Growing from seed

With all these forums there doesn't seem to be one for this topic, so y'all are "it". I'll probably end up having to ask most of you a question about seeds you sent me anyways!

I've got things growing in a small "greenhouse" inside with a few fluorescent lights and am having pretty good luck so far. Yesterday tho I noticed some seedlings tho that had droopy leaves. (they were all the same plant) I didn't know if they were too warm or wet or ? The door zips shut but I open it periodically and I put a small fan in it yesterday. They do look a little perkier today. Any ideas?

Love your setup KKB! I've been reading the compost forum and I love this thread http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/527353/#new

maybe some H2O2?

Maggie

Oh my Maggie, care to just give me a quick run down of that thread?! I just need info for a simple mixture of H202 and water.

Funny thing too is that I went to the Brugs forum and happened to see a thread with floppy seedlings and someone said they were too hot, so that must have been my problem too. I think if I just open it up more, keep the fan going, and let them dry out a little. I had another light up top that was making it a lot hotter inside too. It was an older metal light tho and was getting way too hot so I took it out.

My "set up" came from Dollar General a few years ago for $20. The lighting in it has always made it a challenge but this year I found a small hanging light that fits perfect. I need to get another one then I should have enough light for the seeds and can put the bigger ones on the top shelf. I'm actually excited about my seeds this year instead of being stressed out. Hopefully I'll still be able to say that in a few weeks! lol

Down & Dirty CliffNotes:

Plants need O2/aeration/nutrients. Rotted roots don't provide these things. Think hydroponics and bubblers-must have O2! Plant in fast draining mixes and water frequently to avoid anaerobic messes. H2O2 is helpful in oxygenating too dense soil.

Great cheap lights that WORK are even distribution of warm and cool florescent bulbs. I bought a rack and a heating mat and some seed starters and I'm good to go. The lights are not too hot, there's bottom heat for the roots (it's great for rooting cuttings) and the growth is not too leggy.

I was adding worm poop but that held so much moisture that I'm seeing decline in the repotted plants. Now, as I'm preparing for possible SNOW!!!! I'm repotting some plants I consider at high risk.

I've gotten many lovely seeds from my offer of free milkweed seeds.I can't wait to start them this week. I'm using the papertowel, H2O2 method.


Maggie

Snow?! Wow! When was the last time you had snow? It's been just above freezing today but the wind chill makes it horrid!

So do you (or anyone) know how to mix it (small amounts) using 3%? I skimmed thru that thread but didn't see what I need.

Do you have a pic of what you are using? I haven't had as much of a problem with them being leggy with the light being really low. I don't have heat, which brings me right into something else I was wondering about...

I have started several A. tuberosa seeds using just the baggie method of germination. I have 4 different types of milkweed that have not germinated in the baggies. They are: swamp, a "blue flowering" ?, Honeyvine, and Antelope Horns. I'm wondering now if they also need heat, besides that of being in the window (not much heat now tho) or in the greenhouse or on top of one of the lights. They could just take a long time, but I was just wondering....

Nice setup KB!

Here's a thread about it on the Brug forum. There's always talk about H2o2, just type it in and do a search, you might find exactly what you need.
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/423175/

I agree with the lights lower to help with the legginess.

I have always had problems with starting seedlings indoors. This year I bought a pop-up cold frame, hoping they will harden off and not just disappear when I put them in the ground.

fly, show us your cold frame! I haven't given much thought to the hardening off but I have decided I'm not planting them outside until they are pretty big and won't be pulled up by birds! I've had some things "disappear" overnight and don't want that happening after working so hard to get them going.

How long are you supposed to leave them under the low lights? I left the Mexican Sunflowers until they had true leaves and were almost too tall, then I repotted them and they are on top getting some artificial light and some natural light now. I'm going to have to go to Wally World and get another hanging light because I'm running out of room under the low light now and have seeds in baggies to plant tomorrow.


What do you two have started? I have Nasturtiums, Mexican sunflowers, Lion's Tail, Butterfly Pea Vines, Fennel, Marigolds, Milkweeds, Morning Glories, Porterweed and some others that haven't germinated yet.

This is what I bought, it was inexpensive in case it doesn't work. I plan on starting my seeds in it when it warms up and skip the indoor part. I have cats that seem to get into everything.

http://www.bettymills.com/shop/product/view/FlowerHouse/FGHFHPH120.html?utm_source=search&utm_medium=sitesearch&utm_campaign=parts&utm_keyword=FGHFHPH120&utm_content=Outdoor

I hope to have better success with the sunflowers. It seems every year the squirrels find them, even after they come up, and bite the tops off.....ggrrrrr. So, with this, I hope to let them get bigger before I set them out.

Paige - Your greenhouse setup is AWESOME!!! I love it! Y'all are making me drool. We had almost freezing temps in my area last night. Just missed it by 2-3 degrees, but I know I will lose some plants to the ground anyway.

I haven't seen many butterflies lately. I think they are all hunkering down or flew further south. Many of my yard plants sure seem to be enjoying these cooler temps! They are all blooming. LOL!

Wow Becky, sounds like you are finally getting a little break. You'd better take advantage and refresh quickly since I'm sure you'll be back in business soon!

Y'all have made me feel like I've been ungrateful and haven't appreciated my goofy little greenhouse as much as I should have. lol I bought another hanging light for it yesterday. Since the lights have to hang from a middle bar I couldn't hang them both on the same shelf, so now it doesn't leave much room for other plants so I'm having to move the bigger babies around the house to get more sun. Whew, this is going to be a long month! My bathroom window has a line of potted plants and the bathtub has plants in it.

Roxanne, that's a neat little contraption! I'm curious to know how it all works. You're going to sew seeds in trays and leave them inside of it? And they will get light thru it?

Paige, here's the plan....I'll start the seeds under lights in the garage, then move them out to the cold frame. In the past I've either kept them too long under lights or moved them outside and a torrential rain would beat them down or a critter would bite them. The contraption has plastic around it and then a mesh door for air. I may try starting some seeds in it and see what happens. It's sort of like a gh, but with plastic instead of glass, and it's small, land much less air circulation...haha, I guess it's not like one at all.

I've seen your setups before and almost bought one, let us know how it worked out, maybe I'll have to get that too.

Wouldn't you just love to have a real gh? If I had one, it would be like I died and went to heaven lol.

I've got 2 something like yours...just got them couple weeks ago. I have to get out there and open them up in the morning when the sun is out, otherwise it can get too hot in there...the Texas sun gives no quarter to plants under the plastic. I'm afraid I'll forget sometime when we have to leave early to go somewhere. When it's warm, I have to have the back of the plastic pulled up over the top...wish the zipper flaps were on both sides.

Linda, I wondered about that, I'll probably put them in some filtered shade. Are you starting your seeds in there?

No, I'm starting the seeds inside under lights. Right now I'm just using the mini-greenhouses for smaller plants I already have. I think I need to move them to a shadier spot real soon. Later I want to move some of the new seedlings into the second one, but I don't want the wide swing in temperatures for them to start off with. The mini-greenhouses really do need more filtered light in this climate...maybe under trees.

My little gh gets really hot inside as soon as I turn the lights on so I have to open the door on it several times a day and keep the fan going. I'm moving larger seedlings around the house to various windows now and leaving the sprouting ones under the lights.

I think that I would forget something I put outside with plants in it. That's one reason I'm going to try and get some of these growing early enough that by time I put them out they will be large enough that I won't have to baby them.

Has anyone had any success starting the Pipevine or Cassia seeds? I've got a new book from the library about seeds and I think it said the Cassia takes a while but no info on PV's. Figures that some of the ones I really want are confusing me.

I have a hard time if I plant a seed in a peat pot and it doesn't germinate quickly. I'll can't keep the dirt moist enough at all times for more than a week or so. Once the plant starts growing the roots keep it from drying out so fast and I'm fine. (so far) Does anyone else have problems?

The Aristolochias are said to take a very long time to germinate. I've got some in pots now, so I guess I'll just keep trying and not give up even if it takes months.

Are yours in peat pots? Do you have them covered? heated? I hate to sit and wait forever to find out they needed opposite of what I'm doing.

Great job Paige!!
Your seedlings look great! The little house is really nice too! My sis got me a little GH and I'm learning to work it.. Already fried my Moonflower sprouts and they had true leaves already,:-(. I figured out what the black mesh thing that came with the GH is for.... It goes on the top to filter out the blistering light. Safety in numbers, I planted so many different things hopefully I will have a lot that make it through..

Deb :-)

I have problems with those little peat pots too. I'm trying stryofoam cups with starter mix and see how that goes.

Deb, that's nice!!!

Trying Lupines.... again numbers might prevail. I have a bunch in the bathroom too that are getting pretty leggy now.

Thanks Roxanne! I am learning some hard lessons this year for sure. This little GH didn't cost much more than a couple of the small ones. I got a bunch of shelves from BigLots for 7.50 each so I could stack things in there.
The Sweet Peas have been growing since fall, and seem to be fine in there too.

The cold didn't get the Parsley either, I covered it with a little tarp when it was freezing, then removed it the rest of the time.

The Black Hollyhock has held up too, amazingly.. Just a little cover when it froze. All these pics were taken just a few minutes ago.

Wow, those look good. So, there's no floor in there?

The Passionvine on the back fence that a moved last fall is still green too. As you can see I have kept it covered most of the time. Here the wind is whipping pretty good today and the plastic is sucked up against the vines.. It has had plenty of air and sunshine though. This vine is the Blue Crown. The Purple Maypop is germinating. The cutting I got from you Paige dies back, but I am expecting it to emerge again there. It was off to a really good start.

Roxanne, I made the floor by spreading Pine Bark, but it is sealed very well at the bottom against the ground too.
Here is the back of the GH>It has doors on both front and back..

Sorry fly, but I've confused my peats. I'm actually using pellets, not pots. The peat pellets have always been a problem for me but they're doing pretty good this year. I never know if they are actually getting all wet or if there are dry pockets inside, so I tend to soak them good. I've found that they need to stay in the flat containers they sell them in so that the bottom of them are flat. I sat a few in some regular black seed trays and there is a space of air in between that's causing them to dry out quicker.

After a few things were started in the peat pellets, I split the plants apart and transplanted some into the seed trays with the starter mix. They've done ok but those seem to be drying out quicker than the pellets.

I've moved a few things in the pellets to bigger containers and they're doing good. I put a few things that were in peat pellets into the peat pots and am having a horrid time with those pots!! I'm fixing to put those into something totally different because the enitre pot being made out of that stuff is too much trouble.

Nice set up Deb!

Thanks Paige,
Definatly better to use little bathroom cups or styrofoam like Rox was sayin.. The peat cups way to dry. Up there in the pic with Lupine sprouts I am only using the cake pan with the pellets.

I have been using the roasting/cake pans with the lids. It is necessary to have holes in top and bottom of them too. They seem to be alright. I will know more in about a week on much of it, (and it's got me antsy), LOL! Waiting for some things to pop out that were sown a month or 2 ago.. This week should be good germinating weather, and we shall see.


deb :-S

You don't even want to see my dead, brown yard right now. The best thing about it tho is that I put a bunch of stuff I cut down into a pile and the birds are loving it since it's under the feeder. Oops, don't want to get sidetracked onto birds!! Seedlings...

Is this normal behavior for a Nasturtium? One is falling over and one isn't. Maybe it's just a little leggy, or is it normal?

Last year I had a neighbor that threw a ton of regular potting soil in roasting pans and threw in a bunch of seeds. Voila! She left them outside on her porch.

I thought about doing that but I'd have to wait until the weather is warmer. I don't have room under my small lights for them so they'd get leggy and/or die.

How do you all label or keep track of what you've got growing? I don't have the same thing in more than a few pellets so I could only come up with writing them down on an index card and trying to keep that card with the container. Once I start moving things around it's gets hard. I know by the plant once it gets growing but not just from the seeds.

I hear you Paige, last year I had this neato little domed tray with room for about 50 pots. I bought a bunch of different flower seeds, I was really hopeful lol. I wrote on a piece of paper the corresponding # in the tray to the flower. I was going along fine until I moved it and dropped it. I almost started crying. Some came up and I could eventullay id, but many just dried out from those blasted peat pots, those little ones that you water and they rise up. And I think I started them too soon because they got leggy and I didn't have anywhere to put them. My cats (the feline type) would find them and chew them to bits.

This year I'm hoping for more successes with that little pop up, maybe it's just a dream, or wishful thinking lol.

Well, I'm not too creative in how I am starting things so far. I just put potting soil in plastic pots and planted seeds in them indoors on shelves. I have them under lights, that's all. I should probably have some on heat mats or something, but I haven't yet. Oh, there were a few kinds of seeds I scratched or something, then soaked some in water first. And there's a few things cold stratifying in bags in the fridge. I'm using smaller pots this year so I don't have different kinds of seeds germinating together. And I put plastic labels into the pots.

KKB,

Sorry for not answering sooner, lost the thread. I'll put up pics of my setup tomorrow. I seem to be doing very well with bottom heat and seeds starting trays of varous kinds. 1 kind is from the hydroponics store- a bottom tray, a plug insert with holes, and 2 different tops. one top is short and the other is tall and vented. I really think the bottom heat helps a lot. I also have an deep-rooting seeds starting system setup from Gardeners.com.

Maggie

Yeah Maggie!
I looked at the site for g.com and it looks great.. Like to see how well they root with that one when you take a pic. Thats the biggest challenge, establishing good roots. Sounds like you have some great tools, wat with the Germinating pad too. I always wanted one of those..:-) Some seeds really need bottom heat, I bet they are great! Tell me about them.

Roxanne the Parsley, Hollyhock, and Passionvines are outside in the open back yard, and I have just been covering them for freezes. The pots of Sweet Pea are in the GH with shelves covered in aluminum cake pans with peat pellets or jiffy pots with soil. I also made some temporary tables under a tree to put wintersown flats.

The Sweet Peas are DD Jackie's. She got the seeds at the Fall Swap in Arlington. There are 2 pots with various Sweet Peas she started. :-). I am impressed with how well they have grown, she did good.

Deb :-S

I am still using the rising soaker peat pots in the trays. I mark them using a white permanent marker with the Tray number (in the photo I marked "200"). Then I mark the horizontal rows with numbers and the vertical rows with alphabet letters. That way I can cross reference them. And reuse the tray over and over. I then stole Deb's idea and made little markers using florist wire (Wally World) and I bought some yellow electrical duct tape. Made little flags on the wire using the duct tape. And then I marked them with permanent marker the bio name and common name of the plant. So when I repot them or plant them outside, I can add the marker right in with the plant(s).

This message was edited Feb 17, 2007 8:05 PM

Deb - Your plants look awesome! And so do yours Paige. I would love to have a greenhouse, but I don't have the room or level ground in my backyard. Though .... I am considering converting my garage into a greenhouse. Well ... not the entire garage. I have a bunch of craft stuff I am taking to my class which will free up several sections of shelves. (See photo.) I was thinking of mounting light strips to the underside of some of the shelves. That way they would shine down on the plants sitting on the shelves. My only problem is the lack of electrical outlets in my garage. Extension cords are fine, but I would need a large one with at least 10 outlets. lol! I just don't want to burn down my house! LOL!

Here's all my starter plants that need to be transplanted into either bigger pots or outdoors. I am thinking outdoors. It's not freezing here.

I had originally marked the trays with the names of the plants but on the opposite side I remarked them all with my number and letter system. Some of the trays are facing the wrong way in the photo.

This message was edited Feb 17, 2007 8:59 PM

The last time I used the pellets I marked the bottom of the tray with the plant name. I like the # and letter combo. I'm not using such big trays tho because my gh is small and my lights are small. Do you have those huge flats under lights?

Is anyone using any H202?

Becky, those shelves would work great with some shop lights on them! Especially with the size flats you have. That's way too many at one time for me. That's when I'd end up letting some of them dry out.

I'm not sure how I need to leave the plants under the grow lights once they've got a true set of leaves. What I've read is keep the light 2" from the plants but some things grow fast and that's too low so they're being put in real sun.

This message was edited Feb 17, 2007 7:19 PM

Paige - Those trays were sitting on my porch and I brought them in yesterday because of the near freezing temps that were predicted. They will be going back out on the porch tomorrow when the weather is a bit warmer. But my idea is to add the lights to the shelves next year. Those large trays will fit nicely on each shelf. Perfect. And there is enough space between the shelves for the plants to get at least 12-14" tall. Which is about the size I'd like them before transplanting into my yard.

I, too, would like to know more about H2O2. Someone please tell us more! :-)