Propagation: part XIII based on my own experience

Hello to everyone and welcome to those new to our little chat. Plese feel free ask anything, as we try to keep it simple and feelwe should always pass along our own knowledge. Lurkers are also welcome.

We came from here: http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/t/1068021/

As with all of the threads I stat I like to welcome anyone new to our little corner of Daves Garden. Please take the time to read all the past threads. Most of them have some great information in them. There are no dumb questions except for the 1 thats never asked.
Please check in if you are continuing on from part XI. I like to make sure we did not loose anyone.
I try to keep things on track and a nice calm slow paced thread that everyone can understand.
pic is Scabious boujolies bonnetts
Dave

Hi everyone. Dave, this isn't the milkweed from the wild, at least I don't think so. It is a vine, actually two of them. One has white flowers and the other blue. Can't seem to find any info on them, course probably cause I didn't look in the right place. Thanks, Lee

Lee, last fall I gave some milkweed, one was scarlet, and one vining, seeds away in the seed swap. Didn't know you were interested.

Well NASCAR is done and gone. Thank goodness, I do not live near the track. It is about 30 miles from here on the other side of town near the freeway heading toward Utah. The track is right next to Nellis Air Force Base where all the noise is from the jets so they are in a great place together.

Didn't know I was interested until I saw pictures of the milkweed vine. Just can't find any info on them. Any ideas on pinching or not pinching and when to pinch any of the bedding plants? I never know if I should pinch back, or leave them alone. Thanks for the info. Lee

I heard milkweed was great to attract caterpillars and tomato worms and keep them off the rest of the garden. Is this the same milkweed?

Milkweed is used by the Monarch Butterflies for laying their eggs, larvae, caterpillars etc.

I got some milkweed from Park Seeds this year, Asclepias 'Butterfly Mix". I really love the butterflies, so I am really looking forward to more colors than orange. Has anyone here grown this mix?

Evelyn

I grew it a couple of years ago. It grew good but the blossoms never opened. I gave them to my sister since I wanted to change the bed. The next year I saw that she had a big bud on it, but did not see it later.

Whoops!

This message was edited Mar 1, 2010 9:16 PM

It sounds like it takes a year to get established and then it blooms on the second year. I would pinch it after about the 3rd or 4th set of leaves show up. It just goes back to my basics on pinching vs non pinched.
I feel pinching is needed on almost all plants. I am sure someone will speak up and give an example on what not to pinch. Typically if you pich after 3 or 4 leaves come on the limb and then pinch again after 3 or 4 more sets of leaves and so forth, you will have a great plant that is full all the way up not just 1 or 2 stems going up to 3 or 4 feet and then a nice bushy vine above. I use this on most every thing I grow.
Trees are another story. You want to maintain a central leeder on the tree so it will get big and tall. a lot of the junipers and cypresses are an exception to the rule. Gold thread cypress comes to mind. Although it can reach 10+ feet tall it can be maintained as a short good looking globe shaped shrub. I have seen several of them planted in a row and it made a nice part of the landscape bed.
Trimming and shaping plants in the landscape is an art some of us have it natually and others could not shape a shrub if their life depended on it.
Topiary: Is the art of shaping either plants around a wire frame or trimming a plant into an animal shape. I highly recomend that everyone try this at least once. I worked in a museum that had an arboretum. we had both an english garden with short hedges manicured into different shapes and designs.
We also had a 4 ft elephant in the greenhouse. It was a shape of rebar, wire mesh and long spagnum moss. The elephant was covered with creeping fig - Ficus pumila. We had to give him a bath twice a day in the summer and about every 3rd day in the winter. He got a hair cut once a month. There is a series of how to on topiary in the articles. this one shows both Topiary as well as an english knot garden.
Bonsai: Is the art of trimming, shaping and manacuring a plant to remind the viewer of a landscape, a scene in nature or an individual plant. Same arboretum - we had about 6 different specimines of bonsai. A mini forest of trident maples, a couple of individual specimines, several scenes as well as a 12" coleus tree.
The coleus had been trimmed so much that the leaves changed to smaller - tiny leaves. The tree was at least 5 years old, and trimmed quite frequently.
Once a year they would host a bonsai show where several growers would bring in their plants to show as well as sell. One grower had an elm that was 150 years old. he called it the queen of the prairie. The elm had been dwarfed by cows in a pasture where he found the tree growing. It was about 18" around on top and had a very nice trunk to it. It was one of his babies and not for sale
Yaupon Holly - Ilex vomitoria: is one that is sheared in my part of the usa. I have seen it shaped to a nice small multi-stemed tree, a 1 - 3 ft shrub planted in mass either in a row or a small grouping. Many of the hollies are very forgiving on the trimming of them.
Boxwood - Buxus spp: they are used in english gardens as an intricut knot design with other plants planted in the blank spaces. It gives a neat celtic feel. They mak a nice hedge anywhere from 6" on up to their max height of 8 feet. They are used in topiary shapes also. You would want to use a smaller dwarf species on most hedges of less than 24". the smaller plants reduce the amount of time and energy you spend keeping the hedge in shape. Boxwood is a slower growing plant so the rule can be ignored for the most part.
There are a lot more plants that can be shaped and made to acomplish what you want to end up with. It all starts with pinching. Don't be afraid to pinch a plant. it can be intimidating at first but I promise you it will grow back, as long as ther is atleast one node left for new branches form.
Sorry this all hodge podge but this forum keeps reminding me of new topics to explore.
Dave

Evelyn, I too bought the same seeds from Park. Here is a yellow one that was in the seed mix. Pretty!

Here is another variety that I like. A. incarnata grows to 3 ft and is bushy without pinching. common name is Pink Swampweed. Blooms from July, to Aug.

Here it is as a full grown plant

Dave, I can see why you say to pinch that aschlepia. blomma shows the purple one that bushes automatically. The one I had just had a few trunks. It would have been much better if I had pinched it.

Take even dahlias for example. I pinched mine when they were up about 6 inches and they didn't need to be staked. You obviously would not do that for a show dahlia. A speciman plant. But in our gardens it was much nicer to not have to stake them. I wonder what would happen if you pinched delphiniums, fox gloves, and a few of the other tall plants? I have never done that to them so end up not growing them because the wind blows them over. Even when I stake them. They break off where they are tied. Very interesting. I should try that on a few. They would be shorter and fuller wouldn't they? Or would they? Maybe they wouldn't bloom at all.

Jeanette:
I am curious too. the blooms on those are suposed to be a big spike...are they not? I have avoided those plants because of size.
Oh yea...soil pile update. we ... my brother in law moved all the pile to the back yard. It filled the new beds on the north side of the house from the front gate to the back fence on both sides. I will try to get pics for you.

When you pinch, the more flowers are produced, but they become smaller since the plant's energy is divided.

Most plants do bush out with maturity. Some plants such as delphiniums would lose its stately look if pinched. Possibly, the flower head would be greatly reduced in size. Some tall plants do produce addtional stalks on their own, but that is natural, not forced.

Yes Blomma, that is why I have deferred from planting any. Because of that fact about the delphiniums and some others. You are right. That is why I said that if you are wanting specimen plants in say, dahlias, then you don't pinch them either. You stake them instead. Myself, I would rather have a bush, even though you have smaller flower heads than have the stake and ties.

Actually, I think the bushy dahlias are much more attractive in a garden than one single flower. And then especially if you stake and tie it.

So Dave, what are we planting in your raised beds? I'll bet you are excited to get going filling them up. I will help you if you are earlier than I am. Just looked at your zone and yup, you are earlier than I am. You may have gotten more snow than I did, but I think it was colder here this winter.

OK OK to pinch or not to pinch, I will follow your rules this year. I never did know if--when- or not to pinch. I planted 6 flats so far, that is all the heat mats will take. Thanks for the info. Glad I started it!!!!!!!!! :)

Blomma: You are correct about the more stately and formal plants requiring them to be left alone.
Jeanette: I am not sure what all I am going to plant. the long bed is 72 feet long. I think I want to do a fragrant perrienial bed. I wii use the bed against the house to plant my Daylily crosses and hosta seedlings.
I am hopeing to get out tomorrow and sow some lettuce, carrots, spinach, broccoli and radish's. I am planning to do 4 rows of each so i can harvest one week each week when they are ready. Being we don't need that much area for each weeks veggie harvest.
The problem I have found myself in is I have more wants than I do $$$... but how can I be out of money I checks left in my checkbook.
The pic is of the north side of the house

Here is the ne corner of the house. I am planning to do either an english knot garden or a couple of Yew's with a small hedge of boxwood to spruce up the bottom of the bed. It still needs landscape timbers put in.

The one good thing is the mature yellow jasmine growing up the fence. as you can see its a perfect example of a few stems growing up with foliage growing at the top. I think I would like to have a better gate at the entrance of the north side of the garden. Something like a trellis or a small arbore with some clematis or Knockout climbing rose growing over it.

Oh wow Lee, you are zone 3 and started already!! I usually am started a couple of weeks ago by now but I was determined this year not to start too early. 'course, this year our weather is so great that I should have I suppose, but I just don't trust it. I think about the time I put stuff out there it is going to freeze and snow.

What are you growing Lee? Are you going to get any cuttings from ncf? If so, what, and rooted or unrooted?

Are you going to be able to get your plants in your greenhouse when they come up? Wow, I am really envious of you.

JB, what are you doing? Don't tell me you are planting stuff already too? Oh, that's right, you plant all year don't you?

I am getting my shelving this week and hope to get it all lit up and ready to plant my trays this weekend. I am using my previous shelving in the pantry in the basement and don't want to take it out of there to bring up here to put my seeds on so I have to go to Costco and gt new stuff.

Dave, we cross posted.

I meant to ask you JB if you can get out enough to send out your orders that people had sent? I know that was buggin' you.

Jeanette is it an excuse to spend money??? Just kidding.... now I am jellous a new bakers rack with lights. Are you going to enclose the shelves?
I have been toying with the idea in my head for a while now and I think I have most of it figuired out. Cut a long enough piece of plastic. fold over the ends and staple them to form a tube to fit 1/2" pvc. I just have to get the what goes where and how many do I need worked out. I am thinking the plastic clips to hold plastic sheeting on pvc would work on the sides to close off the rest of the shelves. What do you think???? Of course we have 6 weeks of winter left here and its suposed to be in the upper 50's this week with a 60 or two mixed in.
This is the time when I hate the weather and all its changes.
For my new beds I am thinking some peonies if I can find someone to trade with. any suggestions would be apreciated also.

crossed again

No, I am not going to enclose them because I will have themin my kitchen and it is pretty warm in here. Maybe just to spend money, but I have them filled with canned food in the pantry, one of them, and the other one is full of fertilizers, inspecticide,and pots. No, I am not going to put all that stuff in boxes or on the floor.

Boy, well, we are getting close to the mid 50s. I guess I am a zone behind you. I am not sure what you are doing with the plastic and pvc. Do you mean you are enclosing shelving with it?

Peonies are not fragrant. I don't think. They bloom maybe 3 weeks,

BTW, did you get the seeds I sent???? If you don't tell me, then I have to think they didn't get there so won't send any more since I must be sending them to the wrong place.

I also have a couple of peonies but I don't care too much for them. Like Jeanette said, they are beautiful when they are in bloom, but messy and ugly after the couple of weeks of blossoms. No, not going to order from ncf this year. Just can't afford it. I planted some petunia (wave) today, I hope I will have room out in the "bar" room to keep until I can transfer to the greenhouse. Some of your seeds, and Dave's will be started tomorrow. I am experimenting with bottom heat or not. Same shelves, just not on the mats. Lots of lights 5 shop lites, 1 greenhouse lite w 4 bulbs wide, and two with 2 bulbs wide. I have room enough for 18 flats at a time. Once the babies are up, I usually move them to the "bar" We have 4 x 6 windows on 3 sides, and skylights above so hopefully they will get enough natural lite. Lee

Well, they say that daylight, even if it isn't sunshine is so much better than any kind of manmade light. lol, only word I can think of right now.

Actually, with the peonies, I made some pvc and string frames that the peonies grow thru and hold them up, even through the rain that they look nice. And, when they are done blooming, even the leaves look good. Clear into winter.

Just a square with 4 legs, using tees and then drilled holes with a tiny drill bit and took eyes the size of cuphooks and screwed them in and then ran the string back and forth. It formed squares for the plant to grow up thru and holds them up good. They are almost 2 feet square because my plants have been in for about 12 years. Should be divided I'm sure.

Jnette, can you post a picture? How tall are your supports? Good idea.

I'll see about a picture tomorrow. Bob said we cut the legs in 15 inch pieces, but it depends on your plants. However, you can just shove them down in the ground as far as you want. These would work especially good for your area Lynn. It is so rainy over there and these hold them up like a nice boquet of flowers.

Just remembered, we are going to Spokane tomorrow so may not get it done until Thursday. I also sprayed painted them green. They have paint that you can use on plastic now.

My son, Dr. Gottschalk just moved to Spokane. His family is not there yet. Just wave as you are going by the hospital and say hi, from your mom...LOL...

What hospital Sharon? What kind of dr. is he?

I knew you would ask that. He is an internist and his cell number is 702 592 6470. Still a Nevada Cell. I do not know the name of the hospital or the clinic but he is very happy. Call him and tell him you are one of his mothers gardening friends from the internet and he will understand. He is a gardener want to be and a very nice young man. He is 45. This is Todd the day his son, Luke, was born November 2, 2009.

Nice looking fella Sharon. When is he starting?

Todd, or the baby. Todd is already there and Baby Luke is still her with his mother, grandmother and aunt. We will miss both but baby Luke is still here.... Todd is he big guy.

both.

Hi, blomma!

Sorry so late, was in town all day. The yellow milkweed almost looks like 'Hello Yellow'. Very nice! did you get other colors as well?

Evelyn

Hi Evelyn:
Yes, I got the orange one also. Only a few germinated for me. Now, a few years later, I realize why---they need stratification to sprout.

blomma, thanks! I will keep that in mind. I will WS it.