planting tomatoes early or not?

Hi I have really nice tomatoes growing under my grow lights, I have 4 of them that are just huge and I am wondering whether or not to transplant this ones earlier in the ground or not, I have the use of some plastic covers that I can place in my raise bed to warm up the soil and I can also leave the plastic cover in the whole time so the temps outside just don't kill the plants, but I am also concerned of the weather lately and was wondering whether or not it would be too risky to plant earlier, I would hate to loose those plants since I just don't have any more seeds for some of them and would love to be able to save seed in the future from these particular ones.

According to my farmers almanac calendar I can start planting my maters on the 15th of next month, so my plan was to harden the plants about a week earlier and see if they would survive the weather.

Also if it is O.K to plant earlier, do I have to still harden the plants even if I place them under the covers the whole time?

thanks

Mine are used to normal temps when I set them out because they've spent their lives in the unheated greenhouse. I start leaving the door open when it stays a little above freezing. The biggest concern for me is hardening off for sun burn. The greenhouse is somewhere between indirect and full sun. I have killed plants before by going straight out to the garden. Growing them in the house would be an even more extreme shock so do harden them off.

When putting them out for real, I like to wait for a real cloudy day ahead of rain. They don't need to drown but a decent rain really settles them in and gets them going.

I'm nervous about the weather this year. Mother nature has been playing very dirty. I think I'll just pot up a few very early ones and take a chance with them first. I will be very happy if the frost goes away by the 15th but I can't shake the feeling that I'll be tricked into planting only to be sabotaged with a late freeze.

Thank you Twiggy, yes I am concerned about the weather as well, I would hate to loose this plants but also wondering if they'll make it that long inside my house as well. I will definetely harden them off. I was wondering do you think a week of hardening the plants will be plenty? I was thinking of about a few hours the first day and then just increasing one more hour every day after. Should I place them in my raise bed's and cover them with the plastic for the hardening off period or just let them be outside? sorry for the silly questions but I am really new to this.

I got some seeds back in 2005 by various really nice people and I would hate to loose this plants since with all the moving not all of them were viable so i lost a lot of prospective plants.

If think the temps might get too cold (below 50 degrees) I would not put the plants out. They can survive indoors under lights. Especially since you expressed that these are the last of your seeds of certain varieties, I would wait. If you can keep them in cooler temps and try to hold off on water, that will help slow their growth until you can plant out. I wouldn't rush it if you think it might still get cold. They have a better chance of survival indoors.

Thank you, yes I think you are right, never know with mother nature.

They're right, Carmen. Especially tomatoes, since you can plant them deep - not much concern if they get leggy inside. If you do put them out and the temps stay cool, they will just kind of sit there anyways and not grow too much, especially if the nights are cool. I think you're better off keeping them inside and closely watching your 10-14 day forecast. If it looks good and nights will stay over 50° with no weird weather predicted, then you will be safe to plant them out. One-two weeks to harden off is sufficient.

Thank you Kelly, I think you are right, I sure hope the weather changes soon, I also started some cucumbers and squash they are already coming out of their seed, I hear they don't like to be inside the containers for too long, since they don't like to be rootbound.

I set out tomatos/peppers in plastic tile.
Each is about 12" long & 1" dirt holds then in place.
If frost is forecast........
Cut squares of 24"x24" craft paper, set on top of tube & pull around sides.
Hold in place with rubber band.
You will be amazed at the amount of protection you get.
It is OK to keep covered up for 2-3 days, for extended cold snap.

Negarden 999, that is a great picture, it almost looks like a self made wallowater. I might wait a little longer expecially for the maters that I don't have seeds from, if they made this this far, they should make it at least a couple of extra weeks, or so I hope.

negarden999, that looks interesting. I'm not sure I understand what you mean by "plastic tile". Looks like some sort of tubing, but I can't tell what it is. Can you elaborate for me? Also, are you leaving the tubes on for the life of the plant, so as to not disturb the branches the grow above it?

Tile is about 1/16", has ridges & drainage holes/slots.
Thin, will not collapse, thanks to ridges.
Same plastic as larger "blow pots".
Not cheap, but should last 20 years.
* 4" x 20' is about $20 * 8' x 20' about $40 Cut into 8"-12" sections
If farmers or developements tile in your area, inquire about "drops" & misc pieces.

I use 4" for broc/cauliflower & cucumbers.
Also protection for Hybrid Willows & other barestock trees.
8" for tomatos, peppers & okra.
Slits are too small for most bugs....great insect protection.
Nice way to assure water goes into root zone when watering tomatos!
Tubes are not removed until fall freeze.
storage...... stuffing them into tomato cages

Looking at long term payoff, I could not immagine being without them.

negarden999, that looks like a really good idea! I've been worried about a bunny situation that is developing out at my place. I think that would keep the bunnies out nicely. My dogs are really good at catching bunnies but are not allowed to run through the veg garden. I am little concerned, though, about leaving the tile/tube on all year here in the scorching Texas heat. Black attacts heat. An opinions from more experienced southern veg gardeners?

Of course the Red Tailed Hawks, owls, and coyotes will be working at this very minute to curtail my bunnie problem and I need not worry.....but I am trying to keep those coyotes out of my garden as well. I never did see many rabbits on my property until this spring. Naturally, the year I'm really gearing up to get the optimal tomato varieties going for my area and garden.

Yes I am wondering the same thing, I am wondering if you can get it in another color or not, maybe white.

Those tubes are a great idea. I don't think it comes in white, but there's always that spray paint for plastic to paint them white.

Plastic DRAIN tile...

http://www.draintile.com/tubing.htm

Linda you are great thank you!

You're very welcome!

Properly hardened off tomato plants can handle soil temps down to 45. However, longterm exposure to these temps can cause problems later on in development. I would suggest setting up the enclosure you will put your tomatoes in with an inexpensive soil themometer. Take the soil temp a few times a day for about a week to get an idea of the average temperature. You may also want to look at the weather history in your area. (Weatherundergound and NOAA have weather histories going back a few decades.) March weather can be unpredicatable. But this may help you make an educated guess on what to expect in the next month or so. Also, try to have a back up plan in case the temps drop down really low. Last year, I had tomatoes started about a month earlier under row covers. There was a suprise cold snap that threatened my entire crop. I threw some old blankets over the row cover and plastic overlay for the night. The blankets were suprising good insulation. They raised the soil temp an additional 7-8 degrees. Sometimes the simplistist solution is the most effective.

Carminator1,
I've decided to pot my tomato seedlings up to 16 oz. solo cups and then put all the cups inside a sterilite container with a lid. I'll drill holes in the lid and the bottom of the container. Also, I'm only putting them halfway down so I can add more soil and deep root them as they grow up. I might even use the huge 32oz styrofoam cups.

I can set them all outside in the sunshine to start hardening off. If the temps drop it will be really easy to get them all covered over, even if I need to throw several blankets over the container.

Karen has a pic of this whole set up under the wintersowing thread.

I just potted up 5 early varieties. I lined them up against the south side of my garage and covered with floating row cover. I've got more in the gh just in case. Yesterday I was wearing what amounted to 2 sweat shirts and now the forecast has been changed to WARM for the next 7 days. Wooohoooo! It's crazy but I'll take it.

That's exactly why I'm putting stuff out now in protected cloches/containers or under my hoop house. Which, I figured out at 5:30 this morning, will allow me to put the bell peppers out too. I totally forgot I had all the components to make a hoop house right over the two raised beds! I can go ahead and sow some more seeds and just protect the beds with the covered plastic..

This weather is not going to drive me crazy!

lol - you all are crazy! Well, more rain is in the forecast as well as a cool day Sunday, so looks like most of my babies will see plant out tomorrow. I want to get ahead of the weather. Next week we warm back up into the upper 70s and it's only hotter from there.

On a side note - who do you all know in the San Antonio area who might be willing to do me a huge favor?

We are just getting over a small series of storms and currently in a cold period. This should take about 3-5 days to reach Texas and a little over a week to reach the East Coast. We always get the weather first. Good new, Next week will be sunny and warm for us. So, you may see this the week after.

We can only dream....

Linda, placing the seedlings half way is exactly what I did and so far is working great, I saw a youtube video of somebody doing just that and so I decided to try it myself.

As far as the weather, it is crazy, I just don't know what to do with it. I am wondering whether to start hardening the maters or not, I woul like to give them a little over a week of hardening before planting them out, it seems like temps are going to get milder as the week goes so I might wait a couple of days.

I just decided to take all my winter plants out of the raise beds and prepared the soil for planting, even used some ironite for added minerals, both beds are almost empty except for 3 cabbages that are still growing and a few lettuces that I am letting stay until they are mature.

So far my maters are doing good but are getting very, very tall and have already reached the top of my growlights, hopefully I'll be able to plant them outside soon if the weather cooperates.

Carminator1,
Could you post some more pics?

Here's some of what I've got that I'd totally forgotten about!

and.

This, too!

Yup - forgot about RATFOOD. Posted on Texas forum. I am trying to get a new tomato plant from a nursery there that doesn't ship... RATFOOD can pick some up but doesn't know how to ship plants. So, if they can get some then we'll have to help with the packing tutorial and I'll be in business.

Linda, that's a great idea of using the milk bottoms as containers for your seedlings, I'll have to try that out as well as I just throw mine out all the time.

I just place all my peppers and tomatoes outside to start the hardening process, we will see. Today I will just place them there for almost 2 hours and I'll just increment 1 hour each day afer that, they are getting pretty leggy and big so I have to be careful when I move them outside that they don't bend too much, I would hate to loose them after all this hard work.

Here is some pictures.

Here is aother of my whole grow lights, growing peppers and cucumbers and squash as well right now.

Your plants look great!

Robin thank you, but I really need to plant them outside soon! some of them are already to the top of my lights and as you can see they are bending because of the long stem. Today I placed them outside for 1 hr 30 min just to start the hardening off process, tomorrow if weather permits I'll place them 3 hours and so on, hopefully by the middle of this moth I can finnaly plant them out.

I started hardening my peppers as well, but do I need to do the same with all my seedling including the basil and the cucumbers and squash?

I know what you mean about needing to get them planted. I started all my seedlings way too early for my zone, but it was my intention to plant them in the garden under low tunnels. I just don't know that I trust the weather to plant them out 2-3 weeks early. I didn't use a light set up. Mine are all sitting in front of south windows and I leave the ceiling lights with CFL bulbs on all day. The plants look pretty healthy and not leggy, so I guess it's close to enough light. On decent days, I open the windows, but I usually just run a fan a few hours each day on them.

I've got 4 cherry tomatoes in self watering buckets that I added cages to and set the buckets inside huge semi clear trash bags pinned to the the top of the cages and set them outside for a couple of hours today. I'll be increasing the time out each day till I move them to the greenhouse.

IMHO, I'm guessing that yes, you probably need to slowly harden off the other plants too, just to be on the safe side.

Carmen you've got good looking stuff. I see 3 much larger tomatoes in what looks like 1 gallon pots. Did you plant them lots earlier or did they just grow faster on account of having the extra space? Did you move them up by re-potting?

I'm itching to start a couple cukes.

Your plants look great Carmen! All plants grown inside need to be hardened off before planting outside. Some will make it with little hardening time and some will still pout for a few days no matter what!

twiggy the tomato plants that you see in the 1 gallon pots I did start earlier, I did not know whether the seeds were good or not so I decided to plant earlier just to make sure that if they were not that I had enough time to plant others in their place. I planted this ones about alomst 8 weeks ago and the others 6-7 weeks, which I thought was a good time frame. This are the only 1 gallon pots I had available ( I had them from previous purchases of plants) so I decided to place the biggest ones on them, I am having hard time finding this types of pots localy they only seem to sell thicker plastic ones and they are a little pricier, so if you of anybody has an idea on where to get this 1 gallon flexible pots I'll appreciate it. I mainly started all my tomatoes in small containers and then replanted them into bigger size ones 3 times for most of them, I thought this way I would get a better root structure on them and that they would be a little better off.

Kelly so I should also move all my other plants as well, OK I'll just have to do that, I just was not sure if this was just for tomatoes and peppers or if it was for everything else as well.

Robin yes I probably started a little earlier 8 weeks but maybe next year I'll just play it safe and start them a little latter just to make sure I don't run into unprecedented weather changes. I am really hoping the weather stays warm.

I think they're looking very good for their age. If those biggest ones are only a week or two ahead of the others then they're certainly a testament to the value of up-potting for promoting growth. Only a week ago 3 of my plants froze to death in the GH but at last I think I can see some growth every day since the warmer temps.

I went to a nursery supply place in NW Mobile to get my pots. The 1 gallons cost 13.5 cents each 2 years ago. I wanted a different size last year and found that they'd gone out of business. The nursery business is big over there so maybe if nothing else, you could call the chamber of commerce for some names and call to see if they sell to the public. Sometimes the big nurseries like Flowerwood will sell you used ones cheap.

Carminator1 ~ have you seen this feature on DG? http://davesgarden.com/guides/freeze-frost-dates/index.php?q=mobile+alabama