OK. Who's MAKING Their Own Dirt?

Soferdig, that's amazing! I guess the bottom line is new chips in the ground is a no-no if you want to keep your plants (assuming you're not trying to kill weeds!). Chips as mulch is OK because by the time they reach the soil they'll naturally break down. Having said that...is there a good way to add nitrogen to the soil just so I can sleep at night??

Sofer that is too sweet. Good stuff. I want to show of my new seedlings that I'm using for my compost. (grin) Check this out!

And this is the one that's done. :)

Nice piece of soil Doc. What is that going to be used for? My DW won't let me stack any plastic around our garden so I have to use the decorative stuff. It is kind of nice when the sun is on it. I always add nitrogen by mixing manure and always have some waiting to be used. Lots to get around here. This picture is the sawdust mixed with manure spread. The wood chips are as you say in a small amount relative to the total soil being made.

Same photo a year later. Now ready to plant. I will just add compost waiting from all of last year and rototill it in.

The first one will be used for starting 2 more compost piles. The finished one in the 2nd pic will start being introduced to my new beds as soon as we can get in with the tiller. We've had rain for 3 weekends straight and the ground is still to we to work....sigh I am READY!! and want to get going.......LOL

You are sooooooo lucky to have rain. We get on the ground and worship when we get it here. I have to irrigate the last 4 years just to getting the soil soaked. But that gives me good control to the plants.
Close up of year old soil.

Thx Docgipe..hey Soferdig!..(I've been away from DG for awhile)...so I guess that putting the fresh chips on top is no big deal..but I still have the question of whether or not they'll actually kill the weeds? If they will..then I'm good to go finally!! With no chemicals!

I like the idea of no-till and in-place composting..it will be a ton easier on my back and legs.

I have used wood chips as mulch and found it only a source of weed growth. I haven't experienced nitrogen deficit with wood chips. Maybe it would help and I would try it and tell us how it works. My chips I gathered were over 6 months old from the chipper so maybe you should get fresh chipped for weed control. I use the wood chips in the soil to hold moisture and attract worms deep into the soil.

This message was edited Apr 17, 2008 9:56 PM

Thx..Soferdig...the chips I have at the moment are fresh..just chipped last month...guess I'll try them in this channel area I'm trying to control..and see what happens. Don't think I'm gonna put them on the beds though...I might try some around the pear trees and see if they'll keep the shoots down some. I'll keep ya posted.

For what it's worth:
fresh wood chips laid to a depth of 6" have not curtailed weed growth here especially the tap-rooted types, but it did facilitate pulling them.
Annual weeds still abound in this wonderful growth medium, but I believe most of that is due to seed dispersal via wind/birds.
The only downside to any mulch here is enabling the rapid spread of the dreaded stoloniferous grasses.
No visible nitrogen deficit after several years, however, I do use different type mulch around the base of the plants in the orchard, leaving the wood chips for paths & unplanted areas.

Kayte, what type of mulch do you use other than wood chips?

Whitney Farms makes a nice fine-textured mulch - bark based, it is available & often on sale, which is when I buy it.
Otherwise, wood chips are from Doug Fir, Western red Cedar, or whatever my friend brings from his stump grinding business. These work well here in our wet climate for many of the plants. Any planting areas that are more Xeric get minimal (thin) mulch.
When I don't have access to wood chips/bark i use chopped pine needles, or dried grass clippings mixed with coffee grounds.

Katye...........Western Red Cedar mulch is a good one. It stays mulch longer but rots in due time just as any wood will. Your mixes deliver the goodies for the plants by rotting a bit faster. All is excellent so long as you do not overload the soil by more than the little that gets in when you work to do your planting. Many folks do not know the mini composting that goes on between the soil and what falls or is placed on it. I have many flower beds that have been under three to four inches of wood chips for forty years and get nothing else but a little uncheduled left over aerobic tea. Our flowers do better and grow stronger with less rather than more fertilizing. My efforts beyond mulch is nothing but occasional weeding of what the birds plant for me. I even let the fall frosted leaves fall where they will. I only one time in all those years had a fungus problem that forced me to reach for a two time application of a fungicide stronger than Neem Oil.
......That's why I say I am 98% organic and the other two percent I lie about. :) I've never been able to bring in my peaches, grapes and apples without that two percent. I think it not possible to be completely organic with just one tree rather than an orchard to work with. We do know of growers with acres to work with that absolutely do go organic with great success. I could use the chain saw and go totally organic by eliminating just a few difficult plants.
.......We have family in Portland, Oregon. I love your area. We keep an eye on a couple of your growers and one great nusery firm that really work at using less harsh chemicals and the use of more organic practices. Gorsh you even have a few truely organic grape and wine producers not to mention your filbert orchards. I think your area may be leaders in the efforts to be truely organic producers.

Doc - I love the area too, just wish it was warmer so I could grow stellar tomatoes, and chiles that are actually hot!
I don't have a greenhouse, and I'm thinking that it would be a good investment, especially for fulfilling my tomato/chile pepper addiction.
In the meantime, I'll do what I can with what I've got, and give thanks that my soil is so wonderful on my slice of Earth!

Yes Katye you are so fortunate. But I think that all is fun to change the source of your gardening. I only miss the maturity of my garden here vs what I left in Bothell/Woodinville.

TEMPORARY GREENHOUSES............For the small operation I now get into I really like the little pop up temporary greenhouses. If I had a real greenhouse I would tend to be way over producing for the need. This one folds nicely and I can still handle it without help. A couple of bricks tie it to the mother earth. No extra space or benches is an advantage for me. If I get to planting and have space I plant like I eat popcorn.....way to much.

docgripe...lets hear some more about the temporary green houses. Been struggling for months between greenhouses and hoop houses. That analogy to popcorn hit me square between the eyes, I even purchase organic popcorn by the 50# lot. Did just that with hot peppers, over planted, and haven't room to pot up tomaoto seedlings. But gotta have me one of those popup greenhouses. They make perfect sense for my situation.

mraider you could stop planting seeds also. LOL I finally am able to leave seeds that I think I won't use back in the bag and group bag them with all the others that gave me too many seeds. I have successfully planted seeds that were over 3 years old. Actually I now mostly buy plants at the nurseries. After all it gives me another reason to go into their big greenhouse.

Soferdig...gotcha...those were tow and three year old seed, but I couldn't stop, I thought I might trade some but not a great deal of demand for hot peppers in MT.

OK...........I estimate that my temporary greehouse might outlast anything but a glass other greenhouse. The reason is simple. UV kills greenhouse covers. These little pop ups only see the sun for a month a year to help with the garden seedlings. They are lite enough that we elders can still handle it. They have nice ventilation and can be heated with a seventy five watt shop light in most cases I have seen over the past five years. They don't raise your taxes and you need not insure them. There are no specks or codes for temporary anything in most areas.

The only thing that might come up worth your consideration is areas in the country where wind is a serious factor. I have never had a problem but my average winds are less than many areas would experience. Most come with stakes. I just use brick to hold mine in place on the patio.

I can't tell you where or from whom I actually bought this one. I have seen them in the catalogs. Google one up and jump right in.

Oh my. Here I am stressing about all the seeds I still have that I don't know if I'll have time or room for....and all I have to do is not use them. I knew that. Some that I bought in 2007 and that have been happily sitting in the 'fridge are popping up quite nicely, thank you. So, the ones that I bought this year should certainly be fine next year. Very interesting discussion on greenhouses. Another "someday" goodie.

MAKING MY OUR OWN POTTING MEDIUM

My grandson is in the center ring of our Spring Circus. The potting soil is twenty percent good finished compost, sixty percent good garden soil and the ballance is Organic Choice potting medium into which we sprinkled a small amount of organic fertilizer by Fertrell 4-2-4. We stuck onions close to the edges and mixed leaf lettuces in this pot. This is one of a six pot stack and then there are three smaller pots in the stack. The finished plantings will be some falls, some spikes, begoinas on the top and mixed flowers and herbs up and around the stack. The stack may end up being two stacks because it just looks a bit to tall for the location and other pots we have to work into the display.
These stacks are fun to dream on. Anything can and likely will happen.

Doc - is that one of those stackable planters you raved about last year? there's a website - correct?
Interesting - how many cubic feet of soil (approx)?
If it's not too much trouble, could you shoot a photo of the finished "stack"? Unplanted is fine - trying to do a visual...

Finally - pop up GH: I get a constant breeze, and some pretty goofy wind on occasion, blowing one way and then changes direction. I'm sure they can be staked - I did find a small rigid type, for not a small price!

thanks!!!

Off the subject Doc, but what type of grass is that your growing?

Sure I will shoot a picture of the stack planter. You may also give the words "Stacking Flower Pots" to Google and see several fully planted and in bloom. The young lady (young to me) is a real go getter. She has a new stacking pot that is out of this world as her new offering this year.

The grass I am growing is started with the cheapest seed out their usually called Contractor's Sun and Shade blend. Also known as Playground Grass. The spot you saw was planted last year onto good top soil that was skinned off for our patio development. We gave it a little Fertrell Organic 4-2-4. In a year or two the only thing left will be native grasses which when cut at three or four inches in height and fed only the cuttings will out perform any purchased seed. The real secret is cutting at three or four inches to shade out the weeds and give the cuttings a chance to self mulch. There will be no thatch build up if the harsh chemicals are out of the management program. The other major factor is human difficulty changing cutting habits to what all grass seed producers have always suggested....a three or four inch cutting. Cutting the harsh fertilizers to organic will set your soil health back in tune with the earthworms which will then deposit their castings to keep it even nicer. This takes a bit of nerve and patience but it will work for anyone at least in the Northeast and Northcentral areas. I have never had much experience with the so called carpet grasses used commonly in Southern lawns.

We do little but cut and let the cuttings fall where they will. Occasionally one of our nasty native broad leaf creepers requires a spot application of Weed Be Gone which is now greatly over priced in comparrison with a better same chemical in a Beyer's Spectricide line of broad leaf treatment products. I see this discovery at Lowe's. Read the two labels. You will see exactly what I am talking about.



This message was edited Apr 24, 2008 9:48 AM

Here is the Stacking Flower Pots. My original thought was to go all in one stack. That over powered the situation by appearing to tall as one unit. The bottom pots are twenty four inches wide. The smaller are twelve inch pots. Note that the stack comes with one bottom with wheels. The wheels did not work well on our bricks. The stacks as you now see them needs another bottom without wheels to look nice. The other bottom is available. I just have not ordered it in as of this hour.

I have no idea how much soil. We mixed up a huge wheel barrel load of compost and good garden soil and added one bag of Miracle Grow...Organic Choice potting soil and a light dusting of Organic 4-2-4 Fertilizer. It's a bit early to trust our last frost date. That is why it now contains only stuck spring onions and some mixed leaf lettuce which have not yet emerged. I shall finish the accent production with herbs and flowers...some that fall over the edges like petunias that do that as well as traditional falls. I know that the herbs will have to be pruned heavily to say in tune with the rest of the plantings.

I must be patient now. Sure would not like to render such an undertaking to Jack Frost who is hiding and waiting for our next full moon some fifteen or twenty days from today. Then we can plant with reasonable safety.

The plantings will be mulched with ground half rotted leaves. There is some mulch in place to cover the lettuce and onions that are in there now. We will eat out the onions save a few left for spikes. The lettuce and herbs will be overkill too but we enjoy mixing them within the planting.

I think you can count the pots as presented. A bit pricy but they are of extreme good quality. I can see them being good for any time I may have left to play with them.

Thanks for the photo & the websire. i tried to find the thread that you posted this on & wandered off into lala land! Oh the diversions....
Those look pretty sturdy, and would offer an interesting shape for plantings. I suppose one with limited space could grow strawberries in these - how useful!

I will have to check them out & make a purchase for "research" purposes!
Nice sunny day there Doc - good for you!!!
we are awaiting the return of the Glorious Golden Sky Orb...

Thank you muchly doc...exactly what I have been looking for. The locals here all use some type of grass which they cut two or three times a week and water day and night. Although their lawns look like golf course greens it doesn't make any sense to me. From the way you have explained it I would be able to use the cuttings if I chose for the compost bin. Neighbors have offered their cut grass but with the exception of one they all use the herbicides, pesticides, and fertilizers I don't need in my garden. Thanks again doc...your usual sage advice.

Of course the grass....any that is not nuked to death can go to compost or left fall to become mulch where it hits the ground. After June the first I have grass available at the landfill. By this time the most common practice of Weed and Feed product has been washed off by many rainfalls.