Is this really legal? III

Ah, factor in the wonderful world of bugs and fungi! It is absolutely amazing how plants work hand in hand with these fellows to foil our efforts to make the land support only the plants we want. I don't suppose nature would have ever devised acres of produce, as we have. Cultivation is such a sticky slope. I feel fortunate that our climate doesn't endear us to many of the bugs, but it doesn't endear us to most of the cultivation, as well!

Caron, that is fascinating information. I'm not even sure what 'rust' is, so I don't know that it is a problem here. Perhaps it requires warmth we don't have, or perhaps I just have been ignorant of it. I recently had a discussion with a friend who is a botanist. She was explaining the relationship between our alders and the local broomrape. It is amazing how nature provides such an intricate cycle to support so many things we don't want, and so many things we do.

Weez
Not sure if you clime is inhospitable to some of the same rusts or not...but seems to be most prevalant on trees and particularly of conifers in your region. Probably specific adapatations to clime where rust on grasses and deciduous ttees might not have enought time (or even the specific hosts they require) to mature-and that's just a guess on my part.
Yes, fascinating stuff to say the least...a tangled web to be sure!!

Here is some info for you...
http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF2/255.html
http://www.fs.fed.us/r10/spf/fhp/leaflets/Sprbrorus.htm
http://www.fs.fed.us/r10/spf/fhp/leaflets/Piegalrus.htm
http://www.forestpests.org/nursery/cottonwoodleafrusts.html

Thanks, Caron! That was some fascinating reading! I don't recall seeing our white or Sitka spruce developing such brooms or orange coloration, but I haven't been looking for it. I imagine the websites would chose images of obvious infestation, so I'm sure they are not all so pronounced. I found it interesting that the 'brooms' can serve as birds' nests, and that healthier trees don't seem to sustain damage from this infestation. It seems nature has its way of culling out the weak.

We have a spruce in our yard that has been host to a very strange and ugly shelf-fungus. I discovered it along a lumber bordered flower bed next to the tree, as well as a bit along its base. The fungus was almost black and had an appearance similar to the gills on a king crab... only comparison that comes to mind! The tree is obviously not healthy. It has many dead branches and sap oozing here and there along the trunk. I'm sure we'll have to cut it down at some point. I'm assuming the tree was failing and the fungus arrived after the fact. Is that likely?

the brooms serve as nest for flying squirrels too...

Very true that natures serves to cull the weak. As you probably know Mountain Pine beetle is rampant here for the same reason...overstocking, monocultures with same age trees, and fire suppression.

My guess would be that as well. Here, mountain pine beetle carries blue stain fungus so it's a double whammy-where the tree might have survived a light attack, the fungus can be worse in weakening the tree and now prone to worse insect attacks in subsequent years...the cycle continues...

With all that sap oozing I might be looking for insect pests as well. Not sure tho what you've got up there.....

I love bugs! Didn't used to but certainly have a new found appreciation for them! I am trying, unsuccessfully so far, to colonize Gallerucella beetles. I understand it can take a few years. If they colonize in the next few years, I think I will have a new found love of the Hylobius species.

I love fungus too! Say WZ, any thoughts to letting that Spruce tree come down on its own to add to biomass for the soil? Yes, normally when a tree is stressed, other pathogens view it as an open invitation to come on in and have a field day. Not always though. And beauty is in the eye of the beholder! Any way you can post a photo of your shelf fungus?

As far as rust, I've come to the conclusion that rust just sort of happens as chemical controls seem to be so ineffective. I remove any galls or telial horns I find and burn them regardless of the species. That gets to a source here and there and can actually reduce spore spread. Other than that, most rust is going to be worse in wetter years than it will in dryer years. It's somewhat cyclical. For the most part, it doesn't necessarily directly kill a tree but it does make it look extremely unattractive. Caron, your thoughts as my experience here is limited.

Back to Dodecatheon, I am thinking she might have been referring to mycorrhizal root fungi. That can do a number on anything growing in and around where it is present. The rust I was walking in over by me was all from my hawthorns. Nasty! It looked as if somebody was exploding pumpkins for a while.

Equil
Hawthorn rust infects grasses? Or is it that the spores cover everything?

Hey-where did you get your Gallerucella beetles? I too have an appreciation for bug (from biocontrol efforts here) but are not particularly fond of them except for my friends the spiders!!

Equil, LOL! Let the tree come down on its own! It's not 4 feet away from my hubby's workshop! Believe me, our woods has lots of deadfall that have come down on their own. I love the mosses and bracken that take up residence, along with all the little critters that live in them.

Caron, we are plagued by the spruce beetle up here. It's preference seems to be the white spruce, and our trees are primarily Sitka here in the Seward area. The hills northwest of us have turned brown with the dead spruce... a great fire danger. My friend has told me that most of our trees here are not necessarily Sitka, but rather our own cross-breed, and thus perhaps prone to attract the spruce beetle. I've seen no signs of infestation locally, but it is entirely possible at any time. This tree has been less than happy for many years, but we are loath to cut it down... foolish perhaps, since it could attract disease or beetle.

Nope, hawthorn rust only blankets everything just as if vandals went and sprinkled orange dust everywhere to cover their tracks then backed out of the area. There were a few weeks here where it looked like the Great Pumpkin from the big pumpkin patch was leaving tracks everywhere. The spores really show up best on an asphalt driveway that has been freshly sealed and white kitchen floors and well... everything they show up well on.

Arachnids, love those too but I really have a thing for odonata!

Neighbor down the road special ordered the Gallerucella. He's trying to colonize them too. I placed an additional order through my Heritage Biologist's source. They weren't all that expensive either. I can go look up his e-mail address and post it for you over in the PMs here for you later and you can contact him yourself but they aren't all that difficult to get your hands on around here. Hoepfully, they'll become a dime a dozen real soon so we can all share.

That's my understanding toois that wet years are really bad-dry years worse. Not much you can do except what you've been by burning. Chemical controls have to be timed exactly right it seems are very nasty. Not worth it unless you've got an entire crop at stake.....

I got some Gallerucella for a project here, but for free-that's why I was asking...just wondering what you paid is all and where you got them. Are you using Hylobius as well or having any luck with them??

Good luck with that spruce beetle, Weez. It may be many years before the infestation subsides. We've been under atack for about 8 years here and belive it is and 8-10 year cycle before it dies down. We are due for large fires here with the drought and now lots of standing deadwood.
Interesting that the Hayman fire a couple of years ago (and not far from my house) seems to have thinned the forest very successfully but pushed the beetle into new areas around hereit wasn't previously and that the beetle had skipped over. Weird how this happens.
Nothing to do but let it run it's course, thin at the right time. The 3 neighbors around us took down over 100 infected ponderosas this spring. Don't know why, but with all the pondos in the yard I don't have beetles (yet). I'm sure not gonna spray trees with the nasty stuff it takes to kill these tho...

Our spruce beetle infestation has probably run its course on the other side of the Kenai Peninsula. It's been over 15 years since it began, I believe. I was most aware of it at that time because my 2nd husband and I had a small circle saw mill and cut lots of the infected white spruce. Unfortunately, cutting has not been allowed in most of the federally regulated areas, so the standing dead trees pose a great fire hazard.

Alaska is such a huge state and so isolated from what we call the 'lower 48', that it is often hard to explain the conditions here. We are separated from area to area by distances, rivers, mountains, and in the case of Seward and Homer... the entire Harding Icefield. Though I know these conditions do not necessarily eliminate the possibility of infection or infestation, I do believe it greatly reduces or isolates it.

WZ, that tree would be brought down to its knees with it being in such close proximity to a work area. I'm all for biomass as long as my husband wouldn't become one with the earth along with a tree.

caron, I attempted to colonize two different beetles. I was hoping one to go after the flowers and one to go after the roots. I figured between the two of them that one would establish. No success with either so I am going to have to go back to square one and start all over again. My neighbor didn't have any luck either and he started his attempt in 1998 or 1999. I'll go get my source but I can tell you it was less than $100. I don't know if the cost was subsidized by the DNR but how much can beneficial bugs cost? I'll pm you.

Yes you have great geographical isolation then! You are right-great for recucing infection/infestation (you climate doesn't hurt either).
Do you have a slew of rare plants there because of it?

Ummm, folks. Could I ask you to do me (and other readers a favor?) If you want to talk about rust, galls, trees, grasses, and bugs (beneficial and otherwise), would you mind parsing this out into different threads?

I ask this for two reasons:

1) it's difficult for a person perusing this forum to know where to search for specific information when it's buried ten topics (and dozens of posts) deep.

2) Assuming they find the thread and read to the bottom, it's difficult for anyone else to "break into" a conversation when it gets too lengthy and goes down too many sideroads - it begins to feel more like a private dialogue than a discussion thread.

Don't get me wrong - it's all good stuff, and worthy of having separate threads for each topic.