2015 Seed Starting, Part 5

We came from here:

http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1367627/#new

The time has come again to think about next year's garden and how to get a head start on it. Especially for those of us in the cooler zones, seed starting is a big part of the preparation. So here we go again, sharing methods, successes and disappointments.

All are welcome!

Pam

Pam, thanks for the thread! Looking forward to hearing what everyone has to say.
do you all winter sow or start seeds indoors? I am going to winter sow...first time for this newbie

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 6:48 PM

I always start my plants in the house, some like petunias and Verbenas on a heat mat, but I don't put my tomatoes on the mat. All are under florescent lights. However, I won't even begin thinking about them until maybe March.

The houseplants I normally have outdoors in the summer are taking up the shelving that I use for starting seeds. So, something will have to give along about April.

This novice gardener is gonna be adventurous for 2015!

Feb 1, I'm going to start tomatoe seeds indoors (using a newly-built gro system) and aster seeds (to be planted amid my oriental lilies, to hide their bare knees). I've got 4 varieties of dwarf / short marigolds that I haven't decided whether to wait and direct sow them or build another indoor gro station and start them indoors. I HAVE decided to direct sow my nastertiums in the flower bed next to my container tomatoes on the back patio.

I don't know yet how many varieties of tomatoes I'll be able to start. I must grow them in containers on my back patio, so can only have about one of each variety; so far, a kind DG has offered to share some seeds for a grape tomato and Better Bush Improved Hybrid tomato. (Anyone able and willing to share about 5 tomatoe seeds of different varieties??)

I haven't calculated how many asters I will need, but since I will have 144 seed starting cells, that number really doesn't matter:: plus, I have plenty of neighbors who'll gladly take any extras!

I'm so excited, I just wish the snow would hurry up and come.....so it can LEAVE and I can start gardening again!!

Can I ask you why you are going to plant your nasturtiums next to your tomatoes? You know they are a real aphid magnet.

Jnette. . . " why. . . . plant your nasturtiums next to your tomatoes?"

I heard it in a YouTube video on tomatoe growing (a young English high school lad). I've picked out a STRIKING intense scarlet red nastertium for this rflower be4d. Is it not a good idea then? (I also heard, on another video, of growing marigolds next to tomato plants: also not a good idea?)

If the back flower bed, next to my container tomatoes is not a good choice. . . I can sow them in my front flower bed (on the other side of my apartment / tomatoes)

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:48 AM

blooma. . .(how do you make the name bold, when replying??) I, too, heard good things about marigolds near tomatoes, so I picked out 4 varieties of the dwarf / pot marigolds to be planted around the edges of my container tomatoes...Here's hoping!!!


I started out only planning for two tomatoe containers........now I'm up to 6(?) tomato varieties (still one plant per pot)!!!! I guess you might say I've got tomato envy . . .while I was learning how to grow 'em, I also lost myself in the different catalogs!!! It was almost impossible to tell myself "Next year you can plant THIS variety." I wanted to grow ALOT of them!!!!

(blooma, btw, very pretty photo with your name....is that one of your lilies??)

Bet, much better choice. And honestly, you did good to stop at 6!! It is very difficult to do. Pick and choose. Very hard to do. Good luck.

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:05 AM

It is one of my favorites.

The only problem with growing marigolds near tomatoes is that marigolds attract Spider Mites and Spider Mites also love tomato plants. This should only be an issue if Spider Mites are a problem in your area.

Wow Lisa, she's from N.C. Can't imagine why she wouldn't get them!! I didn't know that about Marigolds. I thought they detracted bugs etc.

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:06 AM

Do you have spider mites on other things? I didn't look again, but I think she said something about whether you did or not. Guess I had better go look. Lisa normally has fairly good info. Yes, she said only an issue if you do have the spider mite problem.

I see you are in Wyoming, I imagine you would have the same problem with them that we do here in Washington State.

Wow, blomma, you've been busy already! Me, I'm still doing garden cleanup, collecting seeds, digging plants and recovering my greenhouse and hoophouse. I'll try to get my 2 short coldframes done when the weather warms up a bit again. First I have to take apart, move and reassemble them and cover with plastic.

I hope to get seeds started sometime this week after I pot all the babies I dug from the garden.

BetNC....do you have plans for your growing stand? Mine are homemade....take a look at pix..
Pix1: 31 inches wide X 60inches tall X 60 inches long, 7 trays per shelf.. ) My new one (pix2: 48 inches wide X 65" tall X 72" long), I can start 12 trays per shelf. If you need dimensions or ideas just ask....

Pix 4 and 5 are the hoophouse and my grnhs. (ok, ya all say "It don't look like no grnhs to me"...lol. But it's the best description I can come up with...lol.

And Pam, thanks for starting the thread for me!!!!! LOL! Can't believe how many people have already found it and jummped in.

I would like to suggest to you all that have set ups like this, that I got Survivor blankets from Walmart a few years ago. They are Mylar and very light weight, silver on the inside. 4 feet by 6 feet I believe. I hung mine on each side and of course the silver side reflecting the light just like foil. At the time they cost 88 cents each. They have them in the sporting goods. I'm sure other stores carry them too.

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:46 AM

Jnette...lol, did you see mine hanging on the wall? I move it out of the way while watering then put it back around the front of the stand for the extra light that it creates. Yup, Wally World.

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:45 AM

That info about Spider Mites is well known. Maybe not a problem where Blooma has gardened. It could be that Spider Mites aren't a bug but an arachnid, spider. I know they are a problem here and Carolyn ( the tomatoe guru ) on the tomato forum agrees that if you garden in an area where SMs are an issue, Marigolds will attract them. It's impossible to generalize for the whole world. SMs thrive in hot dry conditions. I won't spray Malathon on edibles which is about all I grow. I just thought I'd throw that info out there.

Jnette, thank you for verifying that I don't just post randomly....I won't post here again, I prefer to post on DG forums that are actually discussion forums.

If you don't believe me all you have to do is google Marigolds and the first link (and many after) say that they attract Spider Mites and may not be a good thing to plant around tomatoes. Just don't want anybody to think I'm making this up. I've been on DG for a while and I try to post only what I know to be true.

LOL....YA!!!! Had that minus 14 degrees a few weeks ago! OUCH! lol. Pretty much ended my planting for the season...Darn and I had almost finished... Yes, everything is pretty much dormant now. Green at the base but mostly sleeping. Dug up: Limonium latifolium babies, clumps of Daisy Becky, Veronica spicata Sight Seeing Blue, Delospurma cooperii, Linum perenne Heavenly Blue, Centaurea montana white, Centaurea montana blue, Achillea milifolium light pink (not the reseeder tho), Ajuga tricolor and a clump of Monarda didyma Raspberry. That's all I could accomplish before sunset. And we're expecting 2-3" of that white stuff tomorrow.... so not sure if I'll be able to dig anymore, the soil is getting pretty cool. But if we get some more nice weather I'll also dig Hesperis matronalis, Salvia nemerosa Blue and Rose Queen, S. gaurantica, Centaurea phygria purple, and Centaurea machrocephala. I'm going to try and sell these come spring so am potting them up in 2 1/2" pots for now and bump them up if I can come spring... Who knows...if I have to I'll line them out and use them for a cutting garden if they don't. LOL.

Kathy, I did see it, but didn't know it was the survivor's blanket. Just wanted everyone to know in case they went and got a whole roll of foil thinking that is what it was. Foil would work, but be expensive and difficult to work with.

Glad that is what you were using.

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:06 AM

blomma, had to look at that pix again (enlarged...) sorry didn't realize it was a bit out of focus...oops. But the only thing I definately recognize is Dietes iridioides Fortnight Lily, 2nd shelf from the top....far left. the ones that look like Iris g. leaves. I did remember to dig these this fall and got them inside now as I'm not sure how hardy they will be around here but worth it... I do know I had these on one of those shelves...: Digitalis (not sure which one this is) along with Centaurea ruber , Geum or Potentilla which I had gotten from the seed trades and wasn't labled correctly (pix 2). I could only guess at some of the others since I had started sooooooo many things.. And some of my Dianthus X Loveliness Pix 3-5. Those i remember for sure...lol.

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:45 AM

There is all sorts of info about companion planting, espcially on the Internet. Ive read about Marigolds and Spider Mites in books too.I'm not going to tell ANYONE that what works or doesn't work in my area will work in theirs. I'm not like that. I believe we all have the right to express our experience and knowledge on a discussion forum, if not its your blog. It is hot and dry down here for months, at least 1/2 the year. This year SM weren't an issue but we had a lot of rain. I feel I have the right and obligation to let people know that Marigolds are great against rootknot nematodes but could cause a problem with Spider Mites. People do what they want with info but at least it's there.

This message was edited Mar 4, 2015 10:46 AM

I have my first batch of swap seeds and also those I ordered this fall.
So will start winter sowing some,--- soon.
I start my lights at the end of February.
I can hardly wait to get started!
Caroline

I find it fascinating how plants behave differently in different parts of the country. I knew about using marigolds to protect against nematodes, but since we don't have a spider mite problem in our climate, I didn't know they would attract them.

I won't be starting seeds until the end of March this year. We are planning to be away quite a lot until then, and even though I use self-watering systems there's a limit to how much they will hold. Last year by March some trays needed refilling in only 4 or 5 days because the plants were so developed and so greedy.

1lisac, please don't feel you have to go away.imagining your gardening is VERY different (as Pam said) than us here in the northeast. It's nice to share experiences and we all learn

Blomma, that's SOME NICE tomato! Wow!

1lisac, don't take offense, or take it personally. Take it as an opportunity to further educate those around you. If nothing else was said, you wouldn't have delved into the subject deeper (which is what you ultimately did).

Challenge in life is beneficial not detrimental. I am grateful for every teacher I have, especially for those that encourage me to think.

Caroline,
I am with you....first year winter sowing and can't wait to start....then see results. Have you winter sown before? What are you planting? I'm planning a wide variety of perennials and will do a few annuals later,say in March or so

OK, reading this got me going! I am starting with perennials, and am growing some for a client. I use Garden Supply Company's APS units - I've been using them for at least ten years.

Rose Queen Salvia; Salvia x superba (Swallowtail, 2014)

Ruby Bells Coral Bells; Heuchera sanguinea Splendens (appears the same as Firefly) (Swallowtail, 2014)

Heuchera sanguinea Firefly, (JL Hudson), packed for 2008).I grew my plants from these seeds, and want to check the germination rate and the final form

Salvia verticillata White Rain, (Hazzard’s Seeds), packed for 2015. I grew this great plant at my former home. I purchased it from Bluestone and you can't find it anywhere. Hazzard is the only source for seeds I could find.

I have germinated perennials in January that bloomed in July. I have a south facing patio and a heating unit so warm that it is ripening my red peppers that I started too late last year, so I should be able to pot up plants early.

On to the next tray!

Wow, Donna,
You GO girl! :0)
Good start! What do you mean by an APS system. I'm assuming they dont call it the same thing or dont sell it any longer (I looked). I'm guessing it's a shelf with lights, etc?
Do you have plans to plant other things and this is just you getting started?

You know, when I was writing this a little voice said, "Donna, you should write out the full name of Accelerated Propagation System." But I was too lazy. Which confuses people. It's there and it's great. Here is the link:

http://www.gardeners.com/search?q=aps

I started many years ago with the "Starter Kit" which was excellent. Soil! Fetilizer! Labels! But what's really great is the way they keep improving it. As the year goes by and I order replacement parts they are better and better and more and more durable. At one point I had multiple 12 and 24 trays and one or two 40's. I was growing hundreds of seeds using three sets of shop lights hanging from the basement ceiling of my former home. I was insane. I did this for years while trying to figure out what permanent plants I wanted. I put the excess in pots. I had about 50 pots (watering crystals in the soil do wonders). Once I figured out which permanent plants I wanted, I started figuring out what could be grown from seed. I have five digitalis mertonensis seedlings in the ground. The are huge. If you buy them, they are about $9.95 each. I think they cost me a nickle.

Here I can't do the shoplight thing, because the previous person put attached shoplights to the CEILING in the basement.

So I bought this:

http://www.gardeners.com/buy/tabletop-grow-light-system/8588495.html

I must say that they made it easy by allowing me to pay for it in 8 installments. And it was less pricey. But you get the lights, the soil, a timer, the trays (2), fertilizer. You literally only need to add the seeds and water. I would much rather do shoplights - but this worked.

And, oh yes, this is me just getting started. That was one tray. Next is double platycodon perlemutter (courtesy of the wonderful Pam) cynoglossum, white platycodons and some lilium Emerald Temple seeds I got from the American Lily Society. And some heliotrope, which requires very high temps to germinate, so I usually wet paper towels, put the seed in a baggie, and put the baggie on top of my fridge.

January will be some petunias and pennisetum setaceum for my client.

February will be salvia viridis and salvia farinacea for me and my client.

I am doing everything earlier than normal because I can heat my patio, and because I want things to be of good size for my client.

Well, really I'm doing everything early because I can't stand to wait. And before I had no place to put the plants. Now I do.

Oh Donna, you are SUCH an enabler....LOL!
That's a pretty neat setup. When you reuse your set up do you buy their growing medium and fertilizer? The current APS starter set says it comes with (peat) pellets shows growing medium in the first photo. Not sure this would work well for me as I have no place to move plants to if started too early. Sounds like you have a great setup/plan! I will have to keep thinking about this!

When I bought it the first time it came with a good soilless mix. Peat pellets make me uneasy. I buy my own seedless mix from a hardware store. I have been using this one for years. It works well. At one point I tried mixing my own. What a mess! Perlite, vermiculite, peat all over the garage, LOL!

http://www.acehardware.com/product/index.jsp?productId=1747255&KPID=1323100&kpid=1323100&pla=pla_1323100

Watch out for Miracle Grow - they sell a seed starting mix with starter fertilizer in it. That's a no no. Seeds bring their own first meal. Also included with my kit is a very good seedling mix that you use when the plant develops its second set of leaves. The container was so generous I used it for at least five years.

You are smart. For a long period I would start too early without a place to put the plants, and not only was my basement a virtual jungle, but plants would suffer. Normally I start petunias in February and salvia in April. The exception is certain perennials. I started a bunch of platycodon in January, put them outside in July and they bloomed in October, which I thought was pretty rocking.

The best and cheapest method (how I miss it) is to go to your basement (I had wood beams), attached shop lights on chains and raise them as the plants develop. One of the cool things about this setup they have is that you can raise and lower the chains. And shop lights cost about $15 each. One day when I really want to blow money I am going to get one with more levels. They are pretty pricey. I thought that they were really smart to let me pay for it over 8 months.

If I could make a suggestion, do keep track of what you do and what works. I have seed from companies that gives me 90% germination despite being 5 years old. And I know how long the germination process REALLY takes. It becomes easy if you know that the time from putting a seed on seed starting mix to putting it in the garden is 90 days. It's also neat to know how much of the seed germinated.

Raising your own plants, especially perennials, from seed is the BOMB!