Killed 2 of my chickens today, a Buff Orpington that hatched in August and had just started laying, and a 1 Year old Black Copper Marans Hen. My husband went out with the shotgun when he saw the dog, and the neighbor pulled up begging him not to shoot her dog. She said she would pay for the birds... my question is how much is fair?
I told my Husband $50.00 for them, he thinks that is too high. I reminded him that I can't replace those birds full grown, I either have to buy chicks or hatch them, then I can't just buy 2 chicks, or 1 egg, and no guarantee if I hatch 25 eggs I'll get a hen. I add to the value the time and feed we've put into them to get them to the point of laying, and then the future eggs they would provide. Taking all of that into consideration, I think $25.00 per bird is fair.
Anyone else been in a similar situation? How much is fair? Thanks for your help.
A Neighbor's Dog
I know it is possible to buy laying hens for much less, but I still think your price is fair. What a sad loss!
I'm with you on the $50. It's a small price to pay for her dog not being killed. She should keep it home! So sorry for your loss.
I'm so sorry to hear that! I think $50 is cheap. Hope they keep their dog contained from now on. 50 bucks for the chickens and no second chance for her dog. (although I don't think I could shoot a dog, ever).
Sorry Mel but I can't agree with twenty five bucks apiece. The layer is worth twenty, and the blackcopper is worth thirty...OOP's that is fifty bucks...Truly that is a tough loss, and that does not take in the stress factor. I think your spot on. My neighbor (a retired Judge) his dog killed one of my chickens five years ago. He appologized, and offered to pay for the bird. I told him this one was on me, if there was another killing there would be no charge, I'd kill the dog. We have been very good friends since and he has kept his dog home. That lady needs to take better care of her dog, and I'm sure your husband sparing the dog, she will...Good luck...Hay
I agree 50 is fair as well. BCM are worth more
Porkpal, I could get a laying hen cheaper, but I can't get a BCM or a Buff Orpington locally. I've bought full sized birds via mail before, and shipping for 3 birds was 95.00. From Florida to Ohio, actual on the label from the post office price.
We get 3.00/dozen for eggs.... it's going to take me 18-20 weeks to get new a BO hen to the point of laying --much longer for the BCM. So, if each Hen gives me on average 4 eggs a week, that's about 18.00 in lost egg production per hen, which is about what it will cost for the feed to feed out 2 chicks to a 20 week maturity, that equals 54.00, plus the price of the birds.
The reality is I've lost about 8 eggs a week for however long they lay. I'll conservatively say 2 years... that's about $200.00 in lost income just from those 2 birds. I know there are some variables in there, and I couldn't positively say that that is how much I'd make, but it makes $50.00 sound reasonable to me.
He also got hold of 2 roos, one worse than the other. I'm not going to call her until I see how the 1 roo is... he got up in the roost tonight, he's got a cut on his back, but who knows if he was damaged internally. If he dies, I'll probably add $10-15.00, though in the right market a BCM roo is worth more than that.
I don't know what the fine is for letting your dog run loose, but if I call the Sheriff instead, I'm sure it would cost her much more than $50.00. They have to pay the fine for breaking the leash law, and make restitution.
I'm just heartbroken and extremely angry about it. The last time a neighbor's dog got loose, I lost my entire flock, and I DID call the Sheriff, but that neighbor (different one) denied that it was her dog.
Annie, if something was mindlessly killing your girls, you could shoot it... dog or not. I had never shot a gun in my life until the dog was killing my girls one after the other...I took the gun out, shot at it 3 times, and didn't hit it. I put the gun down, and swore at the dog, it started wagging it's tail at me. I felt terrible, it wasn't a monster anymore,it was just a cute pup... so I called it, it came, and I put it in a crate and called the Sheriff. Had hubby been home, he wouldn't have missed.
I wasn't home today when it happened, but hubby did tell her if it happened again, he would shoot it.
Hay, you're right, NONE of the girls will probably lay for a week.
Donna, yes the BCM's are worth more... but people who don't raise chickens just don't understand that those particular birds are gone... I won't have another like either of them. I might get the same breed, and they might look the same, but they all are different, just like people. I still miss some of the girls I lost when the first dog got loose.... and I still miss my Roo, Tweeter. None of the birds I've had since have come close to matching them in personality. :(
I'm not arguing against the dog being shot. I said I don't think "I " could shoot a dog (I'm a dog person) because it was acting like a dog. It is always the owners fault... the dog was running loose and not trained well enough to stay home or be called off. I know the excitement of chasing the chickens probably make him/er deaf to any commands. Still, that is the owners fault and another good reason for training and fences.
I could shoot a dog if it were attacking a person, no problem. As i said, if they only pay $50 they are getting off VERY cheap considering your time, expense and attachment to them. I'm so sorry for the loss of your chickens, and for you having to go through this. I hope your roosters are ok too. I'd let her know about them. There may be an expense to treat them, antibiotics, whatnot. I sure hope tomorrow is better for you and your chickens,
Sincerely,
Hey Melissa, I posted in another thread that I have some BCM's that I'm not going to keep because I've decided to stick with the Wheaten Marans. They were just born this week. You are more than welcome to have all 13 of them as soon as their adoptive mom gets tired of them. Seriously, if you want them they are yours, no charge. I'm in Ohio too. Come on down!
$50.00 is cheap for the owner, especially since you didn't report the loose dog.
I have had one incident with dogs, and it was a pack. After that, I bought a rifle, and would use it in a similar situation.
But, a couple of days ago, I was out trimming my apple tree, with the chickens wandering about, when I saw a dog across the street. Most local dogs stay on that side, but I watch, of course. I didn't know this one (tri colored hound) so just hoped she'd do the same. Well, this one saw me and started to wiggle, and to run towards me. I could hear a car coming over the hill. I screamed at the dog "NO", and thank what ever you want to, she dropped and stayed down.
Of course, I went and grabbed her, and called someone to bring me a rope. Long story short, collar, ph#, and owner who came quickly. Turns out she'd gotten loose from just behind where I found her.
Sweet dog, just a pup (under a year), and it was an accident. I'm really glad I didn't shoot her, but I was ready. I don't know if she was coming to me, or going after the chickens, but I'm glad it was a happy ending all around.
Whew....
We have a neighbor whose dogs are often in our yard. Luckily they have never been able to get at our chickens, because they're in a fenced-in area, but we worry that if we weren't home and the dogs had plenty of time to check things out they could breach the fence. People just don't seem to understand how important it is to keep their animals on their property. Our dog NEVER wanders!
I think $50 is more than fair, and you should also explain the economic impact of the loss of those chickens, the way you did here.
I couldn't shoot a dog either, though, especially if it wagged its tail at me. I love dogs too much.
I'd tell him if it's too high then he can replace them.. Exact same breed, exact same age, and laying.. Or you could tack on court costs!
Did we mention pain and suffering?
Stupid people.. I had a neighbor that was worse.. He told me to shoot the dog!
OH ZZ's I once had a guy tell me that also, needless to say I told him I'd rather shoot him...It really galls me that people respond to your loss as though it's your fault for even having chickens...I have known Mel for a long time and she is a great lady. I remember you helping her ZZ's through her first hatch, and when the storm destroyed some of her birds. She's a fine lady and if she is ticked she has every right to be...it's very upsetting when you can't trust your neighbors to do whats right. Just remember what JYL went through. It's shameful...and I for one am really sorry for the emotional, and financial stress this has brought to you Melissa...
Annie, I had to laugh when you said come on down... I'm on the Ohio river... if I go down too much, I land in Kentucky. :)
I didn't call her today... it's Sunday, and I just don't like to do things like that on Sunday... and the BCM Roo is still acting pretty puny... I don't know if he's going to make it or not. I may take him to the vet tomorrow if there is no change.
I don't think under other circumstances I could shoot a dog either, but I did shoot at that one to try to make it stop, for all the good I did. :(
I don't know if a Pyrenees would have helped in this instance... but I'm seriously thinking about some kind of GD.
Losing the two chickens aren't going to break me financially... I just was pointing out what I have potentially lost... I'm a teacher, hubby is a mechanic, fortunately we don't have to rely on our farm animals for our livelihood... but they do pay their own way and provide eggs for us... plus, I like watching them... best entertainment available.
Well then, come on up! Or I'll meet you part way!
I really do understand your loss. It's a really long road from chick to a laying hen you actually like. Plus, Chicken TV is priceless.
If not a GD, how about electric fence?
Be very, VERY careful about saying ANYTHING about shooting dogs. Especially on line. I posted about a neighbors dogs killing my chickens and someone else posted that we might want to shoot the dogs and it ended up with me getting slapped with a PPO and costing me $14,000 and the worst year of my life.
I'm so sorry about your chickens and I hope you do get re embursment for them. Everyone should feel that their animals are safe in their own yards and everyone should KEEP their animals safe IN THEIR OWN YARDS.
I know I've posted before about my experiences with the neighbor's "free range" dogs. We are transplanted Yankees and are not used to "free range" dogs but wanted to get along with out neighbors. One of their dogs did get shot, but I didn't do it. I had warned them what their dogs were doing. They were chasing cows in labor, not just in my pasture but in the neighboring pasture as well (probably else where too). And, of course, trying to break into my chicken run and coop. They said their dogs were just trying to protect the cows, etc. from coyotes. Well, sure enough, their stud (these are purbred Great Danes) came home injured from a bullet and it cost them huge vet bills to save it. And, sure enough, they thought--and still think--it was me who did the shooting. I've told them I am the one who kept catching them and bringing them home. Why would I waste my time doing that if I felt I could just shoot them. Since then one of their females disappeared. She had pups so it wasn't voluntary on her part.
I installed an electric fence and another of their dogs got stung/shocked pretty bad while trying to bust through it to get at my dogs (who didn't even see it until it started kicking up a huge fuss). Well, that dog went running across our pasture and out into the road and was killed by an oncoming pick up truck. Right in front of their kids, too. I told them that I had nothing to do with that as the dog got into the electric fence. The only thing that kept them from calling me a liar (which they were ready to do) was that one of their kids finally admitted to seeing the whole thing. I've told them over and over again that I could never shoot a dog. I just can't. Folks stopped waiving at me when they saw me by the road. They started looking the other way when I waved at them
So then I got new neighbors (not replacing the Great Dane people--other ones). They seem nice enough. She shows those Chinese Shar-Peis. Well, sure enough, I looked out the window a couple of weeks after she moved in and there was one of her dogs. Sniffing all around the chicken coop. I sent the Catahoula and the Sheppard mix out after him. He looked like he wanted to fight but at the last minute thought better of it and got chased home. The next day there he was again. This time I chased him home and told the neighbor she needed to keep him at home. She said that her dogs would never stray that far (there are quite a few acres between each of my neighbors and me) as they were show dogs (what does that have to do with it?) and that her dogs were harmless. I told her what had happened to my other neighbors and that, although I didn't like her dogs straying onto out property, I also didn't want anything bad to happen to her dogs. I love dogs.
So...the next day....there was her dog again. This time digging at the coop. So I shot it with son #2's paint ball gun. Got it real good. Paint all over it. He took off like a bat out of you-know-where. I'm told those things can really sting. Then I got the visit. Very angry because now this dog would miss a show, etc. I told her that the paint was better than blood and now she wasn't going to tell me that that was not her dog. She didn't laugh, but after pausing a bit did admit that I was right about that. I haven't seen her dogs since. Nor her for that matter.
So now I've made it clear in the neighborhood. I won't shoot your dog, but I will send it home howling and covered with neon orange paint that doesn't wash out of dog fur very well at all! Folks have started waiving at me again when they see me out by the road. That doesn't matter that much as I have Corgis, a Catahoula, and a Shepard mix to talk to. And DH, of course. Oh, and one neighbor who keeps coming over to tell me that I am gardening all the wrong way. But, still it is nice to be acknowledged.
Anyway, I think that $50 is way cheap. Real cheap. We don't have leash laws out here in rural Texas. But I do know that if the Sherriff is called in on a situation like yours, he would shoot the dog. The one neighbor who does talk to me told me that. So I think she is getting off very lightly. Very lightly indeed. Nothing can pay you back for all of the upset and loss of peace of mind this has cause you, Melissa_OH.
WOW, thats quite a story Terri. I don't remember reading it before. It's just to bad that so many think that others should suffer at their pleasure. That was a great solution for you, but admittedly most of us are not willing to buy a paint ball gun set up...and your right, they sting like the dickens. Why should we need laws to tell us how to behave? when common sense and respect should direct our responsibilities.
Sorry to be so long winded. And the last sentence was deleted somehow. Phewwww! I really feel bad for anyone who is at the "receiving" end of any wandering dogs. Its really not the dog's fault.
Oh well, 'nuff said from me. Don't mean to hijack thread. I really do feel bad for you Melissa_OH. And anyone else who has this (dog) problem.
Oh, and PS. The paint ball gun was real cheap from Wally World. I think they are getting rid of them.
I also have a problem with neighbors dog comming up and told him I didn`t want to have to call animal control and he said do what you need to do,so I called animal control and told him what was going on and asked if I could just shot him with a paint ball gun and he said NO!
Poor dogs, they always have to pay for their owners ignornace. A dog chasing a cow in labor, that's a lot of money to lose!
It is really sad how some people act
Animal control told me I could shoot the dog, but I could still be arrested for it cause the Sheriff's Dept. didn't have to "agree" with their laws! If the animal is killing or threatening to kill your chickens, you should have the right to defend your livestock... Geez!
I wouldn't have shot the dog, but still.... If I had a paint gun I would have! I lost a LOT of chickens to dogs!
The laws all depend on how has the most power and influence. That's how our system works now. Truth, property and civil rights go to the highest bidder.
Yeah, if I had a paint gun, I was mad enough to make the Animal control officer a hot pink or lime green splat on his butt for saying.. "Well, they are just chickens, and if a dog didn't get them, something else probably would"
I'm glad Ky has a statewide leash law. If a dog is threatening my livestock or my person I can shoot and kill it and the owner has no recourse. They will also be held responsible for damages. Of course, that doesn't help when idiots throw out a starving dog and it kills to eat. I lost 5 chickens to a starving boxer that was thrown out here. I wanted to shoot her so bad but she had no idea she had done anything wrong. Came right up to me wagging her tail. I took her to the pound. Sometimes hounds come past but they haven't bothered my chickens. They are usually hot on the trail of a deer or a coyote and if they are chasing the yotes that makes them an asset to have around. A pack of beagles has been running rabbits in the creek bottom next to my house. Of course, running is a stretch. The dogs must not get out often because they are wider than they are tall. They are so fat they just waddle through the bushes but they haven't bothered anything. i know who they belong to and the owners have chickens too so te beagles are used to them.
I have been very fortunate here, though I live in the country, except the Judges dog, (he is deceased now) only once have I seen stray dogs. I chased them home to see where they lived, put a note on the door of the owners house and that was about four years ago. I haven't seen them since. Having to deal with others animals of any type on my property does not sit well with me. You might remember about three years ago I shot two of my neighbors yearling cattle that tore up my garden. I had taken tons of pic's, given several warnings to the neighbor with no apparent concern. I had them both butchered, kept one and sent him the other, since then his wife left him and he has had no cattle for at least two years. It was not fun shooting anothers animals but enough was enoughl. He never called the Sheriff which surprised me but I did not care one bit...
Terri-emory, I loved your story. Please don't ever apologize for letting us know what's going on. We learn from each other, not to mention the entertainment value. :D
Thirty years ago, there was a sheriff here that said if a dog is on your property outside the city limits you have the right to shoot it. Well, there was this one crazy guy that shot 300 dogs and had them in a pit he had dug. The town was not happy when news of it hit the newspaper. They dug them all up and it was quite a scandal.
Guess I shouldn't call him crazy, I met him years later and he was nice enough to me. I didn't know for a long time that he was the one that had shot and buried all those dogs, or I wouldn't even have talked to him. Not sure why he got his jollies from shooting dogs. If it had been my dog I would have been heartbroken. Back then, my dog was like my own child.
A number of our neighbors have roaming dogs but they stay off our property because of our own mob of dogs (all of which were once discarded strays themselves until we picked them up.) Also our pastures are all fenced with hot wire which keeps our animals in and theirs out. I do have neighbors who regularly shoot trespassing dogs and no one reports it.
terri_emory I'm really glad you shared your experience. There is no such thing as hijacking, we're all just sharing information.
roo is still hanging in there. I still haven't called the neighbor yet. I've been swamped with work at home after work the past couple of days... hopefully tomorrow.
Hi pretty lady been a while sorry you got hit. Here we used to practice farmers Justice. Very simply you said nothing shot the offenders and buried them.No arguments that way.
A lady move to the country and within weeks her dog dug under my chainlink fence and killed a few of my kids chickens. On it's second trip back I chased it back out of the yard got the truck and followed him home. No one home but I saw her at the corner store and she denied it was her blacl lab with a thick red collar. So I said fine keep it home or I will apply farmers justice. She asked me what that was and when I told her she freaked out lol told every one around that I was a creep. Creep or not the dog never came back and she never offered to pay anything and I didn't push it because she wasn't owning up to it.
I have 15 working girls and three Golden Ret who are living proof dogs and chickens can live in peace.Just takes a few lessons before they taste blood lol.
Hold to your price the memory of that should reinforce to the lady that the dog needs to stay home.She can stop the dog from attacking the girls in two Saturdays and Sundays if she wants to.
We had that situation many years ago with a neighbor whose dog was always wandering over to our place and showing an undue interest in our poultry yard. DH asked him to keep his dog home but he denied that the animal we saw belonged to him. DH commented that if it was a stray the neighbor wouldn't mind if DH shot it next time it came by. For some reason that dog never showed up again.
I've used rit dye in a super soaker squirt gun on "stray" dogs. It doesn't hurt them and it is hard to deny that their dog roams when he comes home looking like he has been tye dyed.
That's probably a more painless way of making your point!
I like the rit dye idea!!!
Hey Ernie!! :) Nice to "see" you!!
I like the paint ball idea a lot. It's painless proof.
Proof, yes. Painless, not so much, but I'd say a good, non-lethal deterrent :)
Rit might be better if you're looking for painless.
A little pain will help train the dog in case you can't train the owner.