organic solution to bermuda grass?

I have been fighting bermuda grass for 10 years. The grass is winning. I have beautiful organically amended beds that I have to sift through every year in order to attempt to get every last bit of the grass soots, and of course, I don't, so by the fall, grass is growing all through my plants and I have do do the whole thing again. the best I have accomplished is a sort of equibrium--at least the grass isn't choking out my other plants, but it is a very time consuming, not to mention frustrating annual experience!

Pretty much the only organic solution I've read involves covering the beds with plastic in the heat of the summer for a month. -- I had tried this before I planted, and tried to remove all of the root remains afterwards-- clearly this was not entirely effective. It took a couple years before the grass really established but I've learned that one little root can repopulate the world! Plus now I have all kinds of lovely bulbs, self-seeding annuals, and perennials that I would have nowhere to put if I tried this again.

I will not use Roundup, which is why I'm posting here instead of the weeds forum

Any other suggestions?

If it's gradually creeping in from a lawn area, you could try pounding a metal barrier down into the ground as a root barrier between the lawn and the bed, that may stop the runners from creeping into the bed. For the stuff that's already growing in the bed, you could try vinegar, but it's not a magic bullet, some of it will likely still come back from the roots and you'll have to treat it again. And be careful not to get the vinegar on your plants, it's a general herbicide and will hurt them too. Vinegar works best if you can apply it on a warm sunny day.

And put the vinegar as close to the stolon (root) as you can. Putting it on the foliage isn't very effective. I combat it by pulling loose all the foliage I can reach and then carefully spooning the vinegar just on the root areas. I use pickling vinegar - it is stronger - 9% acidity as opposed to 5%.

Be thankful you don't have Johnson grass!

Yuska

I forgot to mention that I tried the barrier method as well-- My "barrier" was 12 inches deep and the grass grew under and over it within one season. I still use the barrier--I try to keep a moat of dirt around my beds. The real problem is the enemy from within! I have used 9% acetic acid from Garden-ville (I used to live in Austin) with good results on the weeds between my flagstones, and I am going to try it in the "moat" area, thanks for the suggestion! It is the bits of root that I miss that re-establish themselves in the middle of the beds that are killing me. Really, a 1/2 inch bit can make a clump within a year, from my sad experience. I just saw War of the Worlds and noticed an uncanny resemblance between the aliens coming out of the ground and the invasion in my garden!

BTW, I don't have a "lawn" but I do have patches of this grass throughout, that survive desert heat, with no watering. If I did want a lawn, it would be hard not to go with this stuff. I'd pick it over cockroaches in a nuclear blast!

Thanks again for your help--and other good ideas?

mudpiegirl,

Good question I also have a problem w/ bermuda and zoysia. It has a way of over taking the beds. It would be good to hear what else can be recommened. I've heard of vinegar ,but never tried it.

I should add that I don't have Bermuda grass, so I don't know for sure if vinegar will work well on it or not. All I know is that it's an organic herbicide, and there aren't really too many of those (boiling water is the other one I can think of, but it's harder to selectively avoid your desirable plants with it!) And there's corn gluten that can be used as a pre-emergent, but that's not going to help any with bermuda grass runners.

Here's a long discussion of bermuda grass: http://www.fs.fed.us/database/feis/plants/graminoid/cyndac/all.html

most of which proves how tough it is! However, it looses vigor when shaded (and goes dormant in cold temps). I have crabgrass as the major grass threat here in PA. What I have found effective is a mulch.

First, mow the grass down mercilessly as low to soil as possible. Cover with a lot of layers of newspaper (black and white - the inks are now soy-based - they say the colored inks are OK too, but I'm still not sure about that). We use about 5 layers, but 10 is OK. Wet down the paper so it doesn't blow away and pile some kind of mulch on top - we use chips leftover from tree trimming. If the grass is too tough, try cardboard. We have used regular old corrugated cardboard to get rid of thistles which will grow right through newspaper and it does work.

Hopefully you will be starving the roots and lessening the invasion, at least where the mulch is.

I forgot to add: It sounds odd, but we fertilize the grass after mowing (with some organic source of nitrogen). Nitrogen is used up in the decomposition process. I think it might even help rot down the sod. Good luck!

This message was edited Feb 5, 2008 3:58 PM

Good ideal CompostR, I've read the same thing on Howard Garret's website. http://www.dirtdoctor.com/forum/ You have to look through the postings.

I have a vegetable garden that will be having the same problem come spring. I hadn't had a garden there for a few years and recently tilled it up. So there will be pieces of stolons and seeds in the garden. I mulched it real well w/ newspaper and leaves.

I have always had bermuda grass and it does get in the beds. The only place I have seen it not do well is in the shade. My Dad says he thinks that his garden does better with the bermuda growing in it. He plows it under every year and it comes back. But he always has a big veggie garden. It it wonderful to pick the vegetables because we are walking on grass and not in mud or muddy mulch. I don't think barriers will stop it. Not to be negative, but it is planted here because it is so hardy and can take the heat and no rain.

Dear Cactus Patch--since my problem is with perennial/shrub beds, (in which the whole tilling thing won't work) I think maybe I need to take your dad's approach and start thinking my garden grows better with the grass in it! Tell your dad I admire his philosophy!

I usually water mine well and pull out what I can. But mostly I just live with it. I do notice though that as the perennials shade it, it doesn't grow as well. And it does keep the moisture in. Dad's garden does do really well in spite of the grass, so maybe it is because of it? I will tell him what you said though!

I have noticed that it is more sparse and stringy in the areas where the perennials and shrubs are well-established. worry that over time it might get the better of these, though--I just moved to this property about 10 years ago and the perennial beds with this problem are anywhere from 3-5 years old. It's good to hear your dad hasn't noticed that the grass wins the war over time!

Anybody find a way to kill off the bermuda grass orgaically, yet?

Keep pulling it out every time you see it?

ecrane3, that's what I've been doing in my vegetable garden. I just figured there might be something easier I could use. I guess when it's time to plant tomatoes I'll use landscape fabric.

Unfortunately there are some things that are just easier to do with chemicals! Although I'm not sure if the chemicals really do a good job on the Bermuda grass either, it's a tough thing to get rid of from everything I've heard (never had the pleasure of dealing with it myself though!)

Yes, that's true, Roundup, crossed my mind. But, I want to stay organic. LOL!!! :0

I tried Roundup in some gravel areas and it really didn't work well anyhow.

Yes, I know it's probally just a temporary soultion.

The problem with anything other than pulling is that it will kill the other stuff in your bed, too. I am planning on trying to douse the perimeter with 10% vinegar--I'll let people know if it has any positive effect.

There is a product called Scythe that is accepted in the organic arena. It is a fatty acid-based product. Someone told me that mixing this half and half with the below recipe makes it even better!

1 gallon vinegar (10% acidity)
2 ounce of orange oil or d'Limonene
1 Tablespoon of liquid molasses (horticultural is least pricey, but you can use blackstrap / cane syrup)
1 Tablespoon of soap

Good to know!