Bokashi Part 3

Continuing discussion of Bokashi style "composting".

We came from this thread (Bokashi Part 2):
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/821756/

Please use this new thread for further discussions on Bokashi. Part 2 takes too long to load.

Hey GM,
This give a good opportunity to start a new method! I have heard this referred to as the "Kim Chee" method because it is a liquid method and came from Korean users of Effective Microorganisms™.

Instead of using EM•1® Bokashi, you use Activated EM•1® Microbial Inoculant as a type of brine to soak food wastes in for 3-5 days and "pickle" them.

You make Activated EM•1® Microbial Inoculant (AEM1) in the bokashi bucket and then add food wastes after meals and meal prep. The wastes are soaked for 3-5 days to pickle. You strain the liquid (saving it for one more round) and bury the wastes as you did with the original bokash method.

After the 2nd round, the AEM1 can get a little stinky, but is still chock full of nutrients and microbes. Use at a rate of 1 tsp per gallon through a sprayer (pump or hose-end).

If anyone wants to try this method, please report. Let us know if you like it better or if the "dry" method is better, etc.
Eric

This is totally random, but check out this site: http://www.pooktre.com/ I can't believe what this guy did with the trees! Really cool and I wanted to share.
Eric

Looks like the pooktre group is expanding on the work of Axel Erlandson. His "sculpted" trees are known as the "circus trees". They've been move to Bonfante Gardens to preserve them.
http://www.arborsmith.com/treecircus.html

That is so cool! I don't this I have the patience to do that.

I'll be one of the people trying the new method. Being rather lazy, this will work out perfect for me.

I think I'm already doing something of a hybrid method between the two, at least that's what happens when I run out of "dry" Bokashi. I'm spritzing the kitchen scraps with AEM and then fermenting for two weeks.

This "kim chee" method might work better for the community garden. I want to give folks an easy way to dispose of the Bermuda grass so that we don't add it to the regular compost.

I'm guessing you let the EM1 sit for awhile til the ph goes down and then add veges or whatever? Can you use grass and weeds that are dried out already or does that matter?

BTW I have juice now, but the ph is still 4.0. Can I spray with this now?

Yes, you can mix stuff in there.
I have never taken the pH of the juice out of the buckets. It is NOT EM•1®, so I don't think it follows the same "rules". It has been a few years since I used the buckets as well so I don't have any around to do sample testing with at this point. The pH should be slightly higher than EM•1® since the pH of bokashi is higher.

GM, fermenting the bermuda will work really well since the fermentation process starts to break down the lignin of the grass (and all plant materials) making them unable to grow or sprout again. You might want to let bermuda ferment for 3-4 weeks to really make sure it is fully fermented.
Eric

Eric - what are you using instead of buckets?

Holes in the ground. I dig a hole and add the food waste either spray with AEM1 or add bokashi if I have some made. Then I cover the material with the dirt.

Interesting. I find myself wondering what your neighbour's think seeing you out there every night after dark, digging holes, dropping stuff in, spraying, and burying over........

Ok, I finally got a chance to spray my bokashi juice! I used 1 tsp per gallon, but I remember somebody said to make it weaker for new transplants. How new is new? I have some daylilies I planted about 2 weeks ago and more to plant still.

Also I vaguely remember a discussion about not using certain things in the bucket if you're going to spray anything edible. Or did I read that wrong. I'm asking because I used some chicken scraps in my bokashi bucket and I have a vege garden to spray still.

LOL @ Laurie1..... sounds suspect to me... :-)

I do the digging in the day...when the neighbors are out at work...If I do a little at a time, they will never notice!

If you got your ratios correct, a day lily can tolerate up to about 1:200, about 1/2 ounce per gallon (1 tbsp or 15ml). I don't think you'll cause any problems. If you sprayed the leaves with too strong of a solution, it could burn or spot them, but that will go away over the season and not harm the plant.

If I put meat and fish in my bokashi bucket can I use that to spray veges. I am just wondering because of the bacteria from the chicken and fish.

Yes, the fermentation process controls all pathogenic bacteria... assuming the fermented materials in the buckets do not have a foul smell.

Great, thanks Eric. I'm already seeing results of the first spraying I did. My brazilian plume is pluming everywhere.:)

I have some salad dressing and marinades etc. in the fridge that are fixing to expire. They won't mess up my bokashi will they?

I am on my 5th day of activation, still gassing but the ph hasn't dropped below 4. Can I add something to speed it along. More water, more EM1, mo lasses?

What's the current ambient temperature? Mine finishes brewing faster in warmer weather than in cooler weather.

The brew is in the garage. It is currently 97 degrees outside. Don't exactly know what the temperature of the garage is but if I were to hazzard a guess, I would guess 80-85. So, do you think that after 5 days and I haven't dropped below 4 is ok? And, I just have to wait longer? It is not cool here, this is the blazing hot desert.

Let it keep fermenting and test again in a few days.
Mine takes a couple of weeks, but then our temps are lower.

Thanks gm. I was concerned about the brew because three little one's from next door came over and distracted me when I was making it up. I thought maybe I messed up the ratio and it just wasn't going to drop down to the desired pH.

OK, I have a question about the yeasty lookin' stuff that forms in my bokashi juice. If I shake the bottle up will that stuff break up so it can go through the sprayer nozzle? Or do I strain it out and use it for future bokashi? BTW my plants are really lovin' this stuff. I have daylilies that have just been sitting there all year and all of a sudden they have beautiful new leaves.

I'm a really lazy composter, but I'm intrigued by Bokashi. I have a compost bin out at the back corner of my yard, built of pallets (so it doesn't rot up against my neighbor's fence)-I add grass clippings, shredded leaves, household stuff, dead plants (mostly potting soil)-it's only watered by rain & I don't turn (although I alternate sides).

I have an Espoma compost starter -Biotone Starter plus ( w/ mycorrhizae & beneficial bacteria)-what if I sprinkle a bit of this on my household stuff (coffee grounds, eggshells, veg trimmings), in the bucket in the garage? I know I should get the EM, but in the meantime...?

rt,
What is the range of the pH paper you have? We have a bunch of trouble-shooting things we can go through for the activation process. The main thing is that you use a clean container with a screw-on cap that seals tightly. After mixing, make sure you keep the lid on tightly and simply release pressure after it starts gassing. It usually takes 2-3 days for gassing to start...assuming you used warm water to make the product (bath water is good). In Tempe, this time of year, keeping it at room temperature, it should start gassing in about 2 days.
The finished product should look and smell very much like the EM•1® Microbial Inoculant you originally purchased. If it smells foul (a sulfur smell), it has spoiled. Spoiling can happen because of bad molasses or if the container was contaminated or not airtight.
If it smells fine, you're ready to go!

Hi Thistle,
The Biotone sounds like it is a good thing...I have a few customers combining EM1 applications with mycorrhizae inoculants and getting very good results. I am sure it won't work exactly the same as EM1, but EM1 is compatible with all beneficial microbial cultures.
Eric

Eric, I bought the pH paper from the EM site. I used 3 clean 2 liter soda bottles so I have 3 batches going. Today the pH dropped down to the 3.5 area. It is still gassing and it smells just like it should. When I release the pressure on the bottles they bubble up and the product is really moving around. Looks like I just needed to wait longer. It has taken 2 weeks for the pH to drop down to 3.5.

Eric:
I ferment my kitchen scraps with fermented wheat bran (final pH around 4.8) in a kitchen composter and strain the juice off every couple of days. It takes me around 3-4 weeks (spring and winter) or so to fill up(it'll go faster in the summer). Oftentimes, the odor goes from a pleasant cidery type to something that is indescribably nasty (usually within 2-3 week period). I do not put meat or dairy in this ferment, just typical compost food scraps. Is this sludge salvageable, or should I dig a hole where it doesn't matter and then "chuck and fill?" Thanks.
Jim

Eric, when you do the fermentation thing do you let the AEM sit and start to ferment and lower the ph before you add the material? Or can you add the EM to water and molasses and then add the material right away?

Hi RTL,
considering the ambient temperature, that still seems like a long time. Did you use organic molasses? That takes longer sometimes....

Hi Jim,
There could be a couple reasons for this. One could be that you are not using enough bokashi. Another could be that the container is not airtight enough and is going rancid. And another could be that there is too much liquid.
When you first start getting a little of a nasty smell, try adding in some sugar (granulated will work fine.) Stir it in and close the container. Check the next day for smells. If it still smells, try adding some EM1 Microbial Inoculant.

I would bury it pretty deep and pour in some AEM1...make a gallon (3/4C EM1, 3/4C molasses, and fill the gallon container)...and pour it in the hole. Don't bury anything above it. The rotting stuff produces methane, which can kill plants. Just let it break down over the course of a few months.

Hi Silver,
Which material are you speaking of? If for the food waste, Let the AEM1 brew before adding the raw food waste...

Eric, yes I was talking about food scraps and yard clippings.

Ya' know, the hardest thing about using bokashi is deciding how. Which method to try. There are so many different directions to go with this stuff, how do you decide?

I buried my first batch of bokashi in an area that I plan to make a flower bed hopefully in the fall. It went pretty stinky before I could get it buried though because animals got into the plastic sack and then it wasn't anaerobic anymore. The second batch is cooking and making juice, but I haven't used all the juice from the first batch. This week when I spray I'm going to use a hose end sprayer for the first time so I can spray the trees and grass too. I'll use it up faster that way. It only keeps 45 days or so right?

The juice from the buckets only lasts (stays good) for a couple days. Activated EM1 should be used up in 30-45 days after the pH drops below 4.0.

I use/recommend whatever works best for you and your routines. I like to bury stuff in the ground, add some AEM1, and cover. I do this year-round in Tucson...and used to do the same method when I lived in Massachusetts.

I am doing another lecture/class...this time in Phoenix: http://www.phoenixpermaculture.org/events/event/show?id=2008067:Event:8482

I will also be handing out samples and be available for questions at the Scottsdale Whole Foods Market from 4-7pm on Saturday the 21st.

Here is a picture of school children collecting food waste.

Eric - what a wonderful idea to introduce Bokashi composting to the school canteen - good use of all those things little ones won't eat! Full marks!

Eric when you bury your stuff in the ground do you spray only once with AEM1 or do you uncover the stuff and respray? DH would find this method more appealing. He hates this bokashi bucket stuff.:)

Hey Erik, I am confused. How often should we spray the bokashi juice or AEM1 on veggies? I think I've read so much I've confused myself.

Did up a batch of AEM1 which came out perfect (big smile, and kudos to DH) I've convinced my local Master Gardener group at Mary Washington House to let me give it a try on the small veggie garden. The powers that be had revamped that area and evidently really "totaled" the area to remove whatever was there earlier. So this garden is still relatively new, MGs have brought in lots of top soil and compost, and worked it in to the area, the soil looks ok, but it looks like it could use a "boost". I've also got enough "juice" to spray their compost bins, which don't seem to be working too well. We can fix that.....grin I'm really excited about trying this. My veggies and fruit trees are looking good and the sheet composting is really cooking! I'm so pleased with the whole methodology and glad I found this thread! Thanks Erik!!