to extend the evening light till you turn it off [or use a timer] works finr. or just go au naturale like you said, and let them take it easy during the winter months.
check out a farmer's seed catalog, like from Seeds of Change. you can get bulk seed for fall winte rand spring grasses and legumes. they could free range on that or any grasses. but when winter is so cold that there are no bugs, then you might want to consider vermiposting to grow worms, or grow mealy worms, or grow fly maggots in a bucket. consider though that even flies can be scarce during winter months.
sinc eyou only mean a few, you coudl have some fenced garden plots for them to scartch in when you aren't using it, even plant clover or winter rye or maize. yes, you can feed them without outsourcing their feed. something i am working towards. i got the chickens before the wheat seed LOL. oh, there is another good cool weather green, wheat. and any slad mixes with cold hardy plants and herbs....
now consider that for meat purposes, a good natural slow growing bird will be four to seven months old before filled out. so plan on purchasing chicks on a regular basis to supply your meat, or...
get some fertile eggs and start hatching...
also, watch on craigs list, freecycle, or backyard chickens for free roos to good homes. as long as people understand they will eventually be humanely slaughtered for food purposes...
you coudl also get a breed who hatches out their own well. or have one or two bantam hens for that purpose.
remember, to be sustainable, you have to plan ahead to keep the circle foing. did you know there is a sustainable alternatives forum here? and homesteading and farm life and frugal living.... and at this site there is good info on homesteading with chickens, including the butchering and preparing process...
www.themodernhomestead.us
tf
wow heaps of of info tamara and MzWeazelle when you say small do you mean first timer small lik 4 or sumthin or do u mean DGer (Daves Gardener) small which is lik 30 sumthin
Where you are (zone 8a) it might be temperate enough for them to forage most of the winter, with some supplemental feeding, but you will know that better than anyone else. How cold are your winters?
What we found was that by not keeping the hens laying heavy through the winter, they seemed to lay almost as well the 2nd and 3rd year as they did the first. My guess is that allowing them that break (and they still did lay, just not very often) kept them from burning out too quick. I didn't keep records so I can't really give numbers. And they would go through a normal molting cycle too.
only my black-sex links and austrlorps lay through the winter
So much info!! Okay, so let's brain-storm. :-)
First of all, I intend to start small -- say 5 or 6 hens. No rooster until / unless we decide to go for meat production. If that happens then we'll have to increase the numbers to get both meat & eggs. My goal is to have good production during the warmer months and find ways to store eggs for the winter when laying stops.
Second, our climate is more wet than cold, but we do have some stretches of nights every year that fall well below freezing, though rarely below 20. You'd think we'd run out of bugs at those temps, but they always seem to be hanging around the front door anyway. The suggestions for supplemental feeding sources that we can grow on the property are great! They could make the difference between success and failure.
So any suggestions for breed choice? I'd like something hardy, but I'd also prefer one of the friendlier sorts, and of course I'd like to keep the options open for meat as well as eggs.
Yes, I've looked through a lot of the other posts and forums, but there's so much out there that sometimes I just have to go back and ask questions that others have already covered. I'm not getting any younger here. lol.
Thanks again for everything that's been offered already.
Marans are suppose to be good dual purpose birds for wet climates. There is another breed, the Marsh Daisy, that does well in marshy ground--but it seems to be very rare in the US. It lays white eggs.
Just stay away from feather legged/footed birds and, I think, crested (but I could be wrong about the latter).
u mean sumthin lik cochins and stuff like that
No feather legged birds because of the wet weather? They're more prone to infections or something because of the feathers meeting the ground?
i think they [feather feet] would just be messy. brahmas not so bad as cochins...
my ideal bird is the Buckeye. pea combed, heavily feathered. roosts low, a true Buckeye can't fly over four feet. ready for meat at 6 months, starts laying around five months. nice xlarge brown eggs. incredibly friendly. good mothers. excellent foragers of their own food. even the roos are docile. i could go on. they were my first chicken along with the brown leghorns. i have tons of breeds now [dont' ask LOL] and these are still the best as far as i am concerned.
saving eggs the first year will be easy. if you have six hens you will get three dozen a week, till cold weather hits, then only maybe two dozen a week. wash them properly and store immediately at 40 degrees or a little lower, and they will keep for months.
you will also love the thick shells. and the bright but dark yolks. and those whites that stand up on their own...
tf
I just keep reading that feather footed birds need especially clean, dry conditions and are more prone (harder to observe) to external parasites. The only one I have is Riley, my Silkie, and he does have a hard time with his big feathery feet in the dewy grass or if he steps in something nasty. He looks astonished, picks up a big foot, stares at it and starts cleaning away. Such a funny guy!
lol sounds funny
my favourite chicken is the bearded belgium d'uccle here is a pic from feathersite
http://www.feathersite.com/Poultry/CGK/Millies/BRKMilleFleur.html
This message was edited Jul 16, 2008 11:02 AM
oh dear, i have been there, what a lovely chicken.... got any yet? why is it our favorite is the one we don't have YET...
no i dont have it yet :( but somday i will:)
Oh, those Buckeyes sound great! Looked up some info and I think they'd be hard to beat for our purposes. Articles also said there aren't many of them around, so any new flock keeper would help boost the breed. :-)
My first chickens back in the day were Danish Brown Leghorns and the Bearded Belgium D' Uccles : ) I love them. Pretty little birds. I have a few hens now (of course), and they are dolls!
i love my Buckeyes! they are the BEST! this is my youngest Buckeye chick, Spunky Monkey [named after a flower, mother is Purple Petunia, roo is Best, they are prize winners]... two older siblings, Applesauce and TinyTwo, just started laying at 15 weeks...
here is another shot of Spunky...
if you care to join the ALBC, perhaps you can find some sources for Buckeyes...
www.albc-usa.org
here are my sister broodies, yes raising 16 chicks out of my incubator! Pansy and Apple...
and Spunky Monkey's baby picture... doens't this just make you want baby chicks, NOW...
i could go on about my Buckeye's but it is up to you and if you can find some good ones...
best of luck to you. don't get lost in all this chicken info LOL
tf
oh your lucky tamara with all those chicks
I've wanted chickens NOW ever since we moved here nearly three years ago. LOL
I'm going to keep on learning and hoping that we can start doing soon. Any more thoughts on good home-grown food sources are welcome, although there are sure plenty here already! Many thanks.
i am sure you have read ab out the mealworms to grow & freeze for winter, & the fly trap bucket...
you can only learn & prepare so much, then you just gotta DO IT!
I don't have a Buckeye yet TF ; P You are making want one.....Stop it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YEA tell me about it. Maybe I will get one ..............one day.
one dqay i will have enough to share!
that is what I ment by one day he he he
LOL
Check out growgrubs.com for info on raising Biogrubs for your chickens.
These are from the Black soldier fly larvea (BSF)
My favorite dual purpose breed is the Dark Cornish, I just love em, fast growers, very hardy, and good brown egg layers too.
how long dose it tak them to mature??
There isn't a chicken breed around that doesn't enjoy playing in the sprinklers or water or damp weather. They all "LOVE" damp weather. Just remember where all breeds of chickens originate .... THAILAND ..... think jungle fowl.
Sounds like you want your cake and to eat it; as far as a having sustainable flock for 2 people ... doesn't look like a well thought out plan to be honest. However .... the cheapest poultry to keep are the breeds that range. Guinea Fowl and Game Fowl are IT. I sound like a broken record .... but if your birds range .... you'd better make sure they can fly .... that leaves out ALL of the fat piggy type breeds (sorry but the breeds everyone suggest the most often are the least able to fend for themselves). GAME FOWL and Guinea Fowl do the best on their own ..... that's why so many folks find them wandering into their yard from somewhere else. You can encourage them to stay closer by feeding them and providing modest shelter. They reproduce like rabbits and lay well in the spring and summer. If you eat their eggs .... it obviously reduces the number of chicks that might hatch. They are absolutely beautiful in appearance. They fight like crazy in the spring. You'll need maybe 2-3 roos and the rest should be frozen. Finding someone to do your dirty work ... good luck. Most places charge $3-4 a bird or the value of the bird ...doesn't justify the outsourcing.
Hi MzWeazelle! There are a lot of heritage breeds that are considered good foragers--most chickens had to forage in the past. Barred and Cuckoo colored birds are suppose to be somewhat less prone to aerial predation. Dominique sound like they might be a good choice--they are reported to be friendly--are extremely good foragers and egg layers.
You won't know how big a problem predators are until you try. I think if you habituate them to roosting in a secure coop at night you'll go a long way to keeping them safe--or you can do a modified chicken tractor and move them through the woods in greater safety.
Penedesenca are suppose to be incredible under free range conditions--and they lay those super dark eggs! Being Mediterranean they are not as docile, but I would try them if I had the space.
I think, given you modest needs, you can try a lot of different strategies with great success--then let us all know how you did it!
We do plan to provide a good secure coop, water and what ever heat, etc that they need in our area. But we also want to raise them naturally and with as little ongoing cash expense as possible. That's why we're looking for ways to produce what they need right here on our property. It may not be reasonable, and we'll have to accept that if it turns out that way! Just trying to do as much homework as possible. :-)
Thanks again for all the input. Anything anyone has to add will be appreciated.
What Carol Ekarius actually says about Penedesenca in "Storey's Illustrated Guide to Poultry Breeds" is:
"Penedescencas are good free-range birds that can find most of their own fare during the spring, summer and fall. Hens will go broody. They produce high-quality meat for a layer breed."
She doesn't say that about any other breed--although she does say that "Welsummers are purported to be one of the top free-range foragers of all the layers". I have a Welsummer and she is laying well--of course in my case being free-range involves wandering around my quarter acre backyard. I will say however, that since summer and letting them free range they have really dropped off in layer pellet consumption.
Buckeyes are also good foragers (so don't get mad at me tf!):0).
my best layers are probably my black-sex links followed by my austrlorps
Catscan, I haven't found that even with free ranging part of the day, ours have not lowered their consumption of layer feed. I guess my girls are just spoiled. They won't stay out of their coop (yard) for longer than a couple hours. They like to get out and the next thing you know they are back in the coop. And, we have both open grass and woods, so they have no reason to prefer the coop, but they do.
GG
Hi granny! I think I am lucking out because my girls hate the pellets--I wish I had been able to start them on something larger than mash--they will eat pellets, but only if they must and there is so much windfall fruit and concurrent bugs in my yard that they are avoiding my well planned diet for them:0) Oh the benefits and failures of being an untidy gardener!
No windfall fruit, but plenty bugs here, but still they prefer the coop, it seems.
GG
Mine don't care whether it is layer mash or pellets. They still scatter it on the floor of the coop. We even changed the feeder we were using for a deeper one but they must take their beaks and flip the feed to the side to get it out of the feeder and on the floor. They do eat some of it there, but mostly it gets swept outside for them to get to it there. Oh well, (sigh). Letting nature take its course.
GG