Some simple questions on starting a compost pile

When you start a new pile and have a 50/50 mix of dried material /green material do you mix them or layer them?

Do you add any type of accelerator? If so, what works best for you?

How long do you wait before you turn it the first time?

Assuming you have a pile that is at least 3 ft. x 3 ft of slightly damp material, how long does it take to begin to heat up?

Does it matter if the pile is in the shade/sun?

Does a pile heat up from microbial action only or is warm weather required to get the ball rolling?

I mix everything up----and turn it every 3 days or so.

No accelerator.

I have had the mulch pile heat up in January----so I don't think warm weather is needed.

My pile gets only morning sun, and I water it if we don't get rain for awhile and it starts to dry out---except, of course, in the winter.

1. Layer them. You're going to turn it anyway, both to aerate/ oxygenate it (you won't get a hot pile for long without oxygen).
2. I don't use an accelerator, other than coffee.
3. 10 minutes, 30 if I get distracted, heh...
4. You might want it a bit more than slightly damp. Maybe just plain damp? I mean, nothing should drip, but you should probably not feel really compelled to put your hands in it. Anyway, re: heating up - it really depends on how well you do your ratios, whether or not they are as close to the 25-30:1 optimal range, the amount of moisture, the amount of oxygen... there really is a number of variables. The fastest I've had mine heat up was a couple of days.
5. In California, I'd put it in the shade if you want worms. Not fried ones, I mean. Besides of which, how often you have to add water -if you live in the desert - might depend on how much sun it gets.
6. Microbial. I've seen them steam in cool weather.

HTH!

Ah - 3gardeners, you type faster than I do!

lol----sorry----two finger typing, at that!!

I am in the "other" California ;`} Behind the redwood curtain and almosr into Oregon. The worms here would have to come inside and jump into a skillet to fry.

I may have to tarp it once the rains start to keep it from getting too wet but it is sitting in that big raised flower bed on gravel for now with great drainage so maybe not?

I did soak each layer down before adding the next and made each layer a few inches deep

1st layer, used potting soil,
2nd layer redwood needles
3rd layer green grass/mulched leaves mixed together

repeated 3 times and topped with more used potting soil to prevent neighbors from thinking I have a pile of garbage out there.

If this pile looks promising I should be able to start a new one every 3 weeks with the clippings from a local gardener.

Would turning the pile too often delay the heat process or is it impossible to turn it too often?

Ouch! @ ==> 3Gs...

Ah yes, the California I always dreamed of... how wonderful. Especially this last week, I bet.

Do you have your compost in a container or in a pile?

Yes, this past week has been some of the nicest weather for us all year and we are far far from the fires

It is in a pile.

Zanymuse, so glad you asked all of these questions. I am thinking of getting one started and, being in WI, was really wondering about the weather and it's effect.

I have a source for manure so I am hoping to really get some good mulch.

Well, I figured I must not be the only person out here that needs some of the basics answered after reading through all the technical stuff and still being confused on details that are seemingly easy!

How right you were! And I bet there are a number of silent lurkers out there in cyberland reading and saying "Ah, NOW I get it!"

Now comes the real test. Will my pile heat up or will I have to wait longer for time and the worms to do the the job on their own.

I have the pitch fork ready to keep it turned, the hose ready to wet it as needed and a tarp to cover it if we get too much rain so my fingers are crossed and my toes are tapping impatiently to see that wonderful finished compost present itself to me.

Keep us posted. I for one will be waiting.

If you're *really* hot on having a heated pile... (sorry, couldn't resist) I'd recommend looking up some of the nitrogen/ carbon content of your ingredients on the web - there's a lot of lists out there. Unfortunately, one of the most comprehensive ones has become a paid site so it's no longer available (I'm too cheap,) but I still haven't run into anything I can't find out on the www.

However, if you're only lukewarm.... just try for 50% green stuff, 50% brown stuff. I think.

Hi everyone - compost virgin here. I have never "made" compost and I'm planning to start a compost pile this weekend. I have a spot in the back of the yard that gets lots of afternoon sun and was just going pile everything in that corner, but my neighbors may not like the site or smell of it. And I'm also afraid of attracting critters -- I'm already battling mice, squirrels, racoons and ground hogs. I was going to use a plastic trash can with holes drilled into the bottom and sides. Will that work? Does it need to be in full sun or can I put it in a shady spot? What are the best ingredients for making compost? I was planning on using kitchen scraps (vegatables, egg shells, coffee grinds), garden waste, and dried leaves. So many questions -- sorry!

Ask all the quesrions you can think of! We newbies to composting will all learn together!

Current status of my pile:

1. Sat. Morning we dumpeg in my 50/50 mix of brown and green layering them a barrow of brown then a barrow of green. We wet it down with each layer so it was good and wet.

2. Sunday morning I hosed it with water.

3. Monday mornig I turned it with a pitchfork moving the pile to the spot right next to it. I poked the fork in and lifted the top layer and it was steaming underneath the top thin layer! I HAVE HEAT!

♪ Fa ♫ LA La ☼ ♫ LA LA ♪

I watered it down again after I turned it because although it was slightly damp to the touch it wasn't all that wet. I had to really argue with myself about the watering part and trust the experts. My brain kept telling me that water will kill the heat. LOL But in compost they say that water and air are as important as brown/green.

I did notice that all the steam was coming from the green layers. So it must be the nitrogen in the greens that heats up the carbon in the browns to break it down... I think!

As for odor there is a wonderful sweet grass smell but nothing stinky about it at all. But then my pile so far has nothing but needles and grass and used potting soil in it!

♪ ♫Fa La Fa ♪ ♫ !

Zany! Awesome!! You got heat very quickly. I hope to start my first pile this coming weekend. I am nervous about starting it so I am reading the answer to every question anyone is asking here. This is a great thread!! Keep the advice coming all you "pro" composters out there.

Zany: Congratulations on the heat, just don't get over ambitious.

A too wet pile is not desirable either, so don't get too carried away. Too much water will inhibit the process, too. I moisten mine with a sprinkling can to avoid getting it too wet with the hose. Also, if your pile is hot, it's best not to turn it until the temperature falls. Do you have a compost thermometer? Not necessary, but it tells you a lot and is, I think, more fun.

After adding grass clippings mine usually gets to 130 to 150 within about a day or a day and a half. All I do then is maybe sprinkle the top with water in dry weather. I monitor it, don't touch it, until the temp falls below 90 or 100, which is usually about 5 days or more. Then I flip it, adding moisture as I go.

Disturbing a cooking pile causes it to cool. As long as it's hot, it has enough air and fuel to keep it going for a while and turning too soon can be counterproductive. It will rot anyway eventually, one way or another, but the way you manage it will change over time. You will find what works best for you.

Karen

Thanks Zantmuse!

What are the best things to use for the green ingredients? Brown ingredients?

I've had a grand summer cooking compost!

My neighbour rakes up his grass clippings, and gives them to me. I spread them out to dry (like hay, lol) then pile them up once they're good and dry.

The compost pile is started, in layers, couple buckets full of dry grass clippings, couple buckets full of chopped green weeds, then a couple buckets full of used potting soil, or manure, or cooked compost. Layer upon layer.... the piles heat up quickly, and when the temperature drops, I fork over the pile, rebuilding it and making/adding more layers.

The heat kills weed seeds, and undesirable bug/larvae....

My 'ready to use' compost pile (for next spring) is now 4feet x 4feet and 4 feet tall.... I enclose it in a 'log cabin' of cedar fence posts, cut in half. It keeps the dogs off the pile, and allows me to pile it high. On the very top, will go the very last bits from the garden, the frozen swiss chard, and the last of the lettuces and tomatoes..... the dead dry stalks of the summer flowers, all chopped up....

Next spring, the top foot or so will be the 'starter' for next summers pile.

Thanks for the added info! I added water today because I noticed it was damp in spots but some areas were almost dry. ( mostly the browns)

I don't have a thermometer so I'll just have to rely on the amount of steam heat I see when I poke it.

Because of the redwood needles draining so fast I think I may have to sprinkle it with water every day to keep it from drying out and determine as I go when it needs to be turned to kick up the heat again.

michaeljo, I don't know if one green is better than another. I am using grass clippings because Iread they are high in nitrogen and I can get them free from a gardener.

Does anyone else know if one green is better than another?

I am also curious now to see if it heats back up as quickly with the greens and browns mixed more evenly than when they were layered.

drivenbonkers, You pile sounds so great!

Mine is limited on the variety of greens/browns available but I will keep adding what I can get. I can get browns anytime in the form of newspaper and redwood needles but green is limited pretty much to grass clippings every 3-4 weeks from the gardener and tea bags from my addiction to iced tea.

The potting soil I used this time was a one time "find" ( two garbage cans full from a dump of it on the river bar)

Question: will the lack of variety in the greens make a huge difference in the nutrients available in the finished compost?

I found with my heap, that the dry grass clippings heated up the most. Once they got wet (from rain or just from the chopped greens added) they heated up like crazy.

I chop all the weeds I pull from the gardens. It's really satisfying to use pruners and chop everything up in inch long chunks.... goes really quickly, especially when sitting in the shade with a cold drink and a couple of dogs for company, lol. I really think the small pieces of green compact down and aid in the heating up process.

Even for the greens, I'll use freshly cut clippings, not bothering to let them dry out. It all depends on what is available....

Next spring, I'll have the leaves from this fall, to layer with the 'starter' ...... I've had piles of leaves hang around not doing anything for a few years, but adding them to the log cabin compost pile really works.

I was worried that I may have jumped the gun on turning the pile and it would not heat up again. So the first thing I did this morning is rush out to check on it. LOL there I am in my robe and slippers sticking my hand into the compost pile when the neighbor upstairs pokes her head over the balcony railing and asks me it everything is ok. I grinned like an idiot and said yes, everything is great, I just needed to warm my hands up and a nice hot compost heap works wonders on the arthritis...She grinned and said"I'll be right down. Sure enough here she came in her robe to poke her hands into the steamy pile and we stood there grinning like idiots as that steamy heat really did soothe the ache!

After a couple minutes she gets this serious look of panic on her face and asks me if the pile was clean? It took a minute to realize she was asking if I had put any dog feces in it. When I told her that I would never put fecal mater from a meat eater on my compost she grinned and said good, she will see me ant my pile again tommorrow!

What a hoot! This is a very prim and proper lady that usually will not be seen until every hair is in place and her nails are polished and here she is poking her little manicured hands in my compost pile!

compost junkies, both of you! lol, great story

Hey ... this sounds kinda gross, but I just read that some folks "pee" in their compost pile -- increases nitrogen or something like that. Tell me it's not true! Wouldn't it be better to just add fertilizer (like miracle grow).

I also read that a little beer helps too. I use little cups of beer to drown those nasty, slimmy slugs. Can I poor the beer and dead slugs into my compost pile?

One more question, for now -- should I mix in peat moss to help retain moisture?

I think I'll pass on the urine for my compost. As for beer and dead slugs/snails, I don't know. They are mollusks so I do not see that it would do any harm. But the thought of sticking my hand into the pile to check for heat would be a big UGH it I happened to touch a slimy dead slug! The beer would, I think add yeast to the mix and that could possibly aide in the decomposition of the material. But I wonder if the alchohol in it would cancel out any benifits? Interesting thought...

Next Newbie question:

Will the compost continue to heat up so long as it is turned and kept moist or do you need to keep adding green/brown to it to keep the heat going in order for it to cook down to good compost?

and Question #2) Do I need to cover from snow or is snow good on the top of the pile?

The heat you get from microbial action is a bit self limiting, so no, the heat will not last forever. To the best of my knowledge, you can't get a pile to reheat if it's already been warm, unless you add more material that has enough balance to get the microbes working again.

I wouldn't let snow on it unless you need the moisture... kinda like rain.

Ok, thanks:) Right now I have no kind of "lid". I just propped some boards around and piled stuff up in side. My pile only has boards on 3 sides and no top. I'll have to find something to put over the top-could get buried in snow otherwise.

Garbage bag or piece of plastic sheet with rock on top?

That should work and is right up my ally $$ wise!

>grin<

Yay!

Pagancat, thanks for staying with us. We newbies are sure to have lots and lots of questions as we practice microbial rotteology for our first times.

I'll second that one!!

If I have a good hot batch, I flip it when it cools, as I mentioned above. When rebuilding I'll add moisture to layers as needed. Even with no additions it usually will heat up again, just one more time, just from the added air and moisture. It might not get quite as hot as the first cycle, or last quite as long, but it will reheat . Successive turning generally won't get hot unless additions are made.

Karen

Human urine contains no pathegons when taken from a healthy source. Beer becomes a better additive after being strained through the kidneys.

The nitrogen content is high....over 12%. I live in surburbia close quarters. There are two buckets in my tool shed. One is for the small hand tools. :)

The chances of importing pathegons are very very small if the donating animals are healthy. If you would use farm animal urine in manure why not urine from any healthy source?

A heated pile at or about 120 degrees for several days will take care of pathegons and most weed seed. Some folks like to argue this point. I stand firm on this answer.

I second doc's answer - and human urine is actually sterile in a healthy human, to take it one step further. I can't think of any disease that is transferred via *human* urine - most of it comes from feces (E. coli, Hepatitis, etc.). From what I've read (not extensive) the big problem with urine use is the chance that it's contaminated by fecal matter.

Always glad to help where I can - I don't think I have the experience some of the folks on this forum have, but what I do have I will gladly share!

I don't claim to be an expert in composting but I do know something about urine. I have been a nurse for 35 years. Specimens are rarely obtained that are free of bacteria, likely E. coli. Just think about where urine comes from, and the close proximity of human anatomical structures...

Karen