Diane Witch Hazel

I got one this August on a great sale. It is starting to color up for the fall. Love its color. Anybody else growing this variety and how do they like it?

Bill

close up

Lovely. I like the deep red turning copper-orange flowers at the beginning of February. That iron-red is very novel for a withhazel.
I also like the spectum of autumn foliage colour.

I have mine backed by my yellowish garage so I needed a red flowered variety. This was my first choice once I saw its fall colors last year. I can't wait until it gets bigger as it already grabs your eye.

Bill

Our MN arboretum has one in a test plot that nobody seems to know about. Just as well. It grows about 4 inches a year and blooms open about half of the years. Don't remember what fall color does up here.

Beautiful Bill! That's one I'd like to see more of.

"Diane" is one of the best of the red flowered witchhazels.

Scott

What beautiful colors to look at first thing in the morning!! I've never seen a Whitch Hazel before, thank you for sharing. : )

That's lovely willis. Can I ask where you bought it?

Startright,

Then you don't know what you're missing! Witchhazels are wonderful small trees, and they give you so much at times of the year when there is so little. You might've observed in my photo of the flowers that the darned thing was in full bloom in February, ground frozen, snow on the ground, fingers frozen. Yet, there it was. Sure, the flowers are a little different, but what would you expect pre-crocus, pre-daffodils, pre-pre-pre forsythia. Many are very sweetly fragrant, a very nice bonus that early in the year. And they provide much needed nectar for the beneficial insects too. They settle in and remain decently attractive through the growing season, the foliage remaining clean and green, before they explode into a kalaiscope of color fairly late in the fall. Architecturally, many are very lateral, with horizontal branching that makes them especially beautiful after a snowfall.

Hamamelis japonica and Hamamelis mollis are two oriental forms not too often seen, although H. mollis "Pallida" is reasonably available. That plant is exceptionally fragrant, but it has the somewhat annoying habit of retaining its leaves well after they have gone brown and limp. Hybrids between the two Asian species are generally the witchhazels you'll see in the trade under the epithet Hamamelis x intermedia. These vary widely in terms of form, flower color, and fragrance. All are good plants, but some are gooder than others.

There are two American species. Hamamelis vernalis, which blooms in the very early spring like the above, and Hamamelis virginiana, which is in bloom now or will be very soon. On the latter, the flowering, although unique to this time of year, is often lost in the changing foliage. This might be the main reason it has not had many selections made and why it is very hard to buy. The former, H. vernalis, tends to have smallish flowers of weakish color and it too has not developed as a garden plant and is rather difficult to find.

Pictured is H. x intermedia "Jelena."

Scott

PS-VictoriousVarment will probably come along and correct about half of what I've said above. He always does. But that's okay, because somehow or other, he's always right. Darn him! Anyway, if I can just succor my wounded ego, we make a good enough team. Me? I've got the enthusiasm, the ideas, and the good looks. VV? He's got the corrections (and the collections, especially of Viburnums).

Thanks for the info just the same.. I as a newbie to including trees and shrubs as part of my gardening theme, do enjoy that everybody tries to tone down the didactic junk with some humor! So, even if I don't post often, I'm writing down the significant info ...in my log! And I'll chuckle as I now write it in pencil as I await the corrections! ;0)

Your right Scott, there is so much I have and am missing. But I am trying to learn. I have aboricuture this semester and I never new there was so many trees out there. Coure most of it Oaks, Maples, Crepre Myrtles, Azaleas, the trees that mainly grow down here and Pinus. Geez, I never knew there was so many types of pine trees!!!!!!

My head has been stuck in the ground messing for years and years with plants. Looks like I have missed out on a beautiful part of life. Now I gotta find me a Witch Hazel!!!!!!! Beautiful color and great for beneficials too. A double bonus!!!!!!!!

Garden6 I too and trying to get some beauty going. This may sound cruel, but I am removing hundreds of weed Oaks , only the huge one s get to stay, they earned there place, and gonna plant some trees and shrubs that will bring life and color to my little area.

I am learning that it is not easy becoming a " Tree Hugger" and that you really have to watch getting up close and personal with some trees. The other day I saw my first real tree with fall color coming on all over it and decided I was gonna gather some of its leaves to place around the pumpkin sitting in on one of my professors desk. About the time I was reaching for the leaves a warning went up to freeze. The tree I thought was so pretty was Posion Summac. Then I was gonna gather some neat berry looking seeds only to find only to be warned again cuz this time I was getting close and personal with a Devils Walking Stick. Wicked looking tree for all its beauty. Was not a good day. LOL I learned ya don't stand under Catalpa trees and look up unless ya like digging worms out of your hair and don't always walk around with your head up in the air looking at canopys without looking where your feet are going first. It's hard enough being the oldest student in the class and even harder tryign to get your dignity back when you trip over a stump and fall flat on your face. So when I ask the seemly dumb questions , have pity on me. I trying to learn. :)

Beautiful plant and picture! I hope you'll consider adding them to the PlantFiles entry here: http://davesgarden.com/pf/go/79888/index.html

If I lived in Alabama or elsewhere in the south and I could plant only one witchhazel, it would be H. mollis, the chinese witchhazel species, or one of the specific selections of that species (Wisley Supreme, Princeton Gold, or Imperialis are a few that are more and more available. Though 'Pallida' is sometimes described as a selection of this one, in growth habit, bloom, fragrance, etc it looks more like a hybrid than H. mollis -- I have 2 in my garden and have seen lots more in my travels). H. mollis is ultimately a large spreading plant, easily 20' tall and across when mature, though some of the hybrids may get that big too. It has rich golden yellow flowers with a little red at the base, and has IMO the richest fragrance of any witchhazel I have smelled -- better for me than any of the hybrids.

For those lucky enough to live in parts of the country with very mild winters (eg the midAtlantic and SE and PNW) it starts blooming in December or very early January and continues for a couple of months, earlier than any of the hybrids (well maybe almost any, since there are now SO many available). I have seen wonderful mature plants in all these areas and they just glow on a cloudy winter day or when backlighted by the sun, and a mature plant will have fragrance that carries for a long distance. I have never seen the species itself with leaf retention issues during bloom, though given that it is a species and genetically variable I am sure that can occur.

Mine aren't mature yet and don't yet bloom all that well, but I am not sure that is due to my northern location or lack of maturity, since I have heard it said that the species will bloom much better when mature (some of the hybrids seem better about this when small).

I had a 'Diane' in my old garden that was nice, especially in its rich red and orange fall color. Unfortunately it died during the move. But I would have to say that for me, the red flowered witchhazels don't hold a candle to the yellow and lighter orange or copper flowered plants which have much more carrying power in the garden, especially on dreary winter days. I will look for another one because I have lots of space, but I strongly prefer the lighter colors. They also look especially nice against an evergreen background (conifers, etc.)

For those who really want a selectiom of Witchhazels, Fairweather Gardens now has a tremendous selection of varities, including multiple selections of H. mollis, and they ship fairly large plants which will have a presence in the garden early on. These plants are obviously becoming increasingly popular since the MO nurseries are carrying more and more.

PGZ5, I bought mine at Sids Nursery for 1/2 off at their big sale weekend in mid August. They had a few more but might be gone by now. It was very root bound so I had to do a lot of work freeing them up. Luckily we have had a VERY VERY wet late summer, early fall here so it hasn't seemed to suffer much at all (I think I only did one or two initial waterings). I know Rich's Foxwillow Pines had them earlier, but call first. I also had Planter's Palette call me when they got some in stock in late August, but I had already found this one. Sids still had the cheapest normal price for them so try there first unless you want a larger one then try Rich's as they had 5 ft ones if I remember correctly.

Scott, do you know what insect pollinate these? Just curious. Also, Diane is supposedly vase shaped, but how tight of a vase is yours. Also just curious. I planted mine about 7 ft away from the corner of my garage guessing on about a 15ft spread at maturity.

Terry, I'll give it a whirl this weekend as the files are on my home computer. I think that would be my first addition to plant files.

Bill

Decadent-Please post a pic of 'Jelena' in bloom this winter, so far I'm having trouble deciding between 'Jelena' and 'Girard's Orange'. I think 'Diane' and a nice yellow H. vernalis (maybe 'Sandra'?) would make a nice grouping with an orange. This would fit in a south and west facing corner, shaded by a Crimson King Norway in summer (I didn't plant it, and I'm not removing it 'cause the lower deck is built around it!), and so would be somewhat protected. I could maybe berm the bed a little too. My idea is to plant a mixed shrub border, and then layer some perennials and groundcovers in front of them. What are the plants you used? That is very pretty, exactly the look I'm going for.

Hey Billiam~I worked at Sid's last summer, in Palos. You're probably closer to Naperville? That's where I got a lot of my bushes, the do have a lot of natives.

I got it at the Palos one for $37 and a couple of Fothergilla for $15 and some conifers and some PJM Rhodies at that sale. I just happened to stumble upon the sale while going there on a Sat. It was a madhouse but totally worth it. I haven't been to the Naperville one yet.

Bill

I've never been to Naperville either, I think I've only been to the town of Naperville once, LOL. Whoa, I'll have to get to Palos next August. Isn't the parking there insane? I saw 'Woodlander' hydrangea there this summer, still kicking myself in the pants for not snagging one.

Okay, VV is noticably absent, so David5311 took his role! Couldn't ask for a better substitute. David is incredibly knowledgeable. And I could not agree more that the red witchhazels do not pop in the landscape like the yellow and orange cultivars do.

I don't grow "Diane" myself, but when I've seen it, it does have a stiff upright form that seems to have no inclination to eventually widen out. 10-15' spread is the widest I've seen. I would guess 20' would be about the max. "Jelena," my favorite x intermedia, is vase-like to 4-5', and then it starts growing laterally. Very cool. PG, you don't need to wait until winter, I can post a "Jelena" flower photo now.

David, you've whetted my appetite now to try some H. mollis cultivars now. I wish I had the room! I have heard both that "Pallida" acts more like x intermedia and that it is pure H. mollis. I trust your input more than the other sources of information. I will tell you this, if it disappoints me in the fragrance department, out it goes, and I will seek out a true H. mollis. I do not know why one would grow a witchhazel that isn't fragrant!

Scott

Just thought of a couple more things about "Pallida." It definitely has got leaves that are more H. mollis like than the usual x intermedia, but variation amongst hybrids is normal. And I remember why I chose "Pallida." It was because Tim Brotzman, a reigning witchhazel guru, mentioned it as a favorite.

Scott

I think I may prefer the darker yellow of Arnold Promise. That's the one CBG recommends. Where is Tim from (region)?

Arnold's Promise has good fall color from what I saw at Rich's, but not as good as Diane. That was my 2nd choice if I couldn't find the Diane. I still have not had the opportunity to enjoy the aroma of a witchhazel. I guess there will be something to look forward to this winter, besides my 2nd baby's upcoming birth in Feb. Maybe I shall name her Diane. Must clear that with da misses 1st.

Bill

Goddess of the Hunt, First Choice, sounds appropriate. Are we sure it's an X?

I am half greek so the name origin works and yes she is an X.

Bill

That's good, Arnold would not work at all.

Arnold's Promise is a very fine plant. In my old garden, my plants were not very fragrant, though they were very showy, usually in March here. I obtained them quite a few years before from a nurseryman in Lake Co OH, back when few hybrid witchhazels were available in the upper midwest. Not sure if they were the 'real McCoy'. I have since seen plants labelled as Arnold that were quite fragrant. Those plants had very fine fall color, a kaleidoscope of orange yellow and red, usually coming after the main fall foliage rush, here in late October and early November The hybrids in general have good fall color, darker in the red-flowered plants, and lighter in the yellow flowered ones.

I have been at the Scott Arboretum (Swarthmore PA) a number of times during witchhazel bloom season. AP there were quite fragrant. The highly touted 'Sunrise' did indeed have a great floral display, but most of the plants had retained leaves which were a problem. NONE of the hybrids for me have ever matched the incredible fragrance of the straight species, H. Mollis. The old plants I have seen at Winterthur, at the Washington Park Arboretum in Seattle and in Portland, at Callaway Gardens in GA (yes, I travel a lot), have a knock-your-socks-off rich, sweet fragrance which is unmatched. However, these plants may not perform as well in northern gardens, so.... take your chances.

When I have been at Scott and in Seattle, the cv 'Primavera' was the showiest in overall bloom -- very, very floriferous, though I could not detect a fragrance.

Fragrance may be partly a function of the size of the plant -- more total number of flowers, more scent delivered......

IMO, the yellow cultivars are definitely showier in bloom than the reds. Try underplanting with the earliest crocus, winter aconites, and green and yellow hellebores for a real taste of spring in late winter.

Lots of great information here! 'Arnold's Promise' is a beauty in our gardens, however the 'Diane' we planted 5 or 6 years ago continues to struggle - darned moles and voles! Trying half a dozen or so new cultivars this year and should be interesting to see how they perform. Picked up Hamamelis x intermedia 'Antoine Kort' from Rare Find Nursery earlier this year and anxious to see it bloom and check its fragrance. On a day trip to take pictures of foliage last fall, we were treated with H. virginiana everywhere - blooming in the mountains.

Thanks for the gorgeous view RCN, makes me pine for my old Washington home where I could see the Olympia foothills from my windows. (when Mount Rainier was out.. simplly breathtaking)

rcn - Spectacular view, H. vernalis is the straight species of choice in my neck of the woods.
garden - When I lived in Seattle (Edmonds, really), I never got over the stunning sight of Mt. Rainier as the morning mist burned off. I started work at the crack of dawn.

Thanks for the picture of H. virginiana. It reminds us of what a beauty this native is. It is just coming into bloom in my woods now, and will be in bloom through mid-November. I had a good one planted as a garden plant in my old garden, and with late asters and grasses it was really a worthwhile garden plant in its own right. If people ever are in the Philadelphia area, sometime they should go look at the witchhazel grove at the Morris Arboretum there. They have an ancient plant of H. virginiana that is 30'+ across, 20' high, covered with lichens and with multiple 12" trunks. It is one of the most awesome witchhazels I have ever seen. If I can dig up the old picture of it I will -- anyone would lust after such a tree.

I planted H. mollis 'Imperialis', H. x intermedia cvs 'Orange Beauty', 'Robert', 'Primavera', 'Antoine Kort' today, all from Fairweather's fall catalog. Primavera and Orange Beauty are loaded with buds even as fairly small plants. So in the coming years I hope to have plants to show. I am a witchhazel fan as y'all can tell.....

PG,

Tim Brotzman is from Northern Ohio, probably Lake County, but I don't know that for sure.

Scott

Tim is from Madison, OH which is Lake County. Great nursery, full of neat plants!

Regards,
Ernie

Tim wrote a book a year or so ago.. Timber Press. I grow a neat purple blooming seedling of his. I believe his name is spelled Bratsman. not 100% sure. Curt Hanson of Crintonic Gardens of daylily fame is a great friend of his, and where I have purchased all my witch hazels through. Curt has Tim's book, I want to get it soon! Curt has the best collection of WH's... a really great bright red one, I think called Cardinal.

A great memory is being in Tim's hoop houses on a warm winter day with hundreds of pots of blooming WH's.... the fragrance, concentrated in the hoop houses was amazing!

What, in your collective opinion, is the hardiest of the WH's. Or am I just going to throw my money away? Ken

Wow Willis--I just have your regular garden variety wild witch hazel growing very abundantly at the edges of our yard, and while it's a pretty yellow it certainly doesn't look a thing like yours--how stunning!

Well now I am going looking. I like the Jelena because of the lateral branching. I grew up in michigan with the bush shaped ones and they were not too beautiful. I think I will go to Fairweather Gardens and take a look. Thank you all for giving me a new plant for my woodland garden.

Ken:

Come to KY and cover me with your cash. Any witch hazel you desire, is yours.

I believe you will have opportunity for success with any of the H. virginiana or H. vernalis selections that Beaver Creek/Song Sparrow or Johnson's Nursery (Milwaukee area) are field growing. That should give about a zone 4 test. All the H. mollis and H. x intermedia types are probably going to be expensive kindling.

Leftwood/treelover3/other MNians should be able to relate more from the frigid lands.

Tim Brotzman is quite the witch hazel fanatic; a visit to his hoop houses while the plants are blooming is probably the only thing that surpasses a visit to his trade show booth in Columbus in January. His array of blooming sprigs is outlandish.

david531
Good luck with Orange Beauty. I just had mine dug up and threw it in the woods. Curt threw his out a couple years ago. The least blooming of any of the W H in my collection or his. Just not worth the space. The only disappointment among the many I have grown or I have seen at Curt's. I only have about 10 or 12, but I think Curt must have about 30 different ones. He's obsessed.

Of course for him, living only about 10 minutes from Tim doesn't help the obsession.

:-0

Well now that's a disappointment! Maybe I will not put Orange Beauty in one of the best spots. They boys at Fairweather usually give good advice, and they praise that one pretty highly (of course, they are in the sales game...). I also did notice that the 4-5' plant they sent did have loads of flower buds on it. We'll see -- but thanks for the heads up.

I was at a local nursery, Bordines, today, and they had excellent looking plants of AP, Jelena, and Diana that were all 1/2 price -- about $35 for a 7 gallon, well formed, 4' shrub -- pretty darn good. I have one other AP from a different source, and a big Jelena I moved, but it is in too much shade I fear. So....well....I succumbed. Wichhazel addiction! All 3 had excellent fall color on them, Diana a rich red with orange highlights. So I think that makes about 12-15 witchhazels. Glad I have 2 acres of sun anyway.

I will have to get the deer spray out though, because I have found over 2 winters that deer LOVE floral and vegetative witchhazel buds.

One more WH note -- I recall from late last winter that a cultivar called Winter beauty, a coppery orange, had really excellent fragrance. The plants were ungodly expensive (bout $250 for the same size plant I bought for $35 today)... They will need to come down in price.