The Impossible Dream - An already trained full sized Juniper

Hi,
I've just joined Dave's Garden and am so impressed with the depth and wealth of knowledge here, especially being a previously only sporadically successful gardener. We live in Dallas and are completely redoing our landscape; basically clearing everything that was in the yard from several previous and very neglectful/unimaginative owners.

My husband is a huge fan of bonsai junipers and is longing for a trained specimen tree (ideally in the 5 - 8' range) for a bed that will resemble a Japanese rock garden. I found 1 site that sells full grown specimen trees like that but they are in the $10,000+ range, which is way, way out of our budget. Any thoughts about how to proceed? In the attached picture I have a Mugho Pine pictured, but mostly just for the shape; it was the closest in the program I am using to design. I am open to other conifers that would have that arching "bonsai" shape, but don't know where to start. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

Many thanks,
Cathy

buy a normal one and start trimming:)

lol - I thought of that, but knowing my husband's and my lack of pruning skills, probably not the best option. If I could find someone in Dallas that knew how to trim trees in that manner I'd be happy to hire them to come bring that tree out of there, but I don't. Again, any help, direction would be appreciated.

thanks.

there are some books you can get on japanese gardening relatively cheap on amazon - make it a project - i will be attempting to do a few myself

Bonsai is not so difficult , a mugo pine might grow to larger size faster .

I see Japanese Black Pine regularly in photos of Japanese gardens, (Pinus thunbergiana). It is an excellent Bonsai tree, but Bonsai is much smaller than 5 - 8' tall.
Japanese Black Pine gets around 60 feet tall or so naturally. With some pruning and some training you might keep it at a manageable size for a few years.
It sounds like you might look into the Weeping Japanese Maple, (there are many). I think that lean that you speak of is a method of training trunks that way in Bonsai. To get that lean on a full size tree I'd think all you'd have to do stake it to lean on one side. In Bonsai, strongly leaning is called Shakan and mildly leaning is called Bunjingi. I hope you're not into Feng Shui, Feng Shui considers that a form of cruelty to manipulate and restrain a tree like that. I'm not into Feng Shui myself! I personally don't think the Bonsai tree is suffering that much, it's alive.

You should be able to find really nice sculptured junipers at local nurseries. Can find them here (Midland) very nice for under $200--maybe 3-4'. I have even seen pretty nice smaller ones at Home Depot for ~$35.

Thanks for all the replies. The more I research it, the less it seems like juniper will work. What works for bonsai doesn't necessarily work for a full grown tree. Maybe it's a pine or another evergreen I need? What seems to be the tricky part (other than the trained/shaped aspect) is that our soil is clay based and the spot I've picked out is mostly sunny.

I wouldn't give up on junipers yet. Chinese junipers grow pretty fast, are very tolerant and love the sun. They develop a 'bonsai' character on their own. Mine isn't a great example, but it will give you a general idea. You can buy them inexpensively when they're small. I think a lot of the enjoyment is watching them develop, but I'm kind of into delayed gratification.

Japanese black pines also grow pretty fast and develop a 'bonsai' like look on their own. The only pruning I've done with this one is just thinning out some of the interior crowded branches. Again, they're not expensive when you buy them small.

Or japanese white pine, which is slower to fill out, but develops a 'sculpted' look, too.
This one is the same age as the jap black pine above, but you can see it's slower growing.
I like the foliage difference, white pine needles are bluer and softer, black pines bright green and stiff.

Weerobin,
I love what you're doing in your garden. That is pretty much what we're going for on a somewhat smaller scale, yard size-wise. As to the delayed gratification...I'm not that young and don't know if I can afford to wait too long for my tree gratification : )

Weerobin,
Nice pictures. I love the Chinese juniper (Juniperus chinensis?). I bought one called 'Robusta Green' last year that looks like it might grow into something similar to yours eventually. Right now it is one main spike and a few smaller. Was nice to see a more adult version, assuming they are the same thing. I can't grow black pines here (not winter hardy), although I love them. I do have a Japanese white pine, with many more ideas waiting to percolate into the next purchase. ;-)

I also was going to suggest the junipers as weerobin did. I have seen some fantastic examples......AND all here in Texas. Very affordable.
Here is a link that sells junipers as well as discussing rock gardens. Good Luck!

http://www.backyard-landscape-ideas.com/japanese-rock-gardens.html

And I find this you tube link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VkukuEK5JQ
Hope this helps !

This message was edited May 8, 2011 3:17 PM