Fuyu Persimmon

I just received a bare rooted Fuyu Persimmon tree and will plant it today.I love the fruit and pay quite alot for it when it is available in the Fall.This Persimmon is not sort and squishy like the American Persimmon but is firm like an apple.

I ordered this (and quite a few other things) from Petals from the Past Inc.So far their customer service has been incredible and I received my order a few days after ordering.The plants look very good and will be planted today.

I also ordered an LSU Purple fig.So now I have 3 figs trees

Last month I attended the organic growers school in NC and took classes in permaculture.I am going to plant as many edible landscape plants as possible.

Is anyone else interested in permaculture?

I am interested in landscaping with edibles. The link below takes you to my entry of Jan 21, 2005 on the subject. It's not permaculture in that I don't mind using pesticides or herbicides if other methods don't work.

There were so many different fruit and nut trees that I could have grown in San Jose, but I ran out of room even though I planted either dwarf or semi-dwarf trees. Here the average number of chill hours available averages between 600 and 650 hours so that limits what I can grow. Some trees will grow but may not fruit most years because late frosts can kill the blossoms or fruit. I've refrained from planting too many things because I hope we'll be in our new home within two years. I do have 2 persimmon, 2 apple, 3 plum 3 peach and 5 fig trees. When we move into our new home, this area will be my fruit orchard and will have to put everything here on an automatic sprinkler system.

http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/470354/

Hi
Thanks for answering.Here at the Bch in SC.we have a small suburban lot and as you said there is only so much I can grow.There is also the matter of chill hours.We also have a farm up in the mountains of NC. I plant the fruit trees with a high chill requirement up there.
How long did it take before you got fruit from the persimmon?

Thanks for the link.
Nancy

I just finished reading your entry.Wow is all I can say.I have nowhere near your experience as I just started planting edibles about 5 years ago.I am hoping that we can live somewhat sustainably up in the mountains at some point in the future.

My son is living in the bay area and we will be visiting at the end of June.He is also a plant person and tells me about the variety of plants that can be grown in the area.Talk about zone envy.

This message was edited Apr 15, 2006 5:49 AM

Hi Nancy,

It took about 2 full years before my Fuyu persimmon tree produced flowers and supported 3 fruit to maturity. Last fall, I harvested 20 persimmons. The tree has lots of flowers this year so I'm hoping for more fruit. Once your tree starts to produce more fruit than you can eat, try dehydrating peeled persimmons cut into 3/8" slices. Dehydrating intensifies the flavor and sugar content, and of course allows you to to extend the persimmon eating season.

It's great that you have the option of planting fruit trees that require more chill hours elsewhere. Here, I'd have to head for the panhandle. Then I'd have tornadoes to worry about.

Our two sons are still living in the Bay Area. Neither one is willing to move to Texas so we try to visit each other as often as possible. I hope you enjoy your visit with your son this summer. I was thinking of going to the Bay Area at the end of June for our older son's birthday, but discovered he will be away at a conference so I hope to see him later this summer.

I understand zone envy. I'm definitely suffering from it. Much of what I liked to grow would suffer horribly here in central Texas so I'm having to learn about plants that tolerate weather extremes.

veronica

Hello Nancy and Veronica, I'm a relatively new subscriber and couldn't resist a thread that mentioned persimmons and figs. I'm a bit north of you in a suburb of DC so figs and oriental persimmons are more of a stretch for me. I have managed to grow them anyway. So far so good. My figs are brown turkey. I have 2 of them and they produce wonderfully well. I planted them just after we moved here--so long ago I forgot where they came from.

Nancy, I have an ichi ki kei, oriental persimmon that I got from Edible Landscaping in Afton Va. about 3 years ago and a Fuyu that I just got this spring. They are nursery located in the Va mountains and as their name suggests they specialize in beautiful trees and shrubs that also produce fruit. My ichi has at last count 18 beautiful persimmons just beginning to turn color. I am so excited. Thanks for the tip about drying, Veronica. I can't imagine having to deal with an excess of persimmons, but that's what I thought about figs too, before my trees grew so large!

My other great successes have been high bush blueberries and bartlett and the asian pears, hosui and shinseki. Apples were a terrible failure, I don't know of anyone who can grow them without a vigorous spray program, ditto peaches. Pears have been easy to grow organically--so far at least. We get lots of pears, we give them away to friends and make lots of sauce, pies and chutney.

Hello dayli

Thank you for tell us about your edibles.

I now have 3 fig trees,2 in pots.My persimmon tree never leafed out and I will have to wait until this winter before the grower will replace it.

I have heard of Edible Landscapes and will check out their offerings.

I also planted a pomegranate last season and it is doing very well.So are the high bush blue berries.

Oh Nancy, I had forgotten this. Years ago I ordered an oriental persimmon from stark brothers. It was the first year their catalogue offered one--they are a NY outfit so the grower must have been a southern subcontractor. Planted it and...nothing. Planted the replacement and...nothing. Planted the replacement's replacement (much to my husband's great amusement) and nothing until almost fall when I got a sprout from below the graft. I know they graft oriental persimmons onto virginiana rootstock so I let it grow on the offchance it would be a tree worth keeping. It wasn't. Sigh.... Persimmons are tricky to transplant because of their long taproot.

My ichi hasn't dropped anymore fruit. Yay! The new little fuyu looks good. I'll protect it through the winter though. The next tree I order will be a sheng, I think,. This is a variety that has to be soft before you eat it, but we saw the tree in Afton, and I thought it was exceptionally beautiful. We ate the soft fruit picked right off the tree--delicious!

When did you plant your trees?I went on Edible Landscape's website and it didn't say when they ship trees or the best time to plant persimmons.The tree I had was bare root and I think it was too late in the season for this area to plant bare rooted trees.Are Edible Landscapes trees all in pots?

We also ordered trees for our farm in the NC mountains from Stark Bros and were not happy with them.

I subscribe to the South Carolina market bulletins and have seen persimmon trees for sale.I am not sure if these are just the American ones or if they have the Japanese. I think it is always better to buy from local growers if possible.

We are coming into persimmon season and I get really good ones from Costco.It is so much better to grow your own.

Nancy

They ship in plastic pots--long and thin for persimmons because of the tap root. I got the ichi in the fall, three years ago I think, and the fuyu just this spring. The fuyu was battered terribly in transit . I planted it with hope and misgivings, but it took off immediately and grew like a champion.

We have a large Korean supermarket called Super H in Fairfax. They carry wonderful fuyu persimmons in season. I eat myself silly when they are available. Every now and again I find one that has a seed. Now I know as far north as I am I have no chance with an ungrafted persimmon. But you live in coastal SC, right? If I were to send you a persimmon seed or three would you mind sticking them in the ground just to see if they grow, just by way of an experiment? Let me know.

Sure I'll try it.

A word of caution.I used to live in Israel and about 25 years ago they started growing alot of persimmons.People went crazy and started eating them like mad.Then there were warnings in the news about intestinal blockages from eating lots of persimmons at one time.They said that you should only eat a few at a time.I never heard any more about this and I sure have eaten my share without any problems.

nancy

I've never had a problem either, but I probably don't eat more than one at a time. I just eat them often! Mangos too--not the big ones--the small yellow ones, when I can get them. I wish I could grow those.

I also love the yellow mangos.Once again Costco to the rescue.They have them when they are in season.Right now they are selling figs,red papaya,asian pears,along with the usual fruit.

I am interested in Permaculture. I have lots of the books I am reading. Unfortunatelly I only have a 50' x 100' lot with a house and garage on it - so not much room to grow. But I'm working on it and trying to build a self-sustaining environment. There is a very stong permaculture listserv out of Ithica. I can d-mail you the link if you would like.

I bought a Fuyu grafted on a Jiro rootstock on eBay this summer and it is flourshing in my 6b zone. I plan to wrap the trunk in burlap for the winter - do you think that will be enough protection?

I would love the link.

I attended an organic school last March outside of Asheville NC.Over the weekend you could choose from many topics including permaculture.I am fascinated by this approach to sustainable living.

As for your Fuyu I don't know very much.I hope that another member will answer.We have a farm in the NC mountains zone 6 and I would love to grow persimmons there.Do you remember who you bought your tree from on ebay?

nancy

downscale_babe - I will d-mail you the permaculture link.

I went back through my feedback and got the name of the vendor (I think) - mgmg9495. I bought several trees on eBay and I hope this is the correct one. If remember correctly - the Jiro rootstock was good into zone 6. Email the vendor and ask if they sold persimmon trees in the Spring.

Thanks again.

AYankeeCat, do you remember where the seller of your oriental persimmon was located? I went back and checked my records. What I have beside the ichi is a hana fuyu not a fuyu. Hana fuyu is supposed to be more cold hardy. I was told that it was grafted onto American persimmon rootstock to futher improve it's ability to survive the winter. American persimmons do fine in New England.

You might have to go further than burlap to get through a hard winter. Does anyone on the northeastern forum grow oriental persimmons? Have they been able to winter successfully?

They grow oriental persimmons in the Va mountains in Afton at Edible Landscaping. I've seen them growing and fruiting there myself so I know zone 6 orientals are possible. In the catalogue for this year they also have an American oriental cross which sounds really interesting.

Sorry - I don't remember where the vendor was located. Maybe I will put the little tree in a wire basket full of leaves. It has a wood fence at it's back - so that should help it out and I am actually pretty close to Long Island Sound here in Bridgeport so I am in 6b - the vendor thought the Fuyu would be OK. I ate Fuyus from my friend's garden when I lived in California and really liked the taste -so I will do whatever I have to to get a little bit of home here in New England.

I think the leaves are a good idea--whole leaves rather than chipped ones. You don't want them to compost. I have a small camellia that I brought up from NC that I surrounded (careful not to touch the plant) with plastic bottles of warm water during a particularly cold wave, winter before last. Don't know whether it made a difference but it made me feel better.

Let us know how your persimmon fares. I hope global warming brings you a gentle winter.

I just got a new Edible Landscaping catalog.They have so many things that I want to order.

I decided to order another oriental persimmon from them so that when I get the replacement for the one that didn't make it I'll have 2 (hopefully)

I also want to order edible dogwood cornus kousa.Has anyone grown this?

Nancy, I have a cornus kousa (we always called it Korean dogwood) grown from seed. Mine is too young to fruit, but it is still a beautful tree.

That said, I would not have much faith in it as a producer of delicious berries. The description says edible. It does not say tasty. I would be suspicious that there are places in the world where anything that doesn't kill you or make you throw up can be called edible.

What kind of oriental persimmon did you decide to order?

I've eaten kousa fruits on many occasions - if there are kousa dogwoods in the local landscape, you should be able to find some fruits to sample - they look sorta like little red soccer balls on a long stem. You just gently massage them, then tear a hole in the leathery skin and suck out the pulp - don't eat the skin, it's gritty and not at all tasty. Kousa pulp kind of reminds me of pawpaw pulp - and most folks either love pawpaw or find it disgustingly insipid.. Beware of the small, hard, stone-like seeds; you could crack a tooth.
It's a nice ornamental in its own right; the fruits are a bonus - but not much of one.

Lucky, Thank you. Now I can't wait to try one!

Speaking of pawpaws. There was an article in last Thursday's Washington Post that really promoted pawpaws, especially the new varieties. Are you in the love it camp or do you vote with the insipids?

dayli

I ordered the Hana Fuyu in a gallon pot.I was very disappointed to learn that it won't bear fruit for 6 years.How big was the tree that you bought?I also ordered the cornus kousa and was told by the same woman at edible landscaping that it would take the same time to fruit.I feel that planting a tree is an investment for the future and one of the most optimistic things you can do at this time for the planet.So what's a few more years?The bare rooted tree I receive as a replacement this winter may be older,that is if I can get it to grow.

Lucky

Thanks for the info.I have never tasted a pawpaw ( when I lived in W.Africa we called papaya pawpaw).I guess I should taste the fruit before thinking about planting one.So far I have only planted trees that bear fruit that I love.

D_babe,
Almost anywhere in the world, other than the USA, if you say 'pawpaw', you're talking about Carica papaya, which is quite different from the north American pawpaw, A.triloba; they're not even in the same family.
Here's one site that sells pawpaw fruit & pulp; we're getting pretty far into the season now, fresh fruit may be gone, but it's conceivable that they may have some 'late' varieties, or frozen pulp available.
http://www.integrationacres.com/

Dayli,
I've never had the opportunity to sample fruits from any of the named varieties of A.triloba. I've got several grafted & growing here, but no fruit from them yet; I have, however, eaten lots of wild-collected pawpaws. I like 'em OK, but I've become sort of 'burnt-out' on them over the years; now, I'll eat one or two, and that's enough to do me for the entire season.
Probably not a problem for most folks consuming a pawpaw fruit once in a while, but there's some new evidence afoot linking an 'atypical' Parkinson's Disease syndrome to excessive consumption of pawpaws & other (tropical) members of the Annonaceae - and teas made from their leaves/bark.

Nancy, the tree that is fruiting now is an ichi ki kei, remember. It was just a 1-gal stick when I planted it. My thought is that if I were running a commercial nursery, I would be very conservative in my estimate of fruiting time. If she said expect fruit in 3 years and it took 4, you would not be as happy as you would be with a 6 year horizon.

I have tried one of the persimmons. I couldn't wait. It was crisp and sweet and pleasant but without that rich, full persimmon flavor that you expect, so I guess I'll have to be patient a while longer.

Lucky, thanks for the "heads up" on the pawpaws. I mean to be at that paw paw festival next year!

An update on my oriental persimmon situation.

I now have 2.I ordered one from Edible Landscaping.It has survived the winter and has leafed out.It is about 2 feet tall.

I got a bare root replacement tree in March for the one that didn't leaf out last year and am thrilled that it has just shown signs of green buds and will have leaves any day now.It is a much bigger tree,about 5 feet tall.

I am very happy.Better to have 2 than none.

I just have to revive this thread, because I am also very interested in persimmons. I grew up with Italian "kaki", absolutely delicious, but I don't know what variety they may be, although I'll try to find out.

I have a couple of questions, I am in zone 8 in central North Carolina (formerly 7, see the new zones by the Arborday foundation, if you are interested)

When is the best time to plant them, spring or fall, or does it depend on the variety (I may be misreading what some of you were saying earlier)?

What kind of soil do they require? I can prepare a planting hole now and amend it well to give the tree a good home. My soil is very clayey and heavy, but can be amended.

As for site: I would plant it on a SE facing slope, but there is a funny little microclimate there, in that sometimes it is relatively cool there. So should I try to avoid that?

I know, these are lots of questions, but I'd be very grateful for any information you can start me out with.

BTW, Michael Dirr says that grafts onto Diospyrus virginiana are problematic.

Thanks for picking this up for me again,
Clementine

Update on my Fuyu in Bridgeport, CT. I put it in a "basket" of leaves for the winter and it came back and leafed out like crazy. It has lots of growth this year and looks wonderful. I can hardly wait for persimmons.

Another question on my persimmons: I have ONE fruit (the tree came with it) and I have been wrapping it in several thicknesses cloth when it froze recently. When should I harvest it? I can't tell. It is nice and orangey in color, but that is all I can say about it, oh, it is almost as big as a fist.

It is one of the hard ones, I can't think of the name right now.

You can pick it now and let it continue ripening indoors. If it is a non-astringent type, it is edible at the hard ripe stage.