New Palms

Its Spring for us in South Florida. Now is a great time to plant before its too hot to be outside!!! I went shopping again.......I really can't help myself! Now I have to decide where in the yard to put this cool palm- Wallichia disticha.

Been dying to get a Licuala grandis, too. Little one is a Chamaerops humilis var. cerifera.

nice!

aaaah you got a cerifera????? i've been looking everywhere for one of thos, but no one around here has them!!!

I've had this idea lately that it would be great if there were someone who could make a living mail ordering some of the plants Florida has to offer. I know Top Tropicals and a few others fairly successfully mail order stuff, and some of the nurseries who have been hit hard by the slow down in the economy and housing market sure could use a new avenue to sell plants.

Yeah. It's basically spring here too, so here are some of my updates...

I got to plant my royal palm.

Here is my triangle palm in the ground for spring.

Here is a before picture of my bismarck...

And here is now.

Here is a before picture of my travelers palm...

And here he is now, big and growing strong!

Hope you enjoyed. I'll have more soon.

Most *palm specialty* nurseries already do mail order. In fact all the main ones in SoCal and FL ship. Also, the #1 place for online ordering of rare palms does so out of HI and ships worldwide. I have received a lot of good palms out of Fl via the mail. :)

FFP- I love the way that Bismark is fattening up and getting leafy. It almost got shorter, but I can see that caliper forming! Travelers at that stage are crazy fast growers. Give it some Calcium sulfate for fun and get back to me!!!!!

WebInt- who in Fla mail orders? Do you find they often have a minimum? I get those kind of requests but don't know where to turn people. In my industry, I believe that if I don't have what the customer wants I would like to at least still know that a plant will be sold if I tell them where they can go.

I have not been charged a minimum. Understand that like Top Tropicals and their plants, the palms are small when shipped. Hard to ship big things.

If you wish to refer people, I recommend you use http://www.floribundapalms.com/.

Here is another one from Hawaii that has great quality and service. They really spend time helping you pick out ones that are large and will do well inside (for me) and when to ship (winter) etc. They also are very generous with giving free palms with the order. http://www.growpalms.com/

I also lived right around the corner from where they are. I wish they had been there when I lived there!

ok... well i'm an inexperienced minor who doesnt know much about money or buying stuff. sooooo now that i've explained why i'm asking such a dumb question, i'll ask it. what's a minimum

its the one drawback to buying palms from a palm grower in Hi-the minimum is the least amt of money that you have to spend before shipping costs. So if the minimum is $ 100, then you have to buy at least that much in palms.

that's what i thought!

Here's my three new ones that a friend GAVE us... these were their planting day photos, but they are doing very well so far

Another foxy... we've been doctoring this one... it's way too yellow!

And a triangle...

Here's an update on the Wallichia. Imagine sitting at this bench and looking out over the pond. Now, look to the right.

It's a little weedy around the pond margins.........and it's opened a new leaf since this picture with all the rain we've had. I have a neighbor with one in full sun here about 20' tall- it's phenomenal!

The licuala has been especially happy with it's semi shade corner on the porch.

Nice photos f4f. I like seeing update pictures! I just bought a few Wallichia disticha seeds. I cant wait for them to germinate! When I get a chance, I will take some update pictures to. The bismarck is really jumping along and so is the Travelers palm.

Any advice on how to treat Foxtails? I need to nourish mine some after the winter and don't know what to use?? I see that you've been working on yours ...

Well, I haven't posted any photos of the Foxtails that we have, but I might be able to help you out. Foxtails are especially hungry palms - they really love regular Magnesium and Iron. Are yours in the ground or in pots? If in the ground, what is your soil type. Watering schedule? Let me know!

Mine are in the ground and rally, the rain takes care of the watering around here (which is pretty often).

F4F - How often should foxy's be fed?? My little one (above) is still yellowish. A new frond has opened and it's a little darker, but to me, it still looks unhealthy. Of course, it hasn't been in it's new home too long (since Feb) and maybe it's still establishing roots, etc. Could it be Iron deficient? Other than epsom salt, what's a good, well-rounded fertilizer? I hear that Rockledge Gardens has a fertilizer, but I haven't been down there yet to get a bag.

Rockledge- great place. Ask if they have some Leonard's palm special. It's the best!!!! Ok, for both of you guys I would be applying granular palm fertilizer 3 to 4 times a year. If you get sufficient rainfall the nutrients will be in a flux of being washed into the ground and subsequently leached out. In addition, when there are severe or specific deficiencies, you can use specific products to correct that quicker than waiting for the general palm formulation granular apps to build up the nutrients. I.E., not having a picture of your palms to go on, I would prescribe a chelated micronutrient liquid product to be watered in- you can use that stuff say two times in one month in addition to an immediate granular application- see what that does. You can also toss a little epsom salts and ironite out there in between the granular apps. Let me know if that doesn't correct everything within a few months and I can get more specific if you guys give me pictures and soil types. Good luck!

Thanks F4F.... I think that's the stuff we've been told to use from Rockledge! Take a look at the palm I posted above... it's the little yellow foxy... about 11 posts up from this one.

Hmmmm. Pretty yellow, and also the Triangle below. I assume that June had decent precipitation for you as it did us? And also, how much did you water them prior to that? Decent amount of organic matter on the surface of the soil- did you dig a bigger hole and put amended soil with OM all around the root ball in a space of 6 inches or more? If yes to all above, then they are rooted by now since March. When did you last apply fertilzer and is there at least one new leaf. If so, how much greener is it by comparison?

Here is one tip you could have done back when you got the palms- it is called foliar feeding and it sends nutrients to a limited extent directly into the leaves (repeat applications are necessary and foliar feeds are not 100% corrective for certain deficiencies in certain species and or soil conditions.) 1. Use a liquid or soluble chelated micronutrient product (a good one that is not derivated from lignin sulfates) 2. Wet the leave. 3. Use an adjuvant or spreader sticker. 4. Use the FOLIAR APPLICATION rate on the label (rule of thumb- 1/4 of the "regular" or soil drench rate.) 5. Spray liberally to drip on leaves.

There are in simplifed terms, 3 levels of "fast ways" to get nutrients to palms. The fastest would be foliar nutrient applications. Next are liquid applications with solubles or chelates to the roots, and third are granular applications because they rely on watering in over time to be released (regular granular versus time release is faster releasing- usually perfectly fine if not ideal for landscapes in FL, but time release is ideal for potted plants.)

Another product yet are biostimulants/organic chelates/humus extracts/compost teas. These perform a multitude of functions, although in general I do not rely on them as complete fertilizers. Depending on the product they can provide organic matter and structure to the soil, increase water holding capacity, increase long term nutrient availability, act as a specific nutrient supplement, stimulate root growth and or biological acitivity, etc. The problem is no one product does it all and some of the claims of biological acitivity are species specific and often missapplied to general gardening.

Here is what I would have done with your brand new very chlorotic palm (I am correct from memory - they were dug versus popped out of pot, yes?)

Water every day for the first 3 days.
Water every 2 to 3 days for the first 3 weeks.
Foliar feed with Super 11 chelated humus extract from OrganicApproach 2 to 4 times every two weeks for the first 2 months as needed.
After one week and 3 drenched with regular humus extract or used dry formulation worm castings when planted in amended soil.
Continue regular watering and made a light Leonard's palm special or Walpole Wonder granular application at four to eight weeks in conjunction with a liquid feeding of Jack's soluble fertilizer. By month 3 to 4 hit with a couple of good handfulls of aforementioned granular products (depending on local availability) in conjunction with a watering in of an epsom salts and Turf and Garden Pro (or Sequestrene 138, Sprint 330 or Jack's Petunia feed.)
Repeat last in 2 months.

Heading in to winter use judgement based on what how mild/rainy the season turns out to be.

Now, what I just prescribed is more than what I honestly bother to do with AT HOME because, well, life happens, and I have a lot on my hands. And do I have all those products around- yes, but you guys know me.

2 more lessons about gardening and this might be because my 5 year old and I went to the movies again (see I get hugs and kisses when my DH isn't home and here I am giving minute palm nutrient reccomendations instead of listening to Dave Matthews.)

You will hear a lot of opinions about gardening, as gardening is an art. Ultimately, your gardening style is the same as your personality I believe. If you are given conservative advice, then go with that if that is what makes you comfortable- the plant will likely survive no matter what advice you take 9 times out of 10.

Ancient ancestral secret from sacred scroll- the secret to gardening is ............................................observation.

f4f - you are awesome! Thank you so much for the advice and I will see what it does to help mine look healthier. I need to get my littlest one to put out another frond as it hasn't since before last winter. I'm going to try this and see if it helps. Thank you!!

Here are some websites for a few of the products I talked about. The other ones are available in certain areas in FL and I will list those, too.

TeraVita Humus extract and Super11 chelate:
http://www.organicapproach.com/ (These guys are probably wholesale but may be able to direct you to a retail source for their products. They also have a great line of worm casting products under "Worm wonder.")

Jack's soluble fertilizers:
http://www.jacksprofessional.com/

Turf and Garden Pro
http://www.turfprousa.com/
(Marketed primarily for turf but I use for everything, esp. tomatoes and veggies- is a humus complex and a good source of chelated iron.)

Hummert International - mail order gardening catalog, lot's of good stuff for professional and homeowners
http://www.hummert.com/ (carries Sprint 330, a souble chelated iron product)

Walpole Wonder- available at Bushel Shop retail/wholesale landscape depots throughout south Florida.

Leonard I think markets mostly to growers, but Rockledge is one of the retail centers that carries that product.

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F4F - Thank you for the information. As you can see below... I have some questions! Hope you don't mind! :-)

Hmmmm. Pretty yellow, and also the Triangle below. I assume that June had decent precipitation for you as it did us? And also, how much did you water them prior to that? Decent amount of organic matter on the surface of the soil- did you dig a bigger hole and put amended soil with OM all around the root ball in a space of 6 inches or more? If yes to all above, then they are rooted by now since March. When did you last apply fertilzer and is there at least one new leaf. If so, how much greener is it by comparison?

All three palms (the two foxys and the triangle), were transplanted from the ground in February. However, it was done when I had major back surgery, so my husband was in charge. Although he does a good job, he is not the gardener in the family!! Plus, he had to do all the things that I couldn’t do around the house. So, a hole was dug and the palm dropped in and backfilled. He watered for the first couple of weeks fairly well, but then we went through that dry spell and he had a death in his family which required him to move his 80 yr old father over here near us and I was still layed up with the back recovery. The palms didn’t have the best beginning…. and they didn’t look real good when we got them!! The triangle has been transplanted once again since we got it (poor location the first time!). It’s not doing well, but again, it wasn’t doing well when we got it. If I showed you a pic of it right now, you’d prolly say “it’s done!” But, we aren’t giving up just yet.

By the way, what’s OM? What would you amend the soil with?

Each of the Foxy’s have opened a new frond recently, plus there’s another healthy spear on each. I can’t quite recall, at the moment, if the new frond was much darker or the same lighter color… but my guess is that it is still yellowish (since a contrasting color would have caught my eye and stuck in my memory). I have fertilized once and dissolved some Epsom salts in water and slowly poured it around the palm.

Here is one tip you could have done back when you got the palms- it is called foliar feeding and it sends nutrients to a limited extent directly into the leaves (repeat applications are necessary and foliar feeds are not 100% corrective for certain deficiencies in certain species and or soil conditions.) 1. Use a liquid or soluble chelated micronutrient product (a good one that is not derivated from lignin sulfates) 2. Wet the leave. 3. Use an adjuvant or spreader sticker. 4. Use the FOLIAR APPLICATION rate on the label (rule of thumb- 1/4 of the "regular" or soil drench rate.) 5. Spray liberally to drip on leaves.

Can a spreader sticker be dish washing liquid soap? Is there a specific time of day when it is best to do this? What is the soluble chelated micronutrient product and where do I find it?

There are in simplifed terms, 3 levels of "fast ways" to get nutrients to palms. The fastest would be foliar nutrient applications. Next are liquid applications with solubles or chelates to the roots, and third are granular applications because they rely on watering in over time to be released (regular granular versus time release is faster releasing- usually perfectly fine if not ideal for landscapes in FL, but time release is ideal for potted plants.)
Ok, I understand all of that!

Another product yet are biostimulants/organic chelates/humus extracts/compost teas. These perform a multitude of functions, although in general I do not rely on them as complete fertilizers. Depending on the product they can provide organic matter and structure to the soil, increase water holding capacity, increase long term nutrient availability, act as a specific nutrient supplement, stimulate root growth and or biological acitivity, etc. The problem is no one product does it all and some of the claims of biological acitivity are species specific and often missapplied to general gardening.
This is probably too much for my understanding and I’d probably be either wasting money or doing more harm than good! LOL

Here is what I would have done with your brand new very chlorotic palm (I am correct from memory - they were dug versus popped out of pot, yes?)
Yes, they were dug.

Water every day for the first 3 days. OK

Water every 2 to 3 days for the first 3 weeks. OK, have you heard of spikes that can connect to a watering system that put water right at the roots?

Foliar feed with Super 11 chelated humus extract from OrganicApproach 2 to 4 times every two weeks for the first 2 months as needed. OK

After one week and 3 drenched with regular humus extract or used dry formulation worm castings when planted in amended soil. I don’t understand this sentence.

Continue regular watering and make a light Leonard's palm special or Walpole Wonder granular application at four to eight weeks in conjunction with a liquid feeding of Jack's soluble fertilizer. By month 3 to 4 hit with a couple of good handfulls of aforementioned granular products (depending on local availability) in conjunction with a watering in of an epsom salts and Turf and Garden Pro (or Sequestrene 138, Sprint 330 or Jack's Petunia feed.) Repeat last in 2 months. OK


Now for the big news... I'm getting 11 more "adult" palms soon. There will be some Cuban Royals, double Christmas, Spindle, Coconut, Bottleneck, and some Areca's . They are all in the ground now (and look very healthy) and will be dug and transported by us. We've done a lot of research and talked to some local palm nursery's and, of course, we've asked a lot of questions to anyone who will listen! LOL So, all this information is very important to me because I want to give these trees the best chance of survival.


This message was edited Jul 14, 2008 2:25 PM

This message was edited Jul 14, 2008 2:26 PM

Yes, I can tell they were chlorotic before you got them- definitely not your fault. How is your back doing anyway? Post or Dmail me a picture of the triangle in trouble- I wouldn't give up yet! So far the yellowing hasn't progressed to manganese or born deficiency or death.

Yes, OM= organic matter

Dish washing soap is a reasonable substitute for spreader sticker. Best time to do that is morning and evening when the sun is not blazing. You should be able to find a chelated liquid micronutrient product at one the of big box stores.

About the organics- fair enough, but ordinary compost and coffee grounds are simple things you can use that are helpful and won't hurt.

Nice watering system. Drip systems are very efficient and there are usually no restrictions on them when irrigation compliance is in effect (depending on the community.)

The worm compost is a favorite organic supplement of mine. If I don't have the opportunity to use this at the time of planting, Tera Vita humus extract or TrufPro extract applied as liquid feed supplements stimulate root growth, increase the water holding capacity of the soil, and are generally something like steroids for the palm.

Good luck with all your new additions. How exciting, and I'm sure you will do great. Have you been given the opportunity prior to digging to root prune and are you familiar with that technique?

I've heard of root pruning and we talked about trying to do it, but due to time constraints and after speaking to the local palm nursery, we decided against it. We only have til the end of this month and possibly the beginning couple of weeks of August to get the palms.

Would you recommend supporting the trees after transplanting?

Ohhhhh, on the compost ! Coffee grounds I can do. I don't have a compost pile because I don't want to attract the nearby rats!! (too many fruit trees and a house that was left empty for many years... rats took up residence in the jungle out back). I just remember though... I do have unlimited access to horse manure and it's been sitting for some time (they scoop off the half of the pile that has "composted". Can I use that?? How would I use that? This is what I normally do for "dirt"... I buy the cheapest bags of top soil, cow manure (like black cow), and a bag of peat moss (all of this from Lowes... because... God bless them... they do have some cheap dirt LOL) and I put it all in a large rubbermaid garbage can (clean.. never been used for anything else) and stir it all up. My hubby has this big drill attachment that looks like a very large beater to an electric blender and it stirs things up pretty good. Then I use that concoction in pots and whenever I'm transplanting a plant into the ground (I use it as the fill dirt). Could I make some of that up... add coffee grounds and old horse manure... and use that when I plant the palms?

Also, is there any place local to get the worm compost? One of the websites you posted above is being upgraded (the one for the tera vita) and I couldn't get into it.

Finally..... I'm running out now to take some pics of the triangle.

Here is my poor triangle. Like I said, it was in sad shape when we got it, but it's had a troubled life with us too. One frond that recently opened (a small one!) was dead; however, the big spike that is starting to open at its bottom is still green... I can see the green... will post a pic of that too.

Here's the large spike that is just starting to open...