I just can't get used to them here at the coast and yesterday while planting some coleus got in a bed of them and have about 19 bites.
Ouch
What do you do /put on the hills to get rid of them?
Lavina
What do you do to get rid of the pesky Fire ants?
I use Amdro but I am told the Over and Out, which you broadcast over the entire area, works even better. Over the years I have tried all the home remedies out there and can assure you they do not work. Some of them might slow the ants down or cause them to move to your neighbor's yard but, sadly, they come right back.
So sorry you got bitten, they are evil little critters, hope you are feeling better today.
Ditto to what Ardesia said. The fire ants seem really bad this year.
PLEASE watch yourself and your kids with fireant stings. You can be allergic and not realize it.
Please Note: This is not real common, but it does happen, just be aware.
If you (or your child) get stung and you get raised hives or have trouble swallowing, call a Dr. immediately and/or get to an emergency room!
My son when 4 years old got stung 14 times (easy to do if you step in a mound) and he went into anaphylactic shock within about 40 minutes. Luckily my mom was visiting and saw the hives on his stomach (showed up in about 10 minutes) and made us call his Dr. and then not wait for the paramedics. (We found out that you can make it from the zoo to Baptist Med. Center in about 4 minutes if you do not stop for lights and top out at about 80 miles an hour on the freeway.) Good thing, too because he stopped breathing about 2 minutes later, they gave him a shot, he opened his eyes and said "mommy" (I had been good and strong, calm, etc. all though it, but at that point I nearly fainted - Dr. sat me in a chair so I did not hit the floor). Son had to go for shots just like you do for beestings. He is now (at 20) okay, but we keep an epipen and benadryl in each car and the camping first aid kit and at home, too.
For info on that see http://twurl.nl/cdtz73
I have used Amdro in the past. And yes, the fireants seem to be bad this year.
The Bayer brand powder works really fast, too. Kills them all in several hours.
You have to kill the queen to get rid of them, easier said than done.
Ardesia when are you leaving? I applied for a small lot shipping certificate and I received it yesterday. I'd be more than happy to mail you a copy and one of the green and yellow permit labels. It's for seeds only though. With the certificate and a copy of my permit you'd be able to send me seeds with no problem as long as they aren't on the prohibited list. They would have to be sent to me, so bribes would be in order. ;-)
X
LOL, we are leaving Sunday to take Boolie dog to our son's house in NC and flying off to paradise on Monday. What kind of seeds are you looking for?
I happen to like mint planted in w/my flowers and I also put the used coffee grounds each day on the beds. Don't dig it in just toss it out on the beds. Because of that I no longer have slugs, snails nor fireants in my flower beds. I am told that the mint keeps the fireants away.
Ann
I saw on another forum that mint seems to work. I asked about it at a talk on herbs that I went to last Friday at our local nursery and she was not aware of using mint as a repellent, but was very interested.
I do know that Walkers Low Catmint (perhaps not a true mint?) does not count, because I found a mound in it last week.
Clemson University here in SC does a lot of research on RIFA (red imported fire ants), I wonder if they have any information?
I wasn't really looking for anything though I knew you were wondering about the best way to ship stuff back here .. my certificate is only good for seeds .. If you want a copy and a certificate d-mail me your address and I'll get it in the mail as soon as I get your address.
X
Getting the thread back on topic, does Hawaii have fireants?
The trick to fire ants is keeping on top of it. Get a bait or insecticide, I like Spectricide Fire Ant Killer because its an insecticide and baits it seems tend to lose their effectiveness after about 4 generations of ants. Treat every mound you see at the same time. Then every 3 - 4 days, walk around your yard and look carefully for other ant nests and treat those, even if they don't look like fire ants. You'll need to do this for at least a month to finally get rid of them. What happens is that when the colony starts to die, they move house and set up somewhere else (this is more prevalent using baits than insecticides), usually within 10 - 15 feet of the original. What you will ultimately do is force them to go to your neighbors yard. After a month or so you can confine your ant hunts to once a month.
As to the "put it down once" stuff, the vast majority of the people I've heard from who have used it, and reviews I've read say it doesn't really work. To keep ants out of your pots, I sprinkle some Spectricide underneath where I have the pot. I replenish it about every month or so. Seems to work really well for pots sitting on the ground. Do not however use it under pots with vegetables you are gonna eat.
X
Sadly yes, Hawaii does have the imported red fire ants but apparently, they live in trees there. Isn't that interesting? Same bugs different habits. Their soil is mostly volcano cinders and drains very well in spite of the 165" of rain they get. I am told the ants live primarily in fruit trees (where they love the fruit sugar) and they tend to drop on unsuspecting gardeners from above. Yikes, I am not sure which is worse, our ants or theirs.
under the pots, very good idea!
They advertise a "once a year" broadcast /whole yard treatment, anyone had any experience with that? Maybe if after you use the intensive walk-through above, then applied the Year-long?
I hate those doggone things.
Any organic solutions for the veggie garden and dog play area?
Back a while go a good dose of dursban would get rid of them for a long time. Diazinon will work too but it has also been banned. Supplies are still out there BTW.
I've fallen off the organic bandwagon. I strangely like things that work for what I want them to do.
Lol, I hear ya! I think organic is probably fine in the NW and NE, but in the south, disease and critters just belly up to the bar and ask for more! It took a good solid year for me to finally get rid of all the fire ants, and I was able to talk my neighbors into doing what I described above because of all the children that play in everyones yard. Our street is virtually fire ant free now. When I do my evening walkabouts I'm always looking for mounds and if I see one or what looks like it might be one it gets treated immediately.
X
I work with the fire ant specialist in Columbia that Pyro mentioned and according to him there is little other than the chemicals that work for the pesky critters.
Interestingly, I have pretty much gone organic in other areas of the garden and, after a few years, it does seem to be working. I have far fewer insects and a bit of Neem seems to take care of those that do venture into the garden.
Neem and fruit trees work if you want to spray all the time. Last year I had aphids or thrips that were doing a job on all my citrus leaves. Curled them all. Nothing fatal happened but my trees are small so they don't need to be getting beat up by the bugs right now. An older tree usually doesn't have as many problems with pests etc .
When do you start spraying with neem? I had thrips last year on my rudbeckias
I just use it when I see a problem. It is an oil and it smothers the existing pests but, like any non-systemic you do have to repeat it to get the subsequent generations that might have been incubating. You would never want to use a systemic on a fruit tree.
I was to late last year but I started spraying about two weeks after the trees started fruiting. What was happening was the bugs were going after the new leaves. Citrus have three flushes a year of new leaves and which ever bug it was (up to debate there) would attack as soon as new leaves came out. They didn't go after the old ones. I also had ants running everywhere around the trees and in the trees so my first thought was aphids but after a debate on DG and a "Making Grow" show thrips seem to have been the problem. They seemed to have been a problem all over SC last year.
Soap will also kill them off immediately but won't do anything the next day when the bugs return. Pyrethrins are the same way. I was actually using a spray with neem and pyrethins in it. You have to watch out during the hot weather with oils because you can burn leaves if you use it in the middle of the day.
Good advice on only using oil sprays in the early morning or preferably, the evening.
The only pests I had on the citrus were cottony cushion scale and leaf miners. The oil handles the scale; nothing works on the miners but they only disfigure the leaves, they are really not harmful to the tree.
BTW, I bought some citrus fertilizer from Ned and my trees have loved it. They are growing like crazy.
Does the neem seem to work on fireants?
Not that I know of.
Fireants have been a big problem in our area and I can assure you that we have tried every means of getting rid of them. We have no fireant beds in our yard now since we started 3 years ago using Over and Out. It works !! You must follow the directions on the package especially noting the time of year to broadcast. Here is info from Clemson Ext.
http://entweb.clemson.edu/eiis/pdfs/to6.pdf
Thanks you all I am still scratching my bites can't seem to stop even with medicine.
I will try some of these things,also a friend said grits or rice will do the queen in.
She eats it and it expands.
Lavina
That's a myth about grits and rice.
It's too late now, but if you get bit again, bleach diluted with water, about 1 tbs per cup dabbed on the bite will lessen its severity. Fire ant poison is oily with proteins and the bleach water breaks down the venom. You will get tissue necrosis from those bites and they will look terrible. Believe it or not, plain old Bactine works for me. It seems to stop the itching and the bite seems to heal quicker.
The bleach water is also good for poison ivy. It neutralized the urishol that is on the plants into harmless constituents. You can actually spray diluted bleach 1 to 1 on poison ivy if you have to work around it or are getting rid of it.
Forgot to add that the bleach becomes inert once it dries and is NOT harmful to the environment or surround soil. It will however, kill anything it gets on.
X
This message was edited Apr 29, 2009 2:21 PM
My mom always put bleach water in a squirt bottle (1 part bleach to 10 parts water, I think - I will have to ask her) for weeds because it did not 'hang around' like a lot of the chemicals do and it is cheap and she always had it around. Back to the basics! Thanks for reminding, X, that is one of those good chemicals that we forget about.
I have heard that washing your tools (especially trowels and clippers) in bleach helps with poison ivy, but I did not know that it neutralized it, I thought it just released it from the surface so that it would wash off. PIvy is tricky stuff, it is easy to get it and not know it until too late. I make it a habit to wash with lots of soapy cool water after hacking back shrubs, Only got a small dose of it last year. Getting more sensitive, though. I could roll in it when I was young. Not now!
There is a new product out that acts as a both wash and a treatment for PI (not for systemic, that requires a Dr., but it can help with it then, too). It is called Zanfel. Great stuff and works like a charm - expensive, but if you get into a patch and forgot to wash it off it might save you some misery.
After clipping shrubs/ivy I take a bath with Otogen (msp) soap, it has always worked for me.
We use clorox to kill the english ivy back every year. It works wonders.
Lavina
I have Fire Ants big time on my property, and I've grown to absolutely hate them. Can't find a single saving social grace for those things. So I go after them aggressively! I also grow "organically" whenever, wherever feasible. On the parts of the property that the dogs can't get to ("invisible fence" protected), I treat with "Over and Out", or "Total", etc, and it seems to really work. But it MUST be watered in! On the occasional mound I find during the summer months that seems to escape the Broadcast treatment, I've found a product called Orthene that also works. But you have to spread it way beyond their recomendations to make it work. Fortunately enough, I've found another product on the web called "Ex-ant"... totatally organic, and it seems to work....So far...
Orthene if I remember right is in the same family as Diazinon.
Orthene is old .. I use to use it, combined with a fungicide on my roses .. it's called Orthenex .. I don't think you can get it anymore.
X
It is the smelliest stuff on earth too. You can get it but in much weaker formulas.
The only place that I can still purchase Orthene is at our local farm supply store. I buy it in the powder form and then mix it with water.
It may be listed as Acephate 75 SP. It is used by farmers as an agricultural insecticide but it has instructions for dilution for use on roses and many other ornamentals. Great stuff!!
I also agree with the other post that it works great on fire ant mounds. Just be sure to follow the instructions. I was told to just sprinkle the powder around the outer edge of the mounds. Next day they are gone.
Orthene and Orthonex are readily available from Lowe's (and probably Home Depot, etc). Orthonex has a fungicide component, Orthene is a pure insecticide. Both are effective in my experience, if label directions are followed carefully. Mint is a bad joke as a fire ant deterrent...one of the biggest fire ant populations I've ever encountered was in my mint bed...wound up just sacrificing the whole bed to get rid of them. The "Broadcast" products like "Over And Out", "Total", etc., DO work, but again , you have to follow label directions (they have to be "watered in" to be effective), but I've seen about a 95% reduction in fire ant invasions over the summer after appllying them. Still get occasional mounds, but they're easilly treated with Orthene. I spray the powder form about 2'-3' beyond the label recommendations. Seems to work...
My favorite however, is still "Ex-Ant", an organic formulation that really seems to do the job on these beasties. Not cheap, and not easy to use (it's a liqid formulation), but it's the ONLY thing I'll use among my veggies...
I'll have to look again at Lowes for orthenex .. I didn't see any at home depot.
X
I'm so allergic to fireants! If I have a couple of bites on my foot, for example, I can't wear shoes for a week! I swell up like you wouldn't believe! Gardening in a 'space suit' for protection isn't funny in 100 degree weather! I can't wear sandals or dig/touch plants bare-handed. I just have to be very careful. I am going to try some of the mentioned remedies because fireants are all over my yard and love hanging out near my citrus trees! I am so excited about maybe getting rid of them!
Flowerehj, I realize that you likely already know this, but had to pass it on anyway.
In case you missed it you should read my earlier post near the top of this thread, especially if you swell up like you say.
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/p.php?pid=6469729.
That sort of swelling for one or two stings is not normal. (Everyone says 'fireant bites' but the fireants actually sting - just like a bee or wasp and the venom is similar, though you can be allergic to one and not the other). My son nearly lost his life because of fireant stings.
I am not a Dr. but allergic reactions can start with swelling and if you get stung again, even one time, in a certain period of time (the peak reaction) you can go into anaphylactic shock. You might want to see an allergist to be tested. It could save your life. When my son got stung again years later after going through the de-sensitization shots he was able to take 5 (yes, 5) Benadryl tablets and then I watched him carefully (this was all with his Allergist on the phone, mind you) for a reaction - the shots must have worked, because he did not get the hives and trouble breathing.
So always keep Benadryl (or the store-brand equivalent, very cheap at Walmart) on hand (liquid, too, in case you are unable to swallow a pill) and make sure that if you have any hives, sore throat or trouble talking, or trouble breathing that you get to the hospital NOW or if you are alone call 911, tell them you have been stung, unlock the door and lay down near the front until they get there - keep 911 on the phone. He was also only stung 5 times. If you lose consciousness the EMTs can find you if the door is unlocked.
And flower, if you have not done so, seriously consider seeing an allergist to be tested. And with a reaction like you described, you really should invest in one or more of the treatments for your gardening areas and treat surrounding areas, too. If you or your family members are allergic it could do more that just save you a little discomfort, it might save your life.
BTW, when I go fishing (hot here in SC, too) I have a very lightweight pair of 'parachute' cargo type pants that I wear if I am near this one pond that has tons of fireants. The nylon is lightweight and so is a bit cooler, and I can splash some water on it for a little cooling effect (they evaporate pretty fast even in high humidity and I always carry some drinking water). I always wear socks and I tuck the pant legs into the tops of the socks. Not very fashionable and looks sorta stupid, but keeps the fireants and ticks from getting onboard. An "ounce of prevention".
Stono, thank you for the Mint info - this was asked on another forum and so far no one had come up with any anecdotal or research evidence to counter the claim that mint keeps RIFA away.. I thought that it was too good to be true. Another wives tail.
I googled Exant and could not find it. Do you get Exant at Lowes?
Pretty good paper on treatment from UGA
http://georgiafaces.caes.uga.edu/pdf/3229.pdf