How to recognize the symptoms of ETSSS

1lisac,
I stand corrected. The tomatoes I identified above as being new varieties developed by the Dwarf Tomato Project are not from that “Project”. Those varieties were purchased from TomatoFest.com and are varieties small enough to be grown in containers.

What I should have listed were tomato seeds I purchased from HeritageTomatoSeed.com that did come from the “Project":

Dwarf Sweet Sue, Iditarod Red, Perth Pride and (freebie) Sleeping Lady

My interest in smaller varieties of tomatoes was sparked when I realized that I didn’t have space in my raised beds to grow as many different varieties as I had hoped so I went looking for varieties that I could grow in containers.

drthor,
Here is my idea of a dream tomato:

. Red Robin Heirloom
Red Robin #6010 (30 seeds) This popular dwarf variety of cherry tomato thrives in relatively small pots or hanging baskets set on sunny windowsills or outdoor patios. Plants only become 8 to 12 in. tall and bear masses of 1-1/4 inch full-flavored tomatoes with a touch of sweetness. It is a very rewarding harvest from a small tomato plant that can be grown in an 8-inch pot. Determinate 55 days

That is sooooooooo adorable!

Wow, is that your photo of Red Robin, hrp50? That looks as if you could carry it around with and munch on the ripe toms as you wander about the rest of your garden. Sort of like one of those little dogs Paris Hilton carries around. Only much cuter...

terri_emory
I wish I could claim the Red Robins as my own but the picture came from the seed company's web site. I just planted my Red Robin seeds today but I'm hoping to post a picture of my own sometime in about three months.

Cool!

hrp50
wow... I look forward to hear all about that variety !

Tomatoes are growing great. The tallest are 6" now.
All the 31 varieties that I planted did germinate.
Thick stem and second set of true leaves already.
Tomorrow or Saturday (fruit days) I will re-pot each one on a 4" pot ... and decapitate the one I don't need ... ouch ...
I will lower down the plant to the pot , leaving only the upper leaves to show. In this way the long stem will produce more roots.

I'll finally be starting my tomato seeds this weekend. I haven't really finalized the line up for this spring yet. I guess I'll post my list once I plant the seeds. Also probably start a few peppers and eggplants just to get going. For sure Turkey Chomp, Livingston's Favorite, Orange Heirloom, Livingston's Giant Oxheart, Golden Bison, Livingston's Dwarf Stone, and the paste and determinates. DH wants me to go heavy on the tomatoes this year as last year he feels I shared too many with the neighbors and fellows at work. So this year he wants more for him ☺

I'm actually glad I waited this long as I look at drthor's photos. Don't get me wrong--they are lovely photos, but I want to plant them. My finger are just itching to get out there and dig! 6" is about when I would be wanting to harden them off and plant them. So, for me, waiting a bit should work out. Keeping in mind that in my garden I'm not just dodging frost and late freezes. I'm also dealing with constant, shifting winds, and some pretty nasty wind gusts that last all spring.

Terri,
I'm learning here, too. Next time, I'll use fewer pots to sow the seeds in, and space them out more in each pot. Not so much root entanglement that way, before potting up. Oh, and I'll definitely remember to change out to new fluorescent light tubes!!!

I started my seeds early to get my very-long-season beefsteak transplants in the ground by mid-February, since most will need at least 80-105 dtms. I'm targeting the end of June for my final harvest, and ripping the tomato plant out after that. Our brutal Texas heat, the stinkbugs and aphids just make it not-so-nice to struggle to keep tomatoes going past then.

I'll start learning about what ELSE I can play with in the summertime garden. But, it won't be tomatoes past June!

Linda

Terri_emory,
we also have very high wind here in my area.
I live on the highest point in the Dallas area.
The perforated plastic always save my tender plants from the wind.

For some reason this year the wind has been missing. Normally it is very high in the fall and at this time of the year.
I hope it will stay this way.

Good luck with your tomatoes.

The seedling's roots are so small that at this point there is really not "root entanglement". Those babies are only 17 days old.
I used a 4" pot for each variety ... it is so much easier to control germination.

Plant LONG BEANS during the summer. I really did enjoy them last year and they did survive our 100 F heat!
Love the red ones better (because I can see them): http://rareseeds.com/vegetablesa-c/beans/long-beans.html

I suppose I will chime in since I also have ETSSS......I started first batch of 72 on Jan 1, and the second batch of 72 on Jan, 11.

Photo #!
First batch of 72 ready to up-pot to 4" post
Photo #2
Close up of plant ready for up-pot
Photo #3
I pull plant out of cell w/ a pair of tweezers. This is one reason I like the plugs. The entire plant comes out of the cell effortlessly w/out root damage. The roots just hang down the bottom of the plug.
Photo #4
I place the plug w/ plant into the 4" pot. The plug is small enough that I can bury the seedling deep into the 4" pot all the way up to the cotyledon leaves. This helps allow the stem to grow thick, and not at all leggy.
Photo #5
Final up-potted Costoluto Fiorentino tomato plant.. I post this not as a look at me type post. I post it because in the past I had problems w/ starting my own seedlings using jiffy mix type seed starting soil. I have found that these plugs are very easy to use for me, and I thought I would pass along to others that my be somewhat intimated starting their seedlings.






This message was edited Jan 21, 2013 10:14 AM

This message was edited Jan 21, 2013 10:16 AM

Looks great Horn. When you say you pull the plant out of the cell, you mean plug and all, right?

I've actually procrastinated this year! Call Ripleys! (or 911 - what is wrong with me?!) I am getting ready to order my seeds. I lean towards heirlooms - for some reason, I find the hybrids have thicker skins, and I can't chew them! If any of you can help guide me - I already have Anna Russian seeds that I saved from last year, and a large Black Russian is on my list of wants. BUT - I am looking for a good heirloom(s) for making canning Salsa and canning Tomato Sauce. Those will most likely be different ones, but that is ok. Any suggestions? Also, What are your favorite sites to order from, for heirloom seeds? (I am also going to order heirloom pepper seeds).

Ester Hess might be good for salsa , more like a salad dressing taste ,not spicy.. Plus the plant tolerates some cooler overcast temps , I don't know if that is a plus or not though where you are anymore..
It is an heirloom and takes good soil , I can send you a couple of seeds if you want to try . It is not impressive only a good solid plant...

Yes, Lisa. The root is woven through the cell, and you lift the whole thing for Potting up or transplanting.

The cell is biodegradeable.

Do you mean the root is woven through the plug and the plug is biodegradable? Aren't the cells plastic and reusable?

No, the plugs are like spongey peat.

They're not reusable. Each plug is about $.08. I got 72 plugs for $12 plus shipping from a supplier in Austin.

The plugs are really great for starting the seedlings. The roots get lots of oxygen through the pores of the plugs. You save a whole lot of $$ on Potting mix in the beginning. You only have to have the Potting mix to pot up.

Some larger plugs would allow you to transplant the seedlings without Potting up.

This message was edited Jan 21, 2013 11:05 PM

I can get the supplies to "make your own cells" at a nursery not to far from me. I buy these plastic flats that have the small cells, and fill them with seed starting mix. That seems to work, and I can reuse the supplies until the plastic breaks down. Very cost effective.

In keeping with the "early" theme, I potted up some of my seedlings to drinking water bottles.

And, instead of going back under lights, they're going to start having field trips outside. Every day and night above 48° will find them getting used to the great tomato garden.

Plant out is set for mid-February.

Frees up LOTS of space for the bell peppers, eggplants and okras!


This message was edited Jan 22, 2013 10:46 AM

A pic.

I recycle lots of plastic items to use - yogurt cups, sour cream and cottage cheese containers...... Why buy if they're free?!

Oh I thought those were the plugs and each plug went in a cell. Horn wrote that each plant comes out of the cell...I think I'm only making it more confusing.lol

Lisa,
I edited my post. Seedlings grow in the plugs, which sit in the tray cells.

And the plugs are biodegradable. I got it, thank you. I read it so many times I didn't know if I was coming or going. Lol sheesh.

Well check back later ,, there might really be two or three of you doing both!!!! lol Each one, with control of one eye for reading!!!!
Would make it handy for cleaning and gardening and planting though wouldn't it!! zoom!!!

1lisac....yes plug, and all............I have not heard from you in a while.....How is it in the cold country? The plugs are made from biodegradable tree bark. They have the consistency of a sponge,

This message was edited Jan 22, 2013 7:23 AM

It's cold up here. Lol trying to gear up for planting season, but other things keep getting in the way. It looks like you are well on your way.

the way I do mine, without those plug thingies, is scoop the seedlings, including the germination soil, with a spoon. I have never cared for those biodegradable things - in fact, if I buy a plant that is in one, I peel them off first before planting. They don't seem to break down fast enough for me, and the plant roots don't get to spread out fast enough. Maybe it's my soil? I dunno!

The ihort plugs aren't the the peat pots that you peel away. Horn has another thread going that explains them in full. He used them last year, with great success, so some of us are familiar with them. They work so well for him and there is no mess and they are not very expensive.

Horn did you add any amendments? I seem to remember last year that you did.

I just don't choose to use those kind - and that is why I peel them away.

Lisa you have a good memory.........yes I water my seedlings with rain water mixed with some mycorrhizae powder.

Karrie20x......it would be difficult to "peel away" the plant from the plug w/out killing the plant.....see pic. You must be thinking of Jiffy Mix plugs wrapped w/ netting. I have also tried those, and do not like them either

I'm "recovering" from ETSSS! Learned the hard way that packing your spare bedroom grow light stand with too many tomato seedlings too early in the season just means wasted $$$. I'll be seeding mine in a couple of days with the target garden planting date by the 2nd week in March; the seedlings will be 5-6 weeks old and just the right size to transplant with less shock and delay. Mine are small fruited indeterminate types that will keep going into the heat of summer (better be...this summer is projected to be hotter than usual, whatever that is these days).

I seed mine in flats, then into deep cells then into tall coffee cups to grow on...

This message was edited Jan 23, 2013 1:28 PM

Sassy,
You've got those rows down to a science! WOW!

I'm only potting up once this season. After potting up 208 tomatoes TWICE last season, uh, uh...nope...nada...nunca...ain't gonna happen...

So, I've gone from 4" square pots to cut off drinking water bottles. Next stop, the patio for in and out hardening off for the next 4 weeks. Plant out is February 16th.

I‘m potting up some of my tomato seedlings and I'm trying something new this year. I'm sprinkling mycorrhizae fungi granules (Plant Success brand), plus some dried molasses granules to feed the mycorrhizae, into the Roots Organic potting mix. I’ve had great success using Plant Success outside in my raised beds as it produces a huge root system. When I water the newly potted seedlings I water it with distilled water (due to the high salt content of our tap water) mixed with Garrett Juice Plus (1.5 – 2.2 - 1.5) which contains compost tea, molasses, liquid seaweed, apple cider vinegar, and hydrolyzed fish. I think I’ve covered all of my bases for providing the seedlings with what they need to grow a good root system so now I’ll have to wait a few weeks until plant-out time to see how it worked.

The first picture shows one of the tomato seedlings I’m about to pot up, the size and root system. The second picture is 1 of 12 tomato seedlings potted up into 16 oz. clear plastic cups with five holes drilled in the bottom of each cup for drainage. I hope that I will be able to observe the growth of the root systems through the clear plastic cups

Hrp50,
I'll be watching your progress. Just a bit concerned that you're adding an awful lot of amendments to the RO, that's already quite filled with plant steroids. I'd start with just a few seedlings, just in case you've created nutrient overload.

I just potted up 50 seedlings from the RO I sowed the seeds in, to drinking water bottles with brand new RO, and, I kept the spent RO from the seed trays. I was thinking I'm going to need to beef it up if I plan on using it over again to root my bell peppers and eggplants.

I may just go ahead with your formula, since I'm pretty sure the tomato seedlings sucked out a good bit of the nutrients that came in the fresh RO.

Where do you get the mycorrhizae (Plant Success brand), and the Garrett Juice? How much do you mix into the RO?

Linda

hrp50
your tomato looks so good.
THANK YOU for remind me of mycorrhizae fungi granules !!!
I always add 1tbsp when I transplant my tomatoes outside. I might have forgotten if you didn't mention it !!

We all gotta keep each other straight- so many spring chores to do it's hard to remember them all!

Gymgirl,
I forgot to mention that I potted up my tomato seedlings with new RO and will dump the leftover in the peat pots into my raised beds
.
My only concern is that I might be using too much molasses since I discovered that it is also an ingredient in Garrett Juice Plus. Even though I frequently criticize Howard Garrett for some of his wacky ideas, I may call in to his radio program this weekend and ask if I'm using too much molasses and how it might harm my seedlings.

Plant Success I buy on amazon.com (2 lb. canister, also comes in 1 lb.) since I can get free two-day shipping and pay no sales tax. Garrett Juice Plus I buy at my local Man's Best Friend since they sell it for a little less than local nurseries plus I get a 10% discount since I had my dog trained there. I buy the 1 gallon size that is not usually carried in stores but they can get it in a few days of ordering it. I sprinkle the Plant Success in the bottom of the hole where the roots are going and top dress it with a little more. The Garrett Juice Plus concentrate I mix with distilled water according to the label instructions and use it as a soil drench.

drthor
Some times I'm glad to have a cheap digital camera, otherwise you would be able to see in the pictures below about 12 small dead tomato seedlings that didn't get enough water while I was out of town for a few days.