Rudbeckias

OK, I guess I get that. Never tried the WSown ruds in a pot. I don't really do perennials in pots. I only use containers on my porch, which is shady most of the day.

I had to think and look twice at your answer. When I read "pot crops" I thought you meant wacky tabacky.

Karen

Nah, dont do THAT stuff. Scurge weed if I ever saw some.

Besides, Im happy as a clam as it is!

Pot crop - GH term for flowers in a pot, not whacky!

Some plants might even take 3 or more years to flower. Wistera for example from seed can take 7 or more!

Sometimes we call them canned plants, container plants too... but we dont want to confuse you!

Thanks for the info Karen. Now I can see the differences in Prairie Sun and Irish Eyes, thanks to your photos.

I can see why you would get better results, in the first year, from winter sewing Rudbeckia seeds. Down here, in South Florida, if I plant the seeds in Dec/Jan I won't typically see blooms for 4-5 months. There are a couple issues I have with growing them from seed in pots. The roots systems grow so fast that they have to be repotted several times before blooming. Quite a few of mine seem "crowded" when growing in pots. Manytimes the first blooms are short and squashed in between the foliage. I usually cut them off hoping the plants will branch out better. I hope I'm doing the right thing???

The rudbeckias and echinacea seem to be back into their growing cycles extra early this winter. Typically they don't put out fresh new growth and blooms until March down here. This year they've started in January. Maybe our week long cold spell earlier in the month triggered them to "get going"??? Anyway here's a photo from today showing some of the echinacea (Green Eyes, Harvest Moon, Tiki Torch) regrowing and putting out their first buds.

Jon

I never should have looked at that photo. My zone envy is unbearable.

Jon, when you say your start your ruds in Dec/Jan, how and where do you start them? Outside? in pots? in ground? under lights?

I sowed my cherry brandy last year Jan 19, outside, in a milk jug. They were buried under snow, frozen, thawed, frozen, monsoon rain in spring... They were my first sprouts of the year, March 10. Thru the milk jug hole...

Forgot to mention, they started blooming mid June. And I'm in a much colder zone.

I never pot up anything. They go right from milk jug to garden bed. I plant out by hunks of seedlings when they're tiny. I usually start planting out perennials and hardy annuals by mid April, though we get frosts well into May.

I'm pretty much sold on WSing my ruds. It has it's limitations, especially slow growing heat lovers like coleus or annual verbena. But for ruds it's great.

Karen

Cool picture, kqcrna

I found that starting ruds indoors you will have about 2 weeks earlier bloom than wintersown ruds. So with restricted indoor space, I prefer ws since there it doesn't make that much of a difference

Whacky tabaccy...he-he-he...ya'll so funny!

Young-ins! Dont they know that when they git our age we get whaaky without the tabaccy?

I start all my rudbeckia seeds (actually all flower seeds) outside in 2" square pots, inside the screening around the pool. They get sunlight there, but it's filtered somewhat by the screening. Then I'll repot them several times, as needed until I decide where I want to put them.

Even though it stays warm here in the winter seeds do not grow any faster. Generally speaking, the ideal time to sew seeds here in from Oct-Feb. At least that's the information on the back of most seed packs. Things don't grow as fast from Nov-Jan because the daylight hours are short. Once you get into March/April you see things growing at a much faster rate.

The only time I start things indoors is in the late summer when it's still too hot outside to grow winter annuals. I can usually start things about a month early using this method. An example would be snapdragon seeds. I can start them in late August inside, and then move them to filtered sun around the pool in mid Sept. If I try to direct sew them in the ground in full sun, the earliest I've been able to do it is mid Oct.

Oh well, it's cold and snowy up North and we have echinacea and flowers like these gazanias to look at. What a rough life living down here during the winter!!!

If I was ever to have to move, and moved that way, jon, I woul dnot know how to garden anymore!

Lovely shot there!

OH SHUT UP JON! And I thought you were nice! (But can I come and live in your yard?)

You are a kinder plant parent than me. Mine suffer the sub-zero temps and feet of snow and rain and wind. Mine go into the ground at one or two true leaves. I dump the jug of seedlings into a flat, cut them into hunks with a knife, and stick them in a garden bed around April. They'll still get freezes then.

I sound much meaner but I'd never have the patience for all the work you put into them.

But I still have zone envy.

Karen

LOL....thanks Blossom. It's just "upside down" gardening down here. You have to look at autumn as being the beginning for so many cooler weather plants. If you try planting them in spring you're gonna fail miserably (I can relate to that). It has to be something that grows/matures fairly quickly. If its a biennial or something that takes 6 months or more to bloom form seed....forget it down here. It probably won't make it through the summer. I guess it's natures way of evening things out. There are tons of things you all can grow that would be impossible down here.

LOL. I baby my plants, because there aren't that many of them. It's very small scale down here. The funny thing is some of your plants need that cold/snow/winter dormancy thing Karen. That's why they won't grow here. Try growing tulips, daffodils, narcissus here. It ain't gonna happen here.

Sure you can come hang out in the yard Karen. You better come this week because the invasion of family members, from up North, starts next weekend. It goes off and on until mid March.

So I see ya got the dirt out of the pool there huh after the last makeover there Jon!

Careful, he's got a rubber alligator inthat swamp of his! LOL

Well, I got sap running in my trees so it wont be too long... maybe 2 months at the worst end, but I think it will be early.

Ugh! An invasion of snow bird relatives living at your house? Makes living up here in the frozen tundra worthwhile.

You could put spring bulbs in the fridge to force them, couldn't you?

How do you keep 2"pots moist enough? That's one thing I like about gallon jugs- they have enough soil to stay moist for a while. And I let them have morning sun only in a NE exposure. If I start them in summer, I keep them in full shade until after germination when I can remove the top (humidity dome). Maybe you should try a jug of ruds that way.

Wintersowing is perfect for seeds that need cold strat. But those the don't need it, like ruds, do well, too. And much easier than indoors under lights.

Karen

LOL. Haven't used the pool much lately. Was ice skating on it during the deep freeze two weeks ago. Jaws was sleeping on his blanket in the garage during those day. He didn't even want to go for a drive, up the road, to The Everglades, to visit with some of his alligator friends.

Maybe you better be on the lookout for the groundhog Blossom. He'll let you know, just around the corner, on Feb 2 when winter is gonna end. LOL

Bottom water the 2" pots the first time and then just mist them as needed Karen. I'm guessing using a jug down here would keep them too warm. I would think they'd really heat up in there since its generally 75-80 degrees most days.

I did buy some daffodil bulbs on sale up North in October. I put them in the refrigerator when I got back to Florida. When we had that cold spell two weeks ago I planted them outside in the ground. Yesterday I noticed many of them have popped up above the ground. Maybe they will actually bloom. That would be cool.

They don't overheat in a closed jug, even in 90 degree temps, as long as they're in full shade. I do that in summer, hiding them in the corner of my covered porch, under a chair, where the sun can't find them!

You'll be the talk of the neighborhood with your sprng daffodils.

Karen

I'll think about the jug thing for Florida Karen. I'm not sure what the benefit would be? You're using them mostly to protect somewhat from the cold. It's a different animal growing things here. Hope I get daffodils. Yes, that would be cool. I noticed my Larkspur seedlings appear to be growing their first flower stalks. That would be a minor miracle for down here also.

Well, the closed up jug retains humidity. The large volume of soil, a good 3" deep, holds the moisture well. Seed flats and small containers dry out so fast, need constant watering when the weather is warm. I do start come in 6 oz cups in winter/spring, but in summer they dry out so fast. I am sometimes at work for 10 hours or so, so I'm not here to keep an eye on them all them time. Don't want to be that vigilant either.

I think I had a million or so larkspur volunteers pop up in fall. I took a walk around the yard today and those larkspur are blanketing my flower beds. I might have to eliminate them from my garden because they are becoming pests. Hate to do that because I do love them. I took a few pictures today but haven't downloaded them yet.

Karen

The seedlings only remain in the 2" pots for approximately 3 weeks. For some reason I only need to water them every 3-5 days.

I've heard that larkspur are good multipliers up North. The issue I have with Larkspur is that most of them seem to be 150-180 days from seed to bloom. At that rate there wouldn't be enough time for them to grow and bloom during our cooler winter weather. By the time they mature and get ready to bloom they would be killed by our intense Florida summer sun. I decided to try the "Imperial Giant" Larkspur because it lists 60-90 days from seed to bloom. If mine do bloom it's going to be about 90 days from planting, based on what I'm seeing.

If the grass here and the "tide" would not strangle my gardens ....LOL!

Although the ruds are going out in the prairie! Just hope its not too dry when the heat comes

I hope its not too dry for ya also Blossom. At least Ruds like it a little on the dry side.

Oo-Oo! Just came across picture of rud"Chocolate Orange" ....going on the "Gotta Have It!" list!


Edited to add link
http://www.anniesannuals.com/plants/plant_display.asp?prodid=1724&account=none

This message was edited Jan 24, 2010 6:32 AM

Ditto!

Jon, since you've made me jealous of your climate and winter flowers I thought I'd try the same with you with my larkspur. I took these pics yesterday. The green seedlings are probably 95% larkspur, the rest mostly nigella. I can't even find most of the rudbeckia seedlings I planted in fall; they're buried under the larkspur. Keep in mind, our temps were in the single digits and teens, day and night, for about 3 weeks.

Those larkspur grow to 5' tall and thrive.

Karen

I'm already jealous Karen. I've seen all the beautiful pictures you've posted of everything in bloom in the summer. My yard never looks even 1/10th as colorful as your does at any point of the year. LOL....this is the only time of the year when I can "level the playing field"........albeit slightly.

I hear ya Patty. Stumbled across that "Chocolate Orange" rudbeckia a month, or so, ago and ordered seeds. Planted a few of them a couple of weeks ago and have little seedlings, at the moment. Hope they look like those photos!!!

Jon

Love the pictures everyone

kqcrna, I tend to like plants (perennials, hardy tropicals) that are borderline hardy in the ground here, but everything that could survive outside was left out. the greenhouse was used to winter things that I bought in the fall, fall cuttings, and plants I actually wanted to try and keep growing even though it was still really cold at night in there. I have already wintersown some rudbeckias this year, but this is the first year trying them from seed. Encouraging to hear how quickly they bloom for you, I put some more out this morning

amorecuore, your plantings seem out of the ordinary for south FL, I see lots of things people say won't grow there in your pictures, they are lovely, must take some serious persistence. Tulips (except a few) don't do well here either. is it me or is one of those petunias really blue?

Good luck with them Tropicanna. In your zone they'll probably sprout soon!

BTW, snapdragons also do extremely well with wintersowing. Most people up here grow them as summer annual bedding plants, yanking them in the fall. Mine often winter over for me. The tops of the plant, upper foliage, die out but the roots and base of the plant survive. I lose some in winter but most survive at least 2 or 3 years.

Even my zone 6 summers are a little hot for snaps. They bloom and do well in early summer but pout in the hottest part of summer. In fall they bloom again. I love snapdragons, and seeds are so easy to collect and save. If left on the plant, they reseed a lot too. In this spot I had a few snaps in 2008. In '09 all these volunteered, and some were transplanted elsewhere.

Karen

Nice photo Karen. Snapdragons only do well here from October - early May. The middle of May is always the time when all the winter stuff immediately goes downhill and dies. It's like clockwork every year. I've never let any of them go to seed so unsure whether they would return in the fall. I always yank them out and replace them with something that does well here in the summer.

You're right Tropicanna. My yard is not typical for South Florida. Many of the things will grow here if you choose to do so during the winter. Some things you would consider perennials (gaillardia) are annuals here. Most people don't want the extra work and/or expense for this kind of stuff here. They stay with low maintenance tropicals since gardening is a 12 month of the year commitment.

Here's a closeup of those petunias. They are "Hula Hoop Blue", "Hula Hoop Red" and "Hula Hoop Velvet" petunias. I guess the blue ones are blue/purple in color. I have them in two places and the Velvet is the best performer, followed by the Blue and then the Red. The red ones just don't grow as well as the other colors for some reason. They don't spread well.

Jon

Karen, I love nicotianas and that is a really sweet planting! I love snapdragons, too, I have always bought the plants though. I'm still pretty much a beginner gardener and failed so much with annual seeds when I started gardening that I nearly gave up on annuals and seeds entirely until I tried wintersowing. I have been meaning to pick up some snapdragon seeds to try so thanks for reminding me :)

amorecuore, those are the prettiest petunias ever, what an amazing blue! That's a lot of work but it does pay off, everything looks great. "Low maintenance tropicals" are treated as annuals here ...lol! But I do grow what tropicals I can get away with here, serious zone envy to be able to have color year round :) I do need more annuals during the growing season to add color with all the big leaved foliage plants, you folks on this forum really show off some nice plants.

this is the only gaillardia picture I have, Sundance, the first I grew from seed last year. Gaillardias are naturalized on the coast of NC where I grew up, I thought they were sandspurs because they tend to grow in the same areas and did not like that plant for the longest time! I appreciate them now though

Jon that pink petunia you have there wiothout a name looks like Laura Bush, but gads there are so many lovely pinks that shade, hard tellign what it might be. I had a lovely pink last year that was called Total Madness...! It was beautiful

I have gaillardia out on the prairie.. OMG the mutants from the OP! Love them.

If you go to my trade list.. which now is doubling for my journnal...use the search thingee there and I should have pics of those up. If not they are coming. Dave was so nice to accomodate me in putting that search feature to which I cannot sing praises enough to him for!

The petunias are there too jon and whatever else you might want tolook at. I try hard to document things, but this gardening thing has gotten out of hand.

Thanks tropicanna. Mixing in some annuals is a great idea because it gives you some instant color with flower power. When I visit family up North and hit the nurseries I always notice the tropical plants being sold as annuals in cooler climates. Some of the most common ones I see are tropical hibiscus, mandevilla, canna lilies, lantana, begonias.....to name a few. Many of them usually fly off the shelves and sell out pretty quickly.

That's a nice photo of "Sundance" Gaillardia. They've grown on me also in the last few years. Up until a year or two ago I was indifferent about them. They're very uncommon down here and quite a few neighbors have asked me what they are.

Keep practicing with growing from seed and you're guaranteed to get better at it. Sometimes the failure is something simple like covering the seeds when we shouldn't have and vice versa.

LOL Holy smokes Blossom. You have a few plants in your want list and more than a few in your have list. Thanks for the help with identifying my petunias. I know how difficult it can be when it comes to identifying a variety when it comes to many flowers due to the enormous number of varieties out there. There are literally thousands when it comes to some flowers.

Jon

No problem Jon... its also so hard to tell like on petunias because the bloomers look so much alike and then the color so I would just be happy you have a pretty NOID there!

I told you my trade list was also my journal! I grow volume when I can!

LOL. There's some serious volume there Blossom!!! You ain't kidding when you say you grow some stuff. The pink colored petunias are extra difficult to differentiate. I totally agree.

The thunderstorms a comin today. Gonna go from the 80's today to the 40's by tomorrow night. A long line of storms with yellows and reds in the radar working their way across Florida right now. Very very windy at the moment.

Laura Bush a one tough petunia, and self seeds like weeds. This is one patch of my volunteers last summer, pink and purple mixed. If you want one that will volunteer, this is the one for you.

Karen

Awesome Karen. So nice and full they are.

I would go for volunteers! I liked those Wave tunias.. but up hear they are pretty pricey.. I heard they volunteered..well it did not happen for me the year I got them. Im hoping whats dropped seed last year from my Total Madness wil come again.

I had rain yesterday jon and now today I got a 1/2 inch of snow again.
Well, as they say, dont like the weather.. wait a minute...ugh.. gonna be one of those springs I bet. There goes the salt shakers again.. Yano this year is the first time my skin has really been like an alligator.. I cant take it anymore.. someone turn that dang snomachine OFF!!!!!! Plez and Thank you!