Single Rows or Wide Rows

I am helping the local Charter School put in a garden, and I had a design for them. At first they planned to go with the design, but today told me they think single, straight rows will work better since this is their first year. I am a fan of wide rows and raised beds when possible, so I would like to give them information without pushing them into something they aren't comfortable doing.

If you have used both single rows and wide rows, which do you prefer and why? What about raised beds? If you could also tell about your gardening experience (how long, etc.) and if you have education in horticulture, etc., that will be helpful.

I'm attaching a copy of the design. The overall size is approximately 35'wx55'l with 4' wide rows (to accommodate large groups), so the working size of the garden isn't really that big.

I appreciate all comments and any concerns you may have with the garden design.

Edited to say...

I was finally able to post the garden plan: http://davesgarden.com/forums/p.php?pid=3405687

This message was edited Apr 18, 2007 3:43 PM

I prefer to plant in 3' squares and plant companion plants together within the 3' squares. Although this is on the intensive side in terms of nutrient usage, I till in horse poop in the spring. My garden is maybe 17' x 20' or so.

I find I can grow a lot more in less space, as plants with shallow roots like lettuce won't compete for the same nutrience as carrots with deeper roots. I also try and grow plants which will benefit others around, such as marigolds and peppers.

I am able to reach all parts of the square as it is small enough for me to reach.

As it is just me playing in the dirt, oops, I mean gardening, I have 2' rows, which I probably should be 3', but haven't quite conviced myself to do so.

I have a garden of 14 beds, each raised and 20' x 3'. I like not worrying about drainage, and I like that no one steps where the plants grow, and that the soil's loose and weeds are easy to pull (NOT the case in compacted soil). I plan to close in all the beds by the end of this summer with boards, so that I can use the sides of each bed a little better. I like staggering my plants in the wide bed so they keep the soil shady and weed-free, and the space to companion-plant. I even like not tilling!

Well said, Iagardenwolf and Zeppy. I agree with your points. Most especially I prefer the three foot widths for greater ease in reaching the center of the bed. Wide beds and companion planting provide for larger crops (fewer pathways than between rows) and reduce the impact of insects. Some crops such as corn are more likely to pollinate well if planted in blocks rather than rows. Yuska

Here's the garden plan; I hope you all can see it:

Looks well thought out, but I can see that it might intimidate beginners. Are they planning to save seeds of the heirlooms? If so, I would stagger the plantings of tomatoes with other crops between them to lessen the chances of crossing.

Jaz, interesting problem, but not really a problem. A bit tough to disect your plan, though. Either way, your way, or their preference, will not significantly be detrimental. it really boils down to choice -- intensive (your choice to get the most out of the least area), or 'planting simplicity', (what they want w/ease of gradening effort).
The determining factor might be just how much gardening area you have to deal with. If you've got a small back yard, intensive may be best. If you've got a football field to play with, single rows, widely spaced might be best.
I'm not a teacher, but if I was, I'd probably lean toward the ideas of the students. if they are right, you can take a bit of credit for granting them their ideas. If they are wrong, they will learn from their own mistakes, without you ever having to open your mouth to say "I told you so"
The way I see it, it is a win/win circumstance for the teacher. Best of luck, and I hope all of you will be pleased with the garden.

This looks like a great plan for an older or more experienced group of students. Maybe overwhelming for a newbee teacher with younger students. I know when I "helped" with a school garden, the teacher only wanted a few varieties and easy stuff. They ended up very impressed with their summer squash and green beans. School was out before the tomatoes were ripe. But the kids were 2nd and 3rd grade. Are they on a year round schedule or summer school? Maybe your design but less variety the first year. Start with "bones" and fill in. We have a neighbor who grows hydroponic tomatoes for a living. He learned in a greenhouse project at one of the high schools. The work you are doing is vital. Take a look at the sheets offered by http://environmentalcommons.org/LocalFood/index.html They are a great set of facts about local food and sustainability.

I suggested if they decide to use the plan to plant only as much as they feel comfortable and add more next year. If they decide not to use the plan, I'm still for wide, raised rows. The choice is certainly theirs, but they have asked me for info as to why wide, raised rows are better and I want to give them information based on the experience of others - not just book info.

So, if you have used wide and/or raised rows, please let me know whether or not you liked them and why.

I realize the plan is a bit tough to follow without explanation (totally amateur here); if anyone wants to know anything about it, let me know.

Thanks!

I used wide raised beds for many reasons that probably don't apply to this school project. For one, I don't have much full sun as my house is surrounded by trees. My garden area is on my sloped back yard. I was able to build raised beds out of lumber and fill them with soil. This gives me a terraced effect and is much easier on my back than what I did before that, which was skinny single rows. But here are some other reasons you can possibly share.

The plants grow better in wide rows than in narrow ones. The deeper and wider the growing space, the better the plants do.

The soil has better drainage in a deep bed that is not compacted.

You get more growing space and less walking space. To me this is a plus. Walking on the soil, compacts it. While it still has the same nutrients and moisture, roots have less space to grow and you don't get as abundant root growth.

My beds are three feet wide and some are 12 feet long and some are 16 feet long. I too, have only 2 feet between beds, which is probably way too small for a class, but it suits me.

Jas, I went back to your original post more than once. Tell me, what is a 'charter school'? Is it privileged, underprivileged, inner city? Probably doesn't make much difference at all. Seems like your kids have a mind of their own.
As for single rows vs wide rows, that does not compute. As for single straight rows vs raised beds, NOW THAT"S A WHOLE DIFFERENT ANIMAL.
With raised beds there is the additional cost/effort to enclose your crop within a specific closed area. But that effort is more than justified by the ability to concentrate good dirt,
compost material, pinpoint fertilizing, and creating a barrier to weeds. And one of those unsung advantages of raised beds, (most likely lost on young minds) is that tending and harvesting is less strenuous on the back. Not only that. But the following year's raised beds will require less compost, less fertilizing, and probably little, if any, weeding.
On top of all that, you have the brawn of these young people to create impressive raised beds almost overnight. For us oldtimers, creating a new raised bed is not all that easy.
Your original question asked for experts and/or experience. I just looked around the room and there ain't no experts here. What I found was that I've been growing veggies in raised beds for about 25 years. And I can look around DG and easily find another 400 years of similar experience out there. "Education in horticulture" is too often a classroom thing. "Experience in the dirt" is the heart of gardening.
If I were in your shoes, I would go for raised beds. That doesn't mean for one second that you have to box your beds in with sticks of lumber. What it does mean is that your planting beds should be well defined, that compost, and fertilizer should also be carefully defined to areas specific to the plants you want to grow. And that incursions of weeds or grasses be monitored and eliminated as necessary. But again, with healthy young people for your workforce, it should not be a problem. In fact, it would probably be an asset to create raised beds WITHOUT borders.
With borders, you eliminate all care. You simply squirt the hose on it every other day. Beyond that you just simply sit back and watch it grow. Without borders you force your kids to get out there and do a bit of work to ensure the beds are clean of weeds and growing the way they want them to.
Your blueprint was not easy to read, but it appears that probably 60-70% of your garden idea is devoted to veggies. And the rest to flowering whatevers. I do like that idea. Flowers bring the bugs, and bugs pollinate the veggie flowers. Your blueprint seems like a rather tight-knit plan.
In fact, it seems almost too tight-knit. Gardening plans are much like war plans. It all looks good on paper, but when it all starts, all the plans go out the window, because the reality seldom resembles the plans. Give it a go, but be prepared to make adjustments. I hope your kids enjoy it all. And I hope you do too.

Thanks to those of you that have answered so far.

For lack of my having a more knowledgeable explanation...a Charter School falls between home-schooling and public school. This Charter School is in a small rural community. To explain my comment

"they" are the teachers - NOT the students as I made it sound.

I was afraid the plan would be hard to follow without me pointing and explaining...like I said "total amateur here". The numbers circled represent the plants which are labeled along the outer edges of the page. Of course, the plan is just for a general direction, and I am one of the last people on earth who follows direction. I just wanted to show them it's possible to combine veggies and flowers in an attractive way that people will enjoy "visiting" (or in this case "weeding"!)

The garden will be planted and attended by students and their families with the help of the school staff and four, or more, Master Gardeners. During the summer, the families will sign-up for a week to care for the garden, and during that week they will water and weed. The school has a small attendance, so help may be recruited from interested people in the community. When things are ready for harvesting the produce will be split among the families caring for the garden.

I didn't want to sway anyones opinion with the questions, so I didn't explain my position on wide/raised rows, but I will now.

I prefer wide rows because:
1. Less weeds.
2. You can weed or harvest more plants without “moving down the line”.
3. Plants that don’t need or tolerate as much sun can be companion planted with taller plants for some protection.
4. You can have one 3’ wide row with a 4’ wide path on each side (better for groups) instead of 2 or 3 single rows with 2’ wide paths.

I prefer raised beds because:
1. Less back strain.
2. More accessible to people with physical limitations.
3. More visible – less plants being trampled.
4. Better soil.

I’m sure there are other things, but I can’t think of them right now.

Jody, I use the wide row method for my vegetable garden and berry garden. With the wide rows you have less insect damage, less plant loss and it also requires less watering. Single rows dry out fast in hot or windy areas. I have 2 cats that patrol my gardens for rodents, and they also like the wide rows to hide in. I have row paths every 6 feet on my 3 feet wide rows. I have not gone with raised beds as my gardens are on a gradual slope. Jo Ann

Our house came with a raised bed veggie garden and I love it!. It has 12 beds that are 4'X8' with pea gravel paths between. I can siton the ground and harvest or weed one bed at a time. 4 feet is not so wide that I can't access whatever I want to fronm the side. It's small enough that if I want to put a cover over it I can. Weeding is easy..watering is easy. The plants are happy. I don't step in my beds (can't speak for the dog) I gave my daughter one of the raised beds ot plant whatever she likes (she's ten) and she was able to plant and maintain it without any problems. I am a total raised bed convert and I don't think I would go any less wide

Jas, smells like the advice dictates raised beds. It will be fun, no matter which way you go. Gardening is not just an annual effort. It is a lifelong passion. And if you can pass on that passion to the kids, you have done your job admirably.

Just an option to look at http://www.squarefootgardening.com for raised beds.
I am looking at trying this for a mix of flowers and veggies this year on a 2'x2' site.
Raised beds are easier to keep tidy and not stepped on.

Don't forget to ensure you have worms! Should be there if the soil is dark and crumbly, if not beg, borrow or buy some as they increase soil quality & oxygenation enormously. Also mulching is essential to prevent moisture loss, decrease weeds etc., just make sure mulch isn't in contact with stems of plants. Good luck, fantastic idea. Are they up for composting next year? Any room for critters of the small variety? We have a school community garden in our area with chickens, fruit, veg., flowers. Kids love it - we are inner city Sydney.

I've been mulling this over, and I'm wondering how many kids they're anticipating having out in the garden working at the same time. If you've got 30 kids all trying to weed the tomato bed or pick lettuce, the raised beds could get a bit crowded, and it might be better to think about spreading the plants out along a longer axis... maybe you could compromise with 24 to 30 inch wide rows -- half the width of a regular 4-5 foot wide raised bed, but giving you some of the advantages that skinny single rows just don't have.

Maybe you've got a great "teaching experience" going here, jasmerr. Any chance you could get these young folk out to see some "natural areas" to observe just how many "sraight rows" Mother Nature uses? Why is that?

cherylross~ funny you should mention worms! I did a little worm presentation for them yesterday! ☺ You all should check out this virtual worm tour I found online: http://www.naturewatch.ca/english/wormwatch/virtual_worm/index.html#

Critter~ The school only has 55 kids, and they will be working in classroom groups, so there won't be that many in the garden at once.

StonoRiver~

I love it!

OK, in that case I think your plan with the wide beds would work out well... and if they end up planting in rows this year, by next year they will want to fit more plants into the space, and maybe then they will listen! I imagine it's frustrating, after all the effort you put into a garden design that's attractive and efficient, to have them contemplating a different approach that you know won't work as well.

I wonder if a less detailed plan would help them envision the garden better? It could be that your planting diagram looks overly complicated to them (with the staggered spacing of the tomatoes, for example, it may not be obvious that they're still planted in easy rows within the bed). Rather than labeling all the varieties, try presenting a simple plan with labels like "tomato patch" and "salad bed." Maybe that would help you "sell" your design to to them.

I'm not so much frustrated as "but wide rows are sooooo much better!" They didn't ask me to do the plan; I just did it. I spent several hours on it, but it was fun, so I really don't care about that...it will get used somewhere eventually. I was able to sit down with them a take a couple of minutes to carefully explain the plan, so they are comfortable with it and like the idea that it is functional and "pretty." I do think your idea of "tomato patch" and "salad bed" would have been the way to go. I used specific plants in the plan because they said they needed guidance in what to plant and I offered to supply anything from my winter sowing that survived, so I wanted them to know what I will have in plants, but "tomato patch" and "salad bed" would definitely look less complicated.

My meeting is in half an hour - thanks, everyone for sharing. I'll let you know what they decide.

I prefer the raised beds, I use mostly 4 x 4 boxes. I have 1 x 8 for my trellised plant and 3 x 10 boxes for my asparagrus.

The single row planting follows the farm model that is designed for farm equipment. Gardening is different than farming. Your 'equipment' should only be a fork and rake, and a hand shovel. There is no reason to use a rototiller to garden, maybe once to start. Permanent beds means you fertilize and water only the plant not the paths. Plus walking on a plant's root zone is not good for them, compacts the soil. I use bark for my paths and that is why I like the boxes, it keeps the pathways' mulch separate from the enriched soil. These are hard core conservation principle that should not be ignored.

I don't mean to preach to the choir, I am sure you understand all this, but these are the reasons I would use to explain to your teachers, it not a matter of 'style' it is a matter of the correct model for gardening.

Good luck

Meeting went well, but much longer than I expected - 4 hours! They have decided to enlarge the garden and go with raised/wide rows.

Good job! Raised beds -- and more space! I think they're going to be thrilled with their new garden.

Wow--it sounds like you've put a lot of genuine effort into assisting them with their garden venture. Hats off to you!
I see the decision has already been made. But to further the idea of raised beds and/or wide rows....I have gardened in raised beds for over 10 yrs--and LOVE it.

I think veggies that need to sprawl can do better outside of a raised bed but in WIDE rows....like cukes and squash.
Potatoes--can be grown in bins that are filled over the growing season with more soil and or straw. It may be a great experiment in a future year for the students to grow some potatoes the 'regular' way and some in bins and compare the yields.

It may work for the school to try a couple raised beds and add more each year. They may be able to access the materials needed through donations from parents or businesses. Our beds use old bricks with a wood frame (salvaged, untreated wood) set upon them--anchored w/ wooden stakes.

They are much easier to weed--use less water and provide more veggies for the space...which means in the end better use of the soil. Additionally, we hand dig our beds--which is manageable--the soil is loosened and any extra nutrient/compast are dug in at the same time--this is a quiet and simple task and does not create any noise or gas involved in a tool that uses a combustible engine. All of this would fit within the ideas of demonstrating CONSERVATION of our resources. And ultimately, I do think they 'look' prettier, which makes time in the garden that much more enjoyable.

One of the veggies I'd first plant in a raised bed is carrots...I plant the rows 3in apart..as they gow they quickly shade out most of the weeds. It's amazing how many carrots you can grow in this way.
A school garden is a wonderful effort with lots of opportunity for 'growth', learning and expansion over the years. Good Luck!

Lots of good things connected to the garden for learning, but I have to get going. I fill you in next week.

Just a teaser...

The art teacher is also involved (excellent teacher!), so there is going be quite a theme worked in to the design. I'm so excited!!!

Isn't it fun when everybody plays? Can't wait to see pictures!

Congratulations, loved the worm hyperlink
Cheryl