I have Russian sage, asters and goldenrod that I have planted with agastache, miscanthus, Joe-pye weed, 'Chocolate' eupatorium, and 'Autumn Joy' sedum. I plan to add BES and feather reed grass this year. I really need help placing the plants to get the best effect. Thanks!
I've been watching this thread since you posted hoping someone creative and experienced would come along and give you their words of wisdom. That is a very pretty fence row you have there. I have in mine BES and some Meadow Sage ( about the color of your Russian Sage ) and I love the color combinations of the two together. I think from looking at your pics, maybe BES on the inside of ( more towards the center ) your tall spikey grasses. Then maybe some of the Feather Reed toward the middle if you can for more height in the middle? I'm not a designer but sounds pretty. One thing you could do is play with a scetch pad and imagine what everything would look like at maturity and pencil things out before you actually plant. Sometimes I get carried away and stuff things in because I get somewhat impatient with my very tiny garden. But I am eager to see what you decide, I think It will be lovely no matter what, because it's already very nice. Keep us posted?
Thanks cbs~ Very nice of you to say so. That sounds like a good idea. Please keep the ideas coming! I should tell you that I have removed the fountain grass on the right, but have no plans to move the miscanthus, too deeply tap-rooted.
Wow, that would be a good place for BES! What is the plant dead center, with all the pretty blooms? Just interested, I like it.......I planted my Meadow sage last fall, and I'm real happy with the way the plant looks right now. I'm real eager to see this years show now that the BES is bigger now too.
Oh wow crash ~ I did not know what "meadow sage" was, but that is what I have in my front yard! So I'll add that to the list of possibilities. Are you asking about the white flowered plant? That is 'Chocolate' Eupatorium rugosom. I will place them closer together in the back. And jog the agastache (licorice mint) over to the right. What order (please tell me front to back or back to front) would you plant the goldenrod, Russian sage, purple asters and meadow sage? What else, besides BES and feather reed grass, if anything, would you add? I have five KF grasses, thought the BES would best complement the goldenrod.
My husband has to take the fence down temporarily in order to put fence posts in. (It's currently being held up mostly by a chain link fence on the opposite side). So I have to dig up almost everything anyway. As you can see in the photo, the asters had powdery mildew pretty bad by the end of summer. And someone popped off all the flowers! But not my 5 year old LOL Do I need to cut them back now? Thanks for the help.
That sounds like the same situation with a fence that I'm having right now,thats funny, but I think mine is gonna have to wait til next spring. For lack of money and motivation! I'm not so sure I want to try to tell you where to place these plants, for one I don't know exactly the growth habits of some, I could very easily steer you in the wrong direction ( I've moved plants more than once because I didn't originally like where they were).......Wow that is a lot of work to move all those, but I will say, with someone with that kind of commitment, YOU CANNOT FAIL. I will suggest the things I learn from TV and gardening magazines. Knowing the habits of your plants: tall in back, medium in front of tall and so on. Already with your choices of colors I just don't see how it couldn't look great regardless of placement. I like to distribute my color around. And mine to to get on the obnoxious side ( very bright hot colors) . I like your color schemes better. My real hope by posting in the first place, was to draw more attention in hopes of getting the pros involved. Have you tried posting on Garden design forum or maybe Landscaping forum. I think as well as the bed looked in the first place, I bet you can just go out and have fun, not giving too much thought and acheive success. I love the grasses and I'm trying to figure out how to incorporate them into my tiny garden. Well wishes, Sandy
I think I have all those - except the goldenrod. The sedum,grasses and sage are excellent winter interest plants. Some of those prefer a bit drier conditions and some a bit wetter, but most tolerant of dry or wet. Certainly the grasses and sage should be the tallest so the back row for them would be better. I could be more helpful if needed(disclaimer)
Okay thanks Sandy. I was hoping that more people who grew these plants would know their habits better, my plants forgot to read the labels LOL For ex., this aster is not "compact" to me, but then I've never had any other kind. And I've got six of them! (Aster dumosus 'Sapphire') Needless to say, they are very easy to divide.
Oh and I forgot to mention, have you tried spraying baking soda for powderery mildew? tsp for a qt water , 1 tbsp to a gallon once a week ? It helps. of coarse, real late in the season mine get it too. Not quite as bad. Lets see what bigcityal has to say.........
Oh good, thanks. I can do baking soda, not into chemicals.
If you're getting powdery mildew on your asters then it will be much worse on the BES. I haven't done any spraying for it(although I could). I have a 7' aste that would go great in your back row - staking required ;)
You might want a harder leafed rudbeckia then, like goldsturm, yes they 'could' get black spot instead - but no PM.
There are shorter varieties of New England aster - what height is yours right now?
Al, somehow I missed your previous post, thanks for commenting, I love your gardens. The Russian sage will get taller than the goldenrod? Right now the asters are between 9 and 10 inches tall. Oh, and I just realized that the Russian sage, meadow sage, asters and licorice mint are all the same color. So I need to beef up my yellows and pinks in order to balance it out. I guess you will tell me what rudbeckia has the hardest leaf? I'm looking for R. hirta, that has the longest bloom time.
I believe mine are Goldstrum, they flowered for a good long time, no mildew, but had a very small case of blackspot. In fact it was so miniscule, I didn't really care.
Well, this is in the waaaay back yard, so I wouldn't care either LOL.
I think all the hirta's have soft leaves. Goldsturm is a fulgida. I have been very happy with rudbeckia submentosa"Henry Eihler's'
I like helenium too, Double Trouble has no problems that I know of.
Standard russian sage should be 4' or so, there are shorter new ones. Solidago is 3-4' I think.
This is my miscanthus "silver feather", 7' or so.
OOOOOOO! MUST HAVE 'HEHENIUM"! I gotta have it I gotta have it! Double Trouble eh?.......That's beautiful, bigcityal.
bigcityal, did I see dahlia leaves behind that helenium? any more pics? I would like to live vicariously through you garden!
I did rearange a bed this spring that will have helenium, my tall aster and Karl Foerster in it. I am far from being a color combiner, most of my plants are in spots where they grow happy though now.
Here's a shot of my NBA all stars - Red/Gold Helenium, Harrington's Pink aster and Lauren Michelle dahlia - all over 7'
BIG WOW! That's awesome!
Al, I wish I could be a honeybee in your garden. Got a pic with the KF in it?
I don't have a very good summer one. I do have a winter one in my images. I had tried it in that back row, but it was short and I moved it this spring to a better spot.
I do have one of Overdam - which is similar. This is one I put at my neighbor's. I have looked over your plants and bed again, were you enlarging that bed at all first? I mentally tried to squeeze them in and it was tight.
Look into Boltonia Snowbank--a lovely, very tall ,white daisy-like aster that blooms in August/September. Stake it or support it in some way--4 ft tall easily. I look forward to it every year and for the last 10 years it has been trouble free and reliable.
Thanks for the photos Al, yes I need to widen and clean up that edge. The only thing I'm adding for sure is the KF and BES, and I have about 2-3 feet to the left of the photo and then the side of the garage to plant. I'm going to make an L shaped, curvy bed. I have enough purple, need more yellow and possibly pinks. Since the Joe-pye and sedum are pinkish colored.
I have a Korean feather reed grass too, I think it's supposed to bloom similarly to your Overdam, but I acquired mine late last year. The weird thing is, mine all seem to do better in shade in my yard.
Thanks for the suggestion bacarney. I'm actually thinking of replacing the asters with a pink one, like Alma Potschke. They sure do well in clay!
Yellow is easy.
I have Alma - she will not be denied in early fall!
OMG is that ONE plant?! She is so pretty.
After I posted, I realized I had purple coneflowers too, which are actually pink of course, and White Swan coneflowers. You know what I love, that yellow flower with the green eyes, Irish Eyes or something like that? and my step-daughter had a tall, bushy yellow daisy flower with a brown center, but I don't know exactly what it is.
And more grasses: switchgrass, prairie dropseed, and little bluestem. The little bluestem may have been KO by the weird weather, it's not filling in much.
That's one plant, I think 3 years old. I have it growing through a peony cage now - works better.
Irish Eyes is nice, I don't have it anymore.
Okay, I checked. Irish eyes is called gloriosa daisy. It's a Rudbeckia hirta hybrid, a short-lived perennial that may self-sow, or is treated as an annual. Where do you get rudbeckias? I mean, do you grow them from seed, or purchase plants from the garden center? If you grow them, got any tips for starting them? Do the yellows clash with each other? I'm thinking of giving my brother the goldenrod and purple asters, he would be thrilled at their easy care.
Last year I grew Goldilocks, Chim Chimeree and Cherokee Sunset from seed. They were easy, I just started them in pots and thinned later.
Goldilocks.
so pretty. thanks al.
So if I were to keep the goldenrod and asters, how would I arrange them with the sages, grasses, and rudbeckias?
This message was edited May 18, 2007 7:55 PM
PG - I'll get you a plan this weekend. Hey check this out, I dug up my clump of Goldilocks I seeded last year to divide - I got 6 good divisions of it.
Woo-ee! Free plants! That's gratifying isn't it? I have a six foot X 3-4 foot (narrow) garden bed next to the house out in front that I want to relocate next to the garage, it has switchgrass, pink coneflowers, purple allium (also in this bed), and a little bit of milkweed for the monarchs. I have white coneflowers, another licorice mint, blackberry lilies, dwarf spiderwort, Purple Palace heuchera and prairie dropseed for that side too. I can bring the existing bed out another one or two feet, I like the fuller look I get in late summer.
Irish eyes is actually different from gloriosa daisies. I grew both from seed this year. Irish eyes is yellow with green center. The gloriosa daisies are more like cherokee or chim chimeree. They have yellow on the outer edges, and varying amonts of brown and orange in the centers. I have both the irish eyes and gloriosas mixed in with my black eye susans.
I actually grew irish eyes from seeds from two different companies. One was listed as rudbeckia hirta, the other was rudbeckia fulgida. One is significantly taller than the other.
PG,
LOL, it seems that you too suffer from CTMPITLSS (Cramming Too Many Plants In Too Little Space Syndrome). I love your plant choices I have been for the last year or two attempting in vain to leave behind my compulsion for color in the garden and focus on texture and form. You would think that once you became aware of a gardening short fall it would be easy to change. Last year I started out with great intentions and even bought for the first time a few Hostas but to be honest the moment my plants began to bloom it was the flower that guided the design. Yes I know it’s ridiculous the flower is often only present in the garden a few weeks when it is the leaf that carries the garden through out the entire growing season. The late flowering perennials that you have chosen are really allow the leaf to be the primary in your garden design as they tend to look their best all through the growing season and long after many June bloomers have begun to peter out. So this year attempting yet again, I redesigned a back perennial bed with unfamiliar plants based solely on their leaf. I figure if worst comes to clashing worst I can always cut the flowers and bring them indoors. In many ways I feel like I did the first year I ever planted a garden, (Malva ‘Zebrina’ and alpine strawberries I was so proud!) knowing I am in way over my head but filled with the exuberance of new possibilities. kt
Oh did I mention I have decided not to work on my other compulsion of cramming too many plants in too little space this year ….what fun would that be?
He he, CTMPITLSS, ROFL! My husband (Juan, j/k) is now in the process of widening all the beds for me. Actually, believe it or not, there is room for everything, except for all that I haven't moved there yet *grin* (the KF grass and BES). I figure if I give my brother 5 or 6 asters and only get 1 or 2, I should be ok? There is actually room for flowers in front of the big maiden grass, I only have one pansy I stuck in there late last year that decided to hang out, LOL. I have 3 Purple Palace heucheras that might look kewl next to the goldenrod, with maybe a Moonbeam coreopsis or two. I'm going with "prairie" plants, as I interpret them LOL. This bed goes along the back fence and will wrap around the side of the garage. The whole concept for a late summer garden was inspired by the pop-up pool we have tucked in this part of the yard, and the fact that most of these plants do fine without extra water, which is a pain in the rear end to drag the hose around the pool from clear across the driveway. So after everything finds a more or less permanent home, I won't have to water!
Here is a great picture of an annual rudbeckia. It's more dramatic than the gloriosa daisy. This one is Hot Chocolate, and has a beautiful chocolate face. I love it! I'm trying to decide if I have room.
Never mind. This morning it was in stock at Burpee, but when I went to snag this picture, it was all sold out.
Wow I really like that one, too! .....PG I can't wait to see what you are doing, it is going to be lovely, I love your choice of plants.
