EXTREMELY interesting article about "organics" vs. chems

Rosemania.com has uploaded an extremely interesting article by Dr. Jeff Gillman discussing the Environmental Impact Quotient of many of the most popular organic and inorganic remedies to our problems in the garden. He has researched and assigned a number to represent the environmental impact of each of these and published them in table form. The article takes a while to load into your browser, so be patient... it's well worth the read. The results may surprise you! I was happy to see that the overwhelming majority of the chem products we use in our own garden are considered environmentally friendly. I was also shocked to see the horrible EIQ that was earned by Bayer's 3-in-1 that so many of our friends in gardening currently use. It impacts the environment about 3 times more than some of the chems that I have been criticized (in other forums) for using...!!! Who knew?! Well, obviously, Dr. Gillman... and now we can know too!

http://www.rosemania.com/roseiq.pdf

(The pic is Josephine, because I wanted something pretty on my thread!)

Bliss, this is a very informative link....and an eye opener. I tend to believe the old "tried and true" methods are better than the new chemicals. Well, I was surprised to see that Bordeaux mixture, cited in many old garden books and manuals, has a very high environmental impact! The only product on the lists that I use is Green Cure, and I was relieved to see its impact is very very low.

i will check out green cure. i use as few chems as possible. couldn't maintain the gravel paths wisome th out round up however. the whole thing is scary. will check out green cure. luckily clems do not get many bugs...if you can keep the ear wigs and snails away, not too many other bug issues.
now those spider mites on the alberta spruce, that is a big issue.......hopefully the milky sport i laid down last month will help with the jap beetles in july....

Guru, you won't have any Japanese Beetles this season, after a milky spore application. There is no better natural vs bug product than this. It will work for a minimum of 10 years, too. And to think it was discovered by a government agency!
For those pesky mites, try CedarCide Industries "Yard Safe". I used this for the first time last year, and it's also effective against mildew. I e-mailed the product developer, Dr. Ben, to ask which of their formulas I could spray on phlox. Any questions about the products (it's a slightly confusing website to say the least) - e-mail the Doc and he'll answer you w/in 24 hours. http://www.cedarcide.com/productguide.asp Scroll down to product #6006.

Robin, the active ingredient in that product is cedar oil... and the rate of application is rather high. The result is a higher impact than many of the "chemicals" that site is criticizing. Did you notice in the article that two highly-touted organic solutions have the absolute highest environmental impact? The list of offenders is topped by Saf-T-Side and Safer Insecticidal Soap.

Evey...I think your posting is very important and should be read by all...I quit using chemicals in my gardens about 20 some odd years ago..people just weren't aware of the run off of chemicals that get into our watertable and that most chemicals such as "Bayer's 3-in-1" and other insect pesticides and fungus treatments are detrimental to not only our environment,health (cancerous) but nature's normal "balance" in our gardens become skewed and destroyed....When I lived in Lafayette Louisiana I was using such chemicals because I had so many roses and was told by my local nurseryman (And rose Society from Shreveport) that they would get rid of leaf fungus because I lived in such a humid part of the country..WELLLL... NO ONE told me that using such chemicals would KILL OFF all of my beneficial insects and allow the Bad insects to TAKE OVER my gardens...it was a bloody mess and nightmare...you had to be there to see the total devastation of my gardens!..that experience caused me to start researching and educating myself! Then I began my organic journey and utilizing the releasing of beneficial insects into my gardens..
ALSO...during that journey I learned the beneficial effects of utilizing organics such as compost and composted cowmanure and that lead to me top dressing my flower beds each year with that and mulching..this yearly regime created very rich soil and my plants flourished like never before.,.because healthy soil=happy flowers and plants...feeding them everything they need..hence my love for my alfalfa tea and organic sprays...seeing the results in my own gardens made me a vocal advocate of these practices..thanks for making people aware...Jeanne

Okey doke, since several of us were wondering about the impact of Neem, I wrote to find out if it had been tested. It was, and is listed simply under "Oil"... EIQ of 27.5. I was also directed to a link of the original research from Cornell University. For ease of loading, I've excerpted the Total EIQ list from that site and included the reference to the Cornell page for anyone who wants to see all the data. Here's a link to the shorter, faster-loading, excerpted list of all 326 organics and chems that were tested:

http://eveysblissfulgarden.com/eiqvalues.htm

Uh oh! I'll have to do some heavy research on the CedarCide issue, bliss. My application is minimal, but I will be very disappointed if I can't use it anymore. I trusted its safety, mainly because the US Army commissioned Dr Ben, an organic chemist, to formulate a safe product to send to the troops in the middle east to combat sand fleas. (Imagine these pesky things getting under your battle gear, as if our troops don't have enough to worry about.)

I didn't see cedar oil (Cedar Cide) anywhere on the lists. The study didn't seem to cover any of the "trendy" new plant oil extracts, like cedar, peppermint (Rose Pharm) or geranium (Bug Band).
Do you remember where you saw the information?

Robin, that study won't have published results on "trendy" products because it's based on years of research. If a product name is new, then it can't have been investigated long enough to be published. If you pull up the original study (address is on the page I uploaded) you will see their methodology. The cedar oil has essentially the same environmental impact as insecticidal soap... almost the same rate of application for it to be effective. Looking at the results in that first study (first link posted) shows a very high environmental impact because of the dosage and rate of use in order to achieve effectiveness.

I'm not going to worry about it then. A modest spray on phlox is all I use in the garden. Inside, I use another of their cedar oil products on baseboards and under sinks. It's kept my kitchen and bathrooms free from carpenter ants and roaches. I think these pose more of a health threat than a little cedar oil.

"Josephine" is in her full glory, Blissful! Thanks so much for the links. I've printed them out for future reference.