Black Walnut - To plant or not to plant?

I like walnuts :)

Depends on the existing fauna to me. Oaks are certainly magnificent trees and they certainly do have their niche in our ecosystems. I don't believe one to be more important than the other though. If a gardener has the space and can eek out a little bit for a species declining in popularity that fills a different niche, why not?

Most people are familiar with Sara Stein's writings. Consider this, "Remove the pheasant's cover or the butterfly's flower and you have erased its space. The less variety of habitat the landscape offers, the less space there is until, when all is mowed, even an expanse the size of a golf course becomes just a hole in the world". To this I would add something else she wrote, "Extinction is now approaching the rate prevalent during the catastrophe that killed the dinosaurs. For the first time in earth's history, a major plant extinction is also underway." I can't help but wonder what would happen if more of our landscapes (regardless of size) were reshaped so as to return a little bit back to their former inhabitants. My one neighbor is expanding upon some of my plantings. Now there are two of us where once there was one. He's only converting the back portion of his lot but it connects to mine. Some of this area was once an Oak Savanna. It's a remnant. I've shared plants with him. He originally thought I was nuts when I removed the buckthorn from that area but when he saw me planting back, we got to talking and next thing I knew he was cutting down his buckthorn and planting back Bur Oak saplings. The family across the street began removing some. Not all but some. And, they are planting back Bur Oaks. Their yard doesn't connect to either of our yards but someday maybe there will be a corridor. I've seen some pretty amazing things done on postage size lots that connect.

Here's a link to her book "Noah's Garden"-
http://davesgarden.com/gbw/c/1136/

Let's see...fake nail appointment or a walnut tree?

Equil,

Sara Stein is my second favorite author (only recently supplanted by Charles Mann and his insanely good book 1491. Read this book everybody. It's about the Americas before Columbus and it will blow your mind!) and Stein's concept of the suburban gardener creating abundance and diversity of life is practically what I live for. Although the extinction of black walnuts hardly ever keeps me awake at night, anyone who plants this particular species or other out-of-favor (or rare) plants for the purpose of diversity and ecology certainly has my blessing. However, I also feel strongly that when someone asks about a particular species for the purpose of planting it in their yard, they should recieve the full dossier, warts and all. When it comes to walnuts, perhaps my experience has conditioned me to be quite unable, no matter how hard I might try, to look away from the warts!

Scott

I haven't read Charles Mann's 1491. Guess I best pick it up as so many have enjoyed it. Glad you recommended it. Reminded me it was one I had been meaning to pick up.

Did you ever read Plants of the Lewis & Clark Expedition by H Wayne Phillips?

If you love her book "Noah's Garden", you'd love this one-
http://davesgarden.com/gbw/c/1241/

I've read all of Stein's gardening books (apparantly she's written several childrens books too). I liked them all, but "Noah" was the best. I had a borrowed a book from the library about L&C plants, but I never really got around to reading it. Just thumbed through the pictures. I can't remember if it was by H. Wayne Phillips.

Scott

I have one more thing to add.

A few years back, we had a terrible freezing rain here, leaving my 15 acre woods coated in a very thick layer of ice. My home sits in a small clearing in this woods. The trees right around the house are Shagbark Hickory... which I had been told would be fine right around a house - they were healthy trees about 16 inches around. We removed all maples, etc. when we built the house, and left only hickory, walnut, cherry near the house, with only the hickory really near the house (50-75 feet away), as the tree surgeon at the time said they would never fall on the house.

He was right!! The few Hickories that had any damage snapped right in two, but the tops stayed attached and just fell right over, and did not come near damaging the house. I lost 1 large cherry tree near the house. BUT -- every single walnut on the property sustained severe damage. They were either uprooted completely, or the branches broke off very near the trunk, leaving only the main trunk. In other cases, the trunk snapped in half, and the top crashed down. (with the hickories, the tops snapped, but with the fiborous wood, the tops stayed attached, so they caused no damage.) When the tops crashed down, they fell on other trees that would not have had damage otherwise.

The upside was that I had enough damage to the walnuts -- and the cherry was large enough -- that I was able to have a talented bobcat operator come and selectively bring them out of the woods and timber them. He found 2 more large cherries on the place I let him have to make a load. (One had recently died, the other was behind my pond and was ailing from to much water and would be dying soon) We split the price they brought at the mill.. which covered the cost of the tree climber's work, my other damages, and paid for digging out my 1/2 acre pond - something I wanted to do for a long time. I would never have timbered my woods if it had not been for this ice storm. Many other types of trees were damaged - all sorts of Maples, wild apples, old half dead elms and we just left them as is in the woods ... but wanted you to know that the walnuts, when faced with a lot of ice and wind -- did NOT fare well. Maples were severely damaged... but Walnuts were ruined. Illinois could get some pretty nasty ice storms as well.

Mine also had a bad problem with "bag worms" - not sure of the proper term... but they just did not look the best. For wildlife... the squirrels and birds seem to enjoy the hickories just as much... and I like the trees a lot better.

It's been a couple years.... but we are still hearing tops of trees and limbs crashing to the ground now and then in the woods from that storm. It was just sickening all the distruction. Like someone took a gigantic weed whacker and just hacked the top third of the woods off. I was SO lucky to get a really good tree company with a really caring owner and talented climbers to work at my place. He was really great about making the trees look as natural as he could and not taking down any that he could salvage. He could have easily taken advantage of my situation and cut down three times the trees he did.

I'll add something to the mix. When I used to live with too many deer, I noted that they leave the walnuts alone. A large area of formerly open ground was becoming 100% Black Walnut. Deer ate the seedling oaks, seedling hickory, and everything else. The Black Walnut thrived, and became a monoculture. Just an observation.

Here on my 3 acres, I took out some smaller black walnuts near the house for all the reasons Scott gave. The Shagbark Hickory and Bitternut Hickory that I left are much more attractive plants to me. I think there are a couple Black Walnuts in my woods. I am not worried about them being rare around here--they are all too common in the neighborhood from the one/two punch of squirrel/deer. In my neck of the woods they compete with box elder maples for the title of weedy native of the year. I'd never actually plant one on purpose.

Hello, I agree with the not planting of a new black walnut. They are a true nuisance in my opinion. We have some old ones and nothing grows underneath them and they are trashy trashy.

While I would agree that a Black Walnut probably isn't the best choice for next to a home, driveway, pond or swimming pool; the original poster questioned if he/she had the right site. I suspect with 3 acres that there's some area on that site for a few Black Walnuts. He/she also stated, "They appeal to me because they're beautiful and indigenous to my area". These trees appeal to me too. Around here, the nuts do tend to pile up underneath the tree however they are gone within a few weeks because the critters scurry off with them.

Equilibrium, I agree with what you said. If they appeal and are far away from the home, go for it. Just don't get it on your hands before you have to make an appearance anywhere.

No need to get it on my hands at all because I'm not shelling them for a cookie, fudge, or turkey stuffing recipe. I don't clean up after them at all because the critters do that for me. The tree truly is an invaluable species to wildlife which is the main reason I like it but I do find the pattern of the bark very interesting in winter.

I have over four acres here and believe me, they are a problem. The juglone pretty much precludes planting anything that isn't juglone tolerant in my entire back yard, which is well over an acre.

I have one 60' from the house, no problem whatsoever, unless squirrel-planted seedlings count - I find them in the darnedest places, too. Driving around here this time of year you can see all the shag and shellbarks pretty clearly, very nice.

I'm curious tsurg, what plants have you tried planting underneath your black walnuts?

Bought a residential piece of property for rental investment that had one huge tree - black walnut. It was magnificent. I delighted in it. Three years later I delighted in its removal. Not in a residential lot, ever again. There is place for them, certainly, but you need to be able to admire them from afar - far away from a driveway, evetroughs, sidewalks, children's play equipment and most other plant life. You can have the tree, or the other stuff, but you can't have both.