Salvia germination question

Hi everyone. I have what is probably a dumb question about starting salvia. I got 'Coral Nymph' from Swallowtail Garden Seeds. I'm accustomed to direct sowing, so was chagrined to discover I'll have to start these indoors. Okay, I'm ready.

These are the instructions: Sow 8-10 weeks before last frost date. Do not cover seed as light aids germination (a light covering of vermiculite may be used to help maintain moisture). Transplant into cell packs or larger containers at second true leaf stage. Harden off and transplant outdoors when danger of frost has passed.

It's the "Transplant into cell packs" part that has me confused. I was planning on starting with cell packs! Am I missing something, or simply trying to read too much into the instructions? My sister suggested they germinate without soil or planting mix. Please tell me she's wrong.

Thanks in advance.

They are assuming you are sowing into flats or small propogation cells, and once they get a little bigger to transfer them to the cell packs. I personally start them in the cell packs just like you are planning and it works fine for me. I am actually growing some Coral Nymph myself this year!

I grew Coral Nymph a few years back after seeing them at Disney World in containers, I sow them directly in the six pack too, why create an extra step? You are wise to start them now! They take a while to bloom, I also think Disney pinched them back to get so many bloom spikes on one plant.

Mine were a bit spindly, I also had a few plants bloom the next year from some reseeding the plants did on their own.

This message was edited Mar 18, 2007 6:29 PM

I couldn't hope for a better answer, so thanks! Not only did you tell me what I wanted to hear, you referred to me as "wise." LOL

Thank you both. Off to start seeds...

I found this thread while looking for help in germinating salvia seeds and was wondering if I have to soak the seeds before sowing them? Generally, everything gets knicked and soaked in this house, but these are from different countries and I don't want to ruin them.

Also, does anyone know if these bloom the first year?

I too have some Salvia seed I need to germinate so this was helpful.

Gourd, http://www.onrockgarden.com/ has germination instructions for quite a few different species of salvia, and does not indicate soaking for any of these species. In years gone by, I've germinated various species of sage without soaking. However, if anyone is curious to see what effect soaking might have on sage seeds, perhaps they could test a portion of their seeds with soaking?

Some commonly grown annual sages will bloom the first year from sowing, but a head start of 8 - 10 weeks is recommended to get a longer flowering season. None of the perennial sages I winter sowed last winter flowered last summer, but perhaps they might have if they had been germinated at warm temperatures indoors earlier in the winter (especially S. transylvanica). Volunteer seedlings of Salvia coccinea 'alba' and S. farinacea did flower, but late.

Some species of salvia are said to need their seed exposed to light (surface sown) for germination and some not - see above link about that.

Personally, for the very few seeds of some precious Salvia species I may wind up with this winter, I think I'm going to try to germinate them by the coffee filter/baggy method (1) , at room temp, without soaking, and exposed to light by attaching them to a string across a window with clothes pins. Most species noted in Deno's 2nd edition (2) will germinate in either light or dark (with exceptions), but the germination rate seems to be highest with light.

(1) http://www.robsplants.com/seed/baggy.php

(2) Seed Germination Theory & Practice by Norman C. Deno, 2nd edition
139 Lenor Drive
State College, PA 16801

Gourd, out of curiosity, I'd love to know which species of sage you're growing - one of my favorite flowers - and quite a range of habitat. I'll bet experts on the Salvia & Agastache forum could give you more specific answers for specific species, and I'd be interested to know what they say.

Hi Karen,

Salvia micpophylla
S. muellerii
S. chamaedrfoydes
S. azurea
S. coahuilensis
S. involucrata
S. mexicana
S. farihacea
S. greggii
S. coccinea MX
S. coccinea white flowering MX
S.guaranticia
S. nubicola
S. lyrata

And I got a whole lot of seeds that I collected mixed in a couple of baggies (ranging from red to pinks) also a couple of hotlips in there too, that will probably not come true from what I hear, you need to get cuttings, but we moved and I could not take cuttings at that time, I wish I could go back and get some..lol.

Which do you have Karen, I'd love to see some of yours.. I really miss mine and am hoping that i get these going/or find at least a couple of gallon pots here in the southwest to get my hummers happy.

A.

Hi Gourd,

We have growing in the garden -

S. forskaohlii - tolerates at least 3/4 shade and reminds me of a woolly-leaved hosta - nice contrast to bitty-leaved hyssop nearby

S. lyrata 'Purple Knockout' from Critterologist - takes an amazing amount of shade - great sprucer-upper for wherever it grows as an edger with those dark-red leaves. My favorite encounter with this species was a surprise on one of our walks early last summer in a totally untended section of a local park - the wild form was coming up through sod like one of those medieval tapestries.

S. officinalis purpurea - surprisingly, this one drapes its dusky purple, pebbled leaves over the stones it perches over - am trying to coax a woolly thyme further down the stones below it - this makes a great cooking sage

S. patens - flanks a secondary path behind alpine strawberries (also from Critterologist) - was rather ratty last summer, giving it one more season to see how it does

S. transylvanica - just wintersowed it last winter, so it hasn't bloomed yet - its growing in the vicinity of Clematis 'Polish Spirit' and Rosa 'Abraham Darby'

Wintering indoors -

Salvia 'Black and Blue' (said to be hybrid of S. guarnitica; aka Brazilian Sage) (under lights). This one has tuberous roots like dahlias and is said to be able to be stored same as dahlias in barely damp peat in cool cellar over winter. Gerris tried it last winter, and the sage didn't survive - still worth experimenting with, though. In our garden, this one stays compact and short to 2 1/2', whereas S. guarnitica 'Purple Majesty' soars to a shrubby 6' and blooms more freely until frost. S. guarnitica 'Indigo Spires' is very floriferous until frost, but is so lax that you could almost grow it like a vine to 8' here. All of these sages have grown here in half a day's sun - great hummer magnets.

Seed to sow -

S. canescens - this one has an air of adventure about it - could it be just a vicarious trip to its exotic origins? (from http://www.nargs.org/ 2008)

S. chamaedryoides - silver leaved form - be still my heart with this one - I grew plants of this years ago and it wasn't fazed in the least by our summer heat & humidity and over-hanging trees - it behaved like a tiny leaved, petite cloud of silver with blue flowers all summer until frost (http://www.nargs.org/ 2008)

S. coccinea - red w/fuchsia - Illoquin's influenced me to plant a red corner
S. coccinea - 'Coral Nymph' - would be pretty over a mat of silvery, woolly-ish leaves of Arabis caucasica in vicinity of Lychnis coronaria
S. coccinea 'Alba' - now, here I've been beating the bushes around DG for this seed, and all the time I had some harvested in the fall of 2006 - nice for a moonlight corner

S. daghestanica (could this be S. canescens v dahgestanica?) successfully wintersowed last winter, but clobbered by Ipomoea nil 'Blue Silk', which also clobbered the successfully wintersown S. cyanescens while it was at it - awful price to pay for going hog wild with morning glories from property line to property line - but everyone should go hog wild with at least one or a few genera at least once in their gardening life times, I think) (http://www.nargs.org/ left over from 2007)

S. elegans (Pineapple Sage) 4 seeds - love the fragrance of these leaves

S. farinacea - not as shade tolerant as S. chamaedryoides and others listed above - would like to see this one with Ipomoea hederfolia v lutea

S. glutinosa - upcoming trade from Tuinkabouter -via Suzy's 2nd Chance Swap - a creamy yellow said to be shade tolerant - love to see that one near Mina lobata

S. guaranitica - Black & Blue - 6 seeds harvested from 2006 - insurance in case the tubers don't make it, but Cat64129 has dibs on it

S. guaranitica 'Purple Majesty' - 1 seed harvested from 2006 - I know it won't be true to the parent, which is a hybrid, but still I'm curious to see which parent it favors

S. greggii hybrids ex Dufresne hybrids reds/pinks - also very excited about this one, too - I like to sow a packet of surprises - these should be especially interesting (http://www.nargs.org/ 2008)

S. horminum - a low, well behaved sage to pair with a small rose like Clothilde Soupert

S. staminea - another trade coming from fairy1004 via Suzy's swap - should be another interesting experiment with an unknown

I need to lurk more on the Agastache & Salvia forum - who'da thought how diverse & adaptable this group could be?

A., New Mexico has always seemed THE proper place to grow sages - we'll have to keep comparing notes throughout this year - comparing the same genus with regard to two such different climates should be vewwwwwy interesting

Do you want to comment more about yours? Compare your erstwhile and current gardens? Now is the season to muse -

karen