Big kitty is back ?

Last spring I had a fairly long thread about tree scratching and other signs in the woods that MAY have been made by a cougar.
I had posted pictures of trees ripped up, bone cache , found deer hair all over a trail below what looked like a perch in a tree, etc.

Of course we sometimes have a bear walk through, we have bobcats and many other critters that live in the woods and scratch trees and such.

In the mud last spring, I found some very large cat prints, too large for bobcat and too small for cougar. Then nothing.

I am still learning about cat activity. I have read where a young male cougar will come into a new territory. I feel it is POSSIBLE, that we may have had one here. I read where the cat will winter in one place and summer somewhere else. Do bobcats do this too?

Saturday I took the dog for a walk. I was not far from the house in a very sandy area of the trail when I spotted a pile of sand. This pile was about a foot across, about 8" high and had scratch marks all around it.
The scratches were in sets of four, with each claw about an inch apart. The scratches were about a foot from the pile all around it.

Well, I took my foot and dug loosely through the pile. I thought I might find some scat, that I could take in to the DNR to have analyzed. I found nothing in the pile of sand, other than stones and a stick, maybe I should look closer. DH was at work and it snowed before he could see the scratches. But they were still visible enough for him to also scratch his head.

I can think of no other animal than a cat that would scratch up dirt like this. We either have a giant bobcat, or maybe...a cougar?
The bobcats I have seen are only 35-35 lbs or so. This looks like my choc lab paw would fit nicely. He is 90 lbs.

Bobcats do have big feet, but I am not sure they can spread 4 toes to 4". The sand around the area had too many leaves for a good print and I was not looking and the dog and I tracked into the area and destroyed other clues.

The snow is now gone, so it is hard to see if a deer or other animal is buried in the leaves. Wish I would have taken a picture of it.

Any ideas???

Lots of information on here. Some links you can check out.
http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,1607,7-153-10370---,00.html

All I can say is, take some form of protection with you...besides your bear spray when going out. I remember very well your thread from last year.

Debbie

Thanks, I was in there getting information.
Yes, the bear spray is usless, for a big cat.
I did find some scat in the pile and it was fairly small in size. So I think it was a bobcat.

DNR won't do anything if the site is disturbed. Which I had messed with it. Next time I see something, I may call first before poking at it.

I think for your best interest, and your dogs, that would be the best idea. Once you know what your dealing with, you will know how to proceed much easier. If I remember correctly, there are cattle not too far, and even farmers would appreciate knowing if there is a large cat capable of taking down their stock.

Good luck, this is very interesting. I hope you get some answers.

Debbie

Yes, last year a guy had a cougar attack his horse. It was terrible.

I think we are ok, right now, but it is good to keep an eye open and read the signs of trouble.

Could the cat possibly be a Lynx? They are smaller than a cougar and bigger than a bobcat.

That is good idea. If a cougar can be this far south, why not? It is a couple hundred miles out of their area, but stranger things have happened.

One thing that enters my mind with animals being out of their territory, is that "someone" had one thinking they could make a pet out of it. Then when realized it wouldn't happen...set it free in your area. I know when I lived in Florida this was a problem.

You never know if someone came across an abandoned cougar cub or lynx....and tried this.

Debbie

Debbie, you are so right. Cats are beautiful, then people find out they are not pets, but wild animals, they escape or are let out. This is (in theroy) is how we got cougars in middle and lower Mi.

We also have some wild pigs now. Not yet in this area, (about 50 miles south) but they are doing well in the wild. I read that it only takes 3 generations to turn a farm pig into a wild boar. The DNR is very unhappy. I sure wouldn't want to see one of those in the woods either.

We had the wild boars in FL also, and I can remember being warned if I saw one, to climb a tree. They are very mean.

I think one of the saddest things is to see these animals released and they don't know how to cope and survive at all. Most end up shot for going towards humans who do not know they think it might be "mom" and not lunch.

Debbie

Debbie, that is the answer the DNR is using. Anyone with a deer license can shoot one. It is a shame they are out there and that seems to be the only answer the DNR can come up with.

This may be a strange veiwpoint coming from someone who hunts. (deer only)

I think bear spray may work to fend off a pig. I don't want to depend on fear to climb that tree.

Of course, some people keep pet lions and tigers . . . perhaps it's one of those been released??

;-)

Oh, and boars are intelligent enough to know that you've got to come down out of that tree sooner or later . . . and they're also very patient, if need be . . .

;-))

Thanks Resin, your SO much help! LOL

My daughter has 3 "pet" farm pigs. One is a boar stud, weighs over 800 lbs and follows her around like he is a poodle. Can you imagine a pig that size running to you for a kiss? The other two females are also so tame...but...in the wild...I sure wouldn't want to see any of them mad!

Debbie

Yee Gads Resin, I can see me stuck in a tree with a boar waiting, and drooling. LOL
(just when you thought it was safe to walk in the woods)

I have never had a pig, but know people who have them and they say they are very smart and quite a nice animal to have around.

I am sure they get pretty grumpy when they have to look for food on their own. It is pretty tough out there in the wild.

We had fresh snow and I saw no deer tracks at all. I did see bobcat, coyote (at least 2) and a fox (tracks that is). But no big kitties, boars or anything out of the normal. Deer are pretty smart to lay low.

We used to own some land, 'the woods', that my dh & his would hunt on. We had huskies at the time & 2 of them were very large huskies! Anyway, we would take the out to 'the woods' from time to time in the winter. Until we discovered some large kitty tracks. They were bigger than the dogs so we quit taking them out there. But we would still go, always kind of hoping we might get a glimpse of what it was.

People thought we were nuts & imagining things. We sold the land last fall and dh told the new owner about all this. Of course he just rolled his eyes at dh. A few weeks later he emailed us that he had been out scouting deer and sure enough he saw the tracks!!

Those huskies have big feet too. Kind of like my lab. Although the tracks I saw were a little smaller than the dogs track.
There have been sightings around here and the DNR have found hair and scat to verify that cougars are present.
It is like the bobcats though. They live there and you may not see them for years. They are very shy and smart to stay far from humans. We saw bobcat sign for 5 years before we even saw one. What a neat animal they are.

Went for a job interview today and in the lobby they had 2 mounted coyotes. I felt right at home. I hope it was a sign that this is the job for me.

I'm so glad this thread is back up. I lost track of the other one. I missed you and your mystery!

Giggling over the coyotes. I hope it was a good omen!

Thanks, and hi there.
I sent a nice thankyou note for considering me for the job. As I was looking for a return label, here was one with a coyote. I wonder if he notices.

The coyotes have been all over in the woods. Seems they circle around every 5 days or so to ck things out. With new snow, you can really see the activity.

Coyotes may be your lucky animal! We see them occasionally while driving around the country, but they don't seem to be very thick around here.

I know they are a problem in many places. Here, I haven't seen to much of a problem. I have seen tracks of 4 together once a few years back, but mostly a single or a pair.
The guy who interviewed me, said that many people are frightened of the coyotes in the foyer. He came in to greet me as I was caught petting the one. LOL. Its fur was wonderful.

Went for a loooong walk thru the swamp yesterday. Saw many coyote tracks. Took a nice quad ride by the river and saw the most perfect fresh bobcat tracks in the snow. Normal sized bobcat tracks. He had come across the thin ice on the river. It had snowed in the morning, so this guy was out roaming in the daytime. Interesting.

I would say he was hungry if out roaming in that time of day.

We have coyotes here, my daughter sees and hears them all the time. There is a gravel pit near where her DH works, and he sees them almost daily. Many many farmers shoot them out of fear for their livestock, they take down the young calves very easily.

I personally have never seen a coyote unless it had been hit by a car.

Good luck with the job! I hope it works out.

Debbie

Thanks Debbie!

I like the way coyotes can raise the hair on my neck when I hear them howl. I've only seen one that was hit by a car. Closest I've gotten. They aren't a pretty ''dog.''

DH and I do a lot of hiking and see coyotes once in a while. This year, we saw two playing with each other. It was just the neatest thing; they were running and jumping just like dogs. The ranger told us that they were most likely adolescent siblings, given the time of year.

No, they are not dogs. Sometimes they are pretty ugly, the ones with mange.
Ours around have been pretty nice looking. When you see them, they are on a run or trot and you only get to see them for seconds at a time.

How true!

We were on interstate Friday and I looked over in the field. There one stood, but we were on the run :))

When I smoked I always went outside. One night as I was getting ready to come back in the house when I was done I heard a coyote howl over in my neighbors field approx.100 ft away. I decided to see if he/she would receive an answer, boy did he, there was about 3 or 4 and they were just on the other side of the fence about 50 ft from where I was standing. billyporter, TALK ABOUT THE HAIR RAISING ON THE BACK OF MY NECK!! LOL

ROTFL!!!!!! I'm not a real scared person, but I think I would have tripped over myself running for the house!

Yeah, Iuckily enough I was standing right next to the door so all I had to do was step inside. TG!!!

Still ROTF!

I always liked the expression (from The 70's Show) Eric, don't poke the bear. I think it fits :))

I'm glad your enjoying yourself at my expense! LOL

Oh, I am!!

ROFL, I probably would have left a puddle on the ground before I turned and ran in the house.

Yesterday I was out with my son, heading down a somewhat country road....and thought I saw a small pup on the side of the road trying to cross.

I slowed down, thinking I was going for a rescue, but it turned out to be a poor little red fox...with a very bad case of mange. I have a feeling it might have been rabid also, do they come out in middle of day (1:30?) like that? It was definately in sad shape. It wasn't fearful of the van, just backed away from the road....and waiting for two cars to pass....and then crossed over.

We walk our dog out back in a huge field, and I have often pointed out "dog tracks" to DH...he said they weren't dog and I am not to go out there alone. But, never layed eyes upon one....or heard them like your experience.

Debbie

We saw a fox Friday morn at my daughters. He ran out of an old calving shed, so I think they are out during the day. Your's sounds like a sad case. We rarely see them so it's a treat. Sara has chickens, so they are a problem.

THANKS billyporter!! You need to go to the thread "Heidi Chronicles Will they stay or will they go?" and read about my latest encounter with a coyote! You think this one was funny!

This message was edited Dec 16, 2007 3:13 PM

I'll go check it out!

billyporter, Where'd you go?

Over to Heidi. I've seen the thread before and know Scutler, but never read it because it always had 200 posts. So many to read when I had so many of my own to get thru.

I can't imagine how she recognizes them all. Especially in the dark! hey have really become pets!

I didn't find your post tho. Is it in the current one?

Oops, my mistake, I read the current one. Giggling over your encounter. I think I would have been pushing the fear down when it didn't stop. I'm with your daughter!

Really giggling over the coyote coming across the road to visit.

I guess I think I'm a big toughy! Gotta go feed my cats, sheep, chickens and calves! Talk at you later!
Susan