Plant propagation... the basics II

Hello to everyone and welcome:

I opened this because I feel that folks need a place to go to ask any question without feeling like its a dumb question. There are no dumb questions, only the ones we fail to ask. It was brought to my attention that some specific threads wont answer basic questions. why I can only speculate. I want anyone to feel like they can ask the question even if they can't put it into a simple question... so ask away...Admin would like specific plant inquiries to open a thread like "boxwood". I will try to address any questions you might have and those who have an idea please jump in. I don't have all the answers but I will try to find one for you as much as I can.

We came from here:http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1188555/

Our fireside chat on the group we gathered along the way are now posting general chat stuff we started here http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1211970/

and are now on the latest version here http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1231067/

As with all of the threads I stat I like to welcome anyone new to our little corner of Daves Garden. Please take the time to read all the past threads. Most of them have some great information in them. There are no dumb questions except for the 1 thats never asked.

Anyone new I highly recomend reading the propagation how to 1/4 of the way down the first incarnation of this thread.we have evolved to a mix of good people having fun and discussing issues we are having at the moment. if you need individualhelp just dmail me I am always glad to help.

Here is the 1st post http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/892721/

I look forward to some spirited conversation but as mother nature has decided to be nasty this year any troubles can be discussed here to help solve your current plant issues.

The pic is of a tropical hibiscus Kona double pink.

thank you for the intrest and welcome
Dave

Gotcha Dave. Love that flower. Jeanette

Let the questions begin.

Woo Hoo ! That was fun.
I thought the purpose of the peroxide was just to add oxygen. Does it do anything else too?

ibartoo, I don't know if peroxide does anything else to the soil, but I wonder if seeds need carbon dioxide like adult plants require. People have had success growing them in closed containers, so maybe they don't need it.

I would like to propagate seeds in mud and maybe adding peroxide will aerate the mud. I was also thinking of increasing air circulation by adding perlite, charcoal or scoria (lava sand). Does anyone have any information about which of those ingredients would be best for a muddy growing medium or should I just forget it and propagate seedlings in pots first?

DoGooder

The peroxide keeps diseases etc. from forming. molds, etc.

Peroxide slows formation algae when rooting something in water. I add it to floral bouquets.

Dave, I am here but it felt like a ride similar to the one on the road to Hana. Sharon

Jnette and WormsLoveSharon, thanks! I will definitely add peroxide to all my seeds and transplants next year.

DoGooder

Dogooder, I don't think I would try propagating in mud. Seedlings like to be moist, but not consistently wet. Have you tried the baggie method that I use? It has worked miracles for me.
Thanks Jnette and Sharon. I knew the h2o2 did more than add o2.

ibartoo, that makes sense. However, I will experiment with a small amount of seeds on the mud and the rest I will propagate in containers. I've never tried the baggie method, but I saved a copy of the Dino baggie method from another thread and I will try that and hopefully most of my seeds will turn into plants.

DoGooder

DoGo::

Why do you want to try to start seeds in mud?

I think you run the risk of losing all of them to rot as soon as they sprout.

Just sayin'.

A.

AmandaEsq, there are some muddy areas where I would like to grow swamp-tolerant plants. I'm thinking of planting a carex species such as Lemon Zest.

DoGooder

I worked at Environmental Concerns, Inc. nursery.

http://www.wetland.org/nursery_home.htm

We propagated over 120 types of North American native wetland plants.

Muddy soil is not the way to go. Wetland plants have an obligate, faculative, upland status, etc. Often are dependent on regular or complete innundation, but tides and water levels change. Seeds are dependent on oxygen and fast draining soil to sprout and thrive.

We thousands of trays a week of certain carex and scirpus and spartina species for use in environmental restoration projects around the Chesapeake Bay. We made our own soil-less mix. 2 parts pine bark fines and 1 part sand.

The seeds were mixed with sand for more even distribution and moisture control atop the potting mix.

The seeded trays were placed in raised beds lined with heavy black plastic that were filled with water but not so much so as to submerge the seed trays. The water levels were maintained according to the wetland status of the particular species being propagated.

Seed trays were maintained in cold frames in this way until they sprouted.

Based on my experience I feel strongly that you will regret the results of trying to start seeds in muddy water.

A.

AmandaEsq, thanks for the information about how to propagate bog plants! I guess in a natural bog environment seeds propagate during drier times which would be ideal and then it's the older plants that can tolerate the increased water in the soil at later times such as after a flood.

DoGooder

Amanda, I just skimmed thru your answer to Dgooder. What do you suggest he/she do with the mud? Sorry if you already answered and I missed it.

Jnette,

Just an FYI I'm a woman.

DoGooder

Holy CROW Jeanette!

Would you like me to re-post? :P

I said not to plant seeds in mud. I guess I did run on.

A.

LOL, to you both. Jeanette

Thanks Dgooder.

Never know with a handle like that.

This message was edited Dec 22, 2011 9:26 PM

Good Morning all. - Amanda invited me to the Propagation forum and I have been lurking when I have time. Seems this time of year is almost as hectic as the gardening season.

DoGooder - I do have bog plants and nothing much in my bog starts by seed. I really think I would try to start your seeds separately and then when they have taken, plant them into your boggy areas. What types of seeds do you have that you want to start? I would be interested in looking at your list.

Oh - one thing I neglected to mention, my bogs are not mud based but pea gravel. Truthfully I would think pea gravel would be a better medium for seeds to take hold and I don't see alot of that in my bogs.





This message was edited Dec 24, 2011 11:10 AM

Merry christmas.
All plants need some sort of exchange of oxygen just some more than others. Bog plants do get their oxygen from above ground/water sources as well as from the airspaces within the soil structure. the tides flush out the old and bring in new water for the spaces to replenish their available oxygen. I hope this makes sense. I am glad there are more experienced bog growers on here to answer the question better than I can.

I wish everyone a happy and safe get together this christnas
Dave

Oooo Carolyn - what a pretty flower. Glad you made it. Don't miss the fireside chat where all the bruisers hang out. :)

Hope everyone is taking some time to enjoy themselves and relaaaaxxx.

xoox

Hi Carolyn, a friend of Amanda's is a friend of all of us. Welcome to the propagation thread that Dave runs with an iron fist. LOL, he is very knowledgeable and we all join in. So feel free to add anything you can. Jen (what JB has dubbed me)

JB has dubbed you with other, less appropriate names. :D

LOL, you are right Amanda. A lot of times too.

Carolyn22, thanks for telling me that you have seen the poor effects of seed propagation in bog mud. It helped me realize that container propagation is the best method. I haven’t bought seeds yet, but I’m considering planting Japanese rush (Acorus gramineus) and Lemon Zest (Carex, siderosticha) in the mud after they have grown about 3 inches high; and Cinnamon fern and witch hazel plants in drier areas bordering the muddy areas.

Pughbear7, thanks for explaining that bog plants get oxygen from their stems and leaves as well as the roots. The bog where I want to plant has more than 6 inches of leaf and pine needle mulch in some areas and I wonder if that would suffocate plants that need aeration above ground. I could watch the area and clear the extra mulch in autumn.

Thanks again everyone for all your help! Happy Holidays!

DoGooder

Better late than never, I took the long way. Sorry. You all make me so envious sewing your seeds, since I can not sew seeds that grow into anything except two inch skinny stems and then they die. No excuses...I just do not have time or patience to care for them. If they can not adjust to my GH, then go ahead and die. But, on the other hand, when they die, I feel so sad, because they are living things that I started and it is my fault. Go figure. What else is there to do but NOT to start anymore seeds. So. I am out of that topic.

I do have some luck with the camellia cuttings I took last Fall. I need to go to the GH tomorrow , not today, I am still recovering from a pulled muscle, and see what is left that has not died since I have been unable to do much out there other than a quick watering every few days. It just hurt too much to walk out there and stand to work. I have scheduled Thurs. with my girl who works for me to be GH day. I do hope we find some really nice surprises. I ahve camellias bloom now from the stock plants. Pink and Red both. They are great plants. That nasty scale they get each year showed up a week or so ago and I was able to get rid of most of it, but I saw this morning there is still some on the one. It seems they only infest the red one. Not sure why.

Have a great day guys and gals. Dave, Honey, I miss you. I think of you so often and worry you are in pain. Tell Kim to give you a big hug for me. Love you all. JB

Hi everyone... checking in... I'm learning a lot about the current topic...

Hope everyone had a wonderful holiday.... have to go back to work tomorrow... bummer, bummer and bummer... -:) vacation always seems to fly by.

I picked up some lady slipper seeds recently from a DG-er and I've been thinking about planting them now... anyone know anything about starting these plants from seed? I'm afraid our quick, hot spring to summer jump would kill any seedlings I start in spring, so I was thinking about trying now.... any thoughts? Nancy

I sowed some last week and I am going to sow some more later in the week or next week. I just scatter them where I think I want them and then just thin out if they are where I do not want them.

I have some seeds to send to Linda and Dawn. Has anyone heard from Dawn. Also bulbs for JB and Dave. I just need to make sure the bulbs are pest and disease free. Lee, I will send you more bulbs and hardy hibiscus when you thaw out.

I have a progressive dinner tonight. We are suppose to be there at 6pm ad Vern just decided to go upstairs. MEN.

All is well. I have an echo on Thursday and then see the Cardiologist. Love to you all. Sharon.

Sharon, let us know how the test comes out. Good luck. Jen

Will pray your test comes out well Shar. I will gladly take seeds. I am starting to outdoor sow. Will wait a bit for WS. I have my breadseed poppies to put out now and put several others out too including my Tripple purple/wht Daturas.

Sharon - best of luck to you. Please know you are in my prayers.

I sowed my poppies, columbine and larkspur. I have some pansy seeds that I was thinking of sowing out in the garden - any thoughts as to whether they should do better just scattering in the garden or wintersowing?

That's interesting Carolyn 'cause you and I are both in zones 5. Do you have any snow, etc.? We do and the ground is frozen solid. But the next couple of days are suppose to be in the 40s!!!! Amazing.

Do you sow direct? Or in containers? Your poppies.

Oh oh, Just dawned on me that JB is going to say we the Wild West ones are on here now. Amanda, you better get on here to save our reputation. Yeah, she calls us all kinds of names.

Sharon ~ Good luck with all of your tests. I will be sending you prayers and good wishes.

It is a miracle that I can even get on the internet at all. My husband has an old Toshiba laptop with Win98 on it, so if any of you have sent me an email lately, I cannot get it here. If we have time tomorrow, I will try and log on at the library using their wireless high speed and check emails. I was (finally) on the phone with HP for over 4 hours for the desktop. There are no words to describe my experience, here, anyway! GRRRR!!!! I have a lot of patience except for when I get taken. We'll see what happens as a result of my complaints.

Tomorrow we visit with number one granddaughter. Then shopping and if time, the library.

If anyone wants to contact me, please d-mail for faster results.

HAPPY NEW YEAR, EVERYONE!! ^_^

Jen

I scattered the poppy seeds back in November. I had read somewhere that was the time to do it. I also saved out some seed to ws....

We don't have any snow yet. I would be just as happy if it continued that way, but I am probably in dream land again. The ground is not frozen yet. We have had a very mild December - we will see what January brings.

It's been a very mild winter here too, so far. Last year, however, was fierce all the way to June. I can't believe that we haven't had but a light dusting of snow so far. Nothing sigificant as of now.

Someone on DG from TX posted that they had snow all day on Christmas. Funny.

Carolyn I have heard from various DGrs that they scatter poppy seeds in the fall for spring blooms. I think maybe Patti (Crit) was the first one to say . . . I have always wanted orange California poppies but have been disappointed with results when I wintersow in milk jugs or even in spring in flats. They get so skinny and spindly. :/

I prolly gave them all away too. I was going to try them again doing what you have done. I'm glad I'm not the only one itching to get out there and start sowing!!!

A.

p.s. Sharon - I know you'll have flying colors.

Evelyn - technology is a beautiful thing . . . when it works!!!

Amanda, I have California poppy seeds. I just scatter them mid October. I never planted them in the first place. The just showed up. I will check and see what I have. My violets self sow and they are so healthy. And so does the blue lobilia (sp). Amanda, D-mail me your address.

JB. so sorry about your friend. My dad always said he would be the last one left and there would be no one to turn off the lights. He had one friend that outlived him by less than a year. My mother lost her best friend about 5 years before she died at 88. She missed her every day. I, like Evelyn, am close to 70. Have already lost some classmates and two have dementia. A couple walk with walkers and one is in a wheelchair. Several of the guys wives have died and they have remarried. You must remember, I graduated from a small class. Under 40 people.

I cleaned out the fridge and freezer today and got rid of all the food I have been over enjoying. The progressive dinner last night was fun and the food was delicious. I have to get to bed because my echo is early tomorrow. Thanks for all the good wishes. Sharon.

Well you guys, my granddad was 96 years old when I got a call in Seattle from my mom in a tizzy and she wanted me to go down to the Greyhound depot in Seattle and meet the bus from Oregon and take him off of it. He was headed to Montana to meet up with his old buddies who he used to sit on the porch of the hardware store with.

I told her to leave him alone 'cause it was the last trip he would make. Well it ended up that the sheriff found him waiting for the bus in Oregon and took him home. He was not crazy, or out of his mind, at that time he hadn't talked to his friends in years, but knew they were there.

Oh, BTW, even at 96 his hair was coal black. I always told my mom I had his genes, 'cause my hair has a bit of gray in it, but that is all.

So you see JB, there really are a lot of people out there that you just don't know about that are out living you by a long way so far and I'll bet you beat them. Bob's mom was 92 last year.

Please get out there and get those cuttings etc. growing, or else decide you are going to be a snowbird next winter. I hate winters. They are so depressing because nothing is growing outside. I just told Bob a few minutes ago that I want to move back to Seattle. I know I would hate those gray days, but they really are not much different than here and I would insist on a greenhouse to work in in the winter.

He didn't want to hear it. Ttyl, tomorrow. Got an appt with the vet for Candy, and a hair appt. for myself in the morning. Goodnight. Jen

I WS my California poppies and they did well with the WS. I am also a couple of zones colder than both of you. The poppy seeds I sowed were the Laurens Grape and some of the hardier single flowered poppies in red and lavendar. I cannot remember where I read it, and perhaps it was something that Crit had written, that either October or November was the time to sow them - I am kicking myself that I had not journalled this information -

Jen - it is such a shame they stopped your Grandad from his trip. I agree that it would probably be the last trip. You all make me weepy with your stories, but I do feel there are important lessons there.

JB - I had tried to start camellias from cuttings and had no such luck. What is your secret?