Summer shade, winter sun

Okay folks..... put your thinking hats on. I want to find a shade tree that will mature at about 40 feet that has a wide spread and fine leaves...... most likely compound leaves like a locust. The tree will be planted on the south west corner of our house to shade us during the summer. A tree that doesn't have dense branching is needed so that we get solar gain during the winter to warm the house. Nice flowers would be a great addition.

I have thought of using yellowwood, kentucky coffeetree, amur cork tree (male cultivar) or possibly a heartnut-butternut hybrid. Which should I pick? Who am I forgetting about? Please remember that I'm in a warming zone 4.

hmmm- i don't think you want the butternut tree- i'll have to get a picture sometime of the one around the corner here- it swallows up a whole yard and house..amazingly huge- not to metion the nuts that fall on your head- but it is an impressive tree. maybe you need an elm- there's a farm here in keene that grows special disease resistant elms- vase shaped, leaves high up, etc.

here's a link to "Liberty Elm" site! http://www.libertyelm.com/ale2.htm

Thank you sjms. You're most likely right about the butternut x heartnut but I love their tropical like leaves and open horizontal branching. Elms....... I think that elms would get too big for this spot. I actually planted 100 Liberty Elms here in my town to celebrate our 200 birthday back in the 80's.

David

At my other place where I lived for 50 years, there were 2 American elms, planted before I moved there. They were still growing strong, but were subject to aphids, causing a black residue on whatever was growing below. I don't know if the new disease resistant types are also resistant to aphids. Other than that problem I loved the elms. Here at this location I planted a Fraxinus augustifolia Raywood, 12 years ago, It is probably 35 to 40 feet tall now, does create a lot of fairly heavy shade, for my deck.

If you want reasonably fast shade I don't think Yellowood will do that, mine planted at the southwest corner of my house also 12 years ago, is less than 12 feet tall now. You might consider Kentucky Coffee Tree, Gymnogladus dioicus. Mine is only 4 years old now, is about 9 or 10 feet tall., it is described as a tall open tree.

Donna

David,

Sophora (Styphnolobium) japonica probably isn't going to be quite hardy enough unless you're in a protected area. Maackia amurensis isn't going to be quite tall enough unless you can compromise on the size. Ailanthus is, well........ you know. A native purist would probably seek out Robinia pseudoacacia 'Chicago Blues' and it's fantastically fragrant flowers that the (now dying) bees make a great honey from. To be honest, I'm nervous about having Robinia within 200 yards of my house. Koelrueteria is out on hardiness issues. Phellodendron would work but lacks interesting flowers. Pterocarya isn't hardy enough. Larix species are going to be too narrow, the short term especially unless Resin enlighten us on some wider growing ones. I guess I'd conclude that it's hard to live in Zone 4. Coffeetrees are great trees, even if they don't have flowers. Give it a shot. Yellowwood are nice but perhaps on the wide-growing side. I planted one in my parents yard and it's been growing 18"-30" year. Make sure that you get good branch angles on them. Otherwise, I'd be tempted to try pushing a Sophora.

Regards,
Ernie

Larix gmelinii is fairly broad, as larches go

I'd go for that Butternut hybrid, though - magnificent foliage

Resin

I'd go with either the Phellodendron or the Maackia. I've got P. 'HIs Majesty', which is a male clone developed at the U of Minn. arboretum. I love the branching of this tree and the foliage stays pretty much perfect all season. Last summers drought had no apparent impact on it, and it grows 1'-2'/year. The Maackia grows a bit taller than what is normally reported. There are a few at Longenecker Gardens in Madison that are in the 35' range and quite beautiful. Mine is about 15' and averaging 12"-18"/year. One advantage of this tree is that it flowers later than most trees, usually in mid-late July where I'm at.

Would any Sorbus work?

I like the coffeetree idea. It tends to grow taller than wider, and for shade it's nice because it leafs out late and drops a little early, which means you get the benefit of sun on those cooler spring and fall days.

Scott

KCT will get far larger than 40' though, eventually. But, it does have HUGE leaves that leave very few branches once they drop--perfect summer shade/winter sun plant. I used one on the west side of my old house for that exact purpose. Catalpa would do the same. How about Kalopanax septemlobus--huge leaves, deerproof trunk, and probably good for the 40' level in Zone 4?

Sorbus alnifolia?

My friend, in what used to be Zone4, and is now listed as Zone 5, has a 30 year old S. alnifolia. It has seen some bitter winters. Nice tree, but now that I think of it, densely branched. I wonder if that is a species trait. It was absolutely loaded with large fruit though.