He everyone
I have never done bonsai before but am strangely attracted to it. What I'd like to know is if there is any type of plant which will NOT successfully bonsai. For instance...grasses.....aloes.......cacti ?????????? And if not WHY not?
Sorry if this seems like a silly question but - there's no point in wasting time trying things any bonsai expert would tell you not to bother with.
Thanks
Lizzy
What can't you bonsai??????????
Liz,
You can bonsai anything, here is one from Japan.
This message was edited Jul 8, 2006 5:29 AM
yes, anything
I just found out that if you don't send a message with your photo the cyber ghosts eat the photo, go figure!
and of course even the traditional style can use the less common plants, like, say, bamboo
Thanks Dale...I don't know if I like the weedy grassy ones and wonder if the bonsai-ing of them does miniaturize them compared to their natural growth. The fern is cute but not what I would think of as bonsai - as in miniature compacted growth...What do you think of them?
I think they all have their own 'charm'. They are in the Emperor of Japans collection. They are minature slices of the natural world to my eyes. The white asters are only about 1/10 the height they would be in the ground (guessing since there is no scale). The fern is a ostrich? they get up to 4 feet.
They are not stunning like the trees can be after 200 years. They are almost like islands of nature, a snapshot.
this photo is just wallpaper..
Do you have any comments about this bonsai - one of Bonsai Star Gallery ([HYPERLINK@www.bonsaistar.com]) collections?
Species : Juniperes Chinensis
Style : Slenting
Height : 32 cm
It is beautiful.
Back to B1ZZYL1ZZYS original question. With that in mind. Is a bonsai a small version of a full sized plant, with small parts? This is a ignorant question for sure. Does the small tree have small leaves, small flowers, and small fruit? Does the genetic makeup of the plant still produce full sized parts? My imagination is running away. I see small monkies climing small bannana trees eating small bannanas. lol Then there are the small Elvises eating small fried peanutbutter and bannana sandwitches. They could all live together in a small Graceland, with small cars bringing small tourists to visit.(wish I could go) Well, you see where I'm going. Can anyone save me from this small imagination. Thanks in advance.
David
LOL! You know that little bottle with the label saying "Drink Me" Go ahead...then you can go see for yourself;)
Don't stop Dave, its very entertaining.
Lizzy
Dave...............LOL. Glad I'm not the only one with a wild imagination.....I've considered placing a matchbox car tire swing on my tiny tree but am afraid once that is done I'll go crazy with "minis".
There is a reason I asked about mini bannana trees. My neighbor has (Ice Cream?) Bannanas growing in pots on his patio. Every once in a while he mentions that he needs to plant them in the ground. When his wife is there when he does this she askes if they are left in the pots, will they grow small bannanas. She never has mentioned Bonsai exactly, But I think thats what she is thinking. Every time she says it, we just get quiet. (thinking kookoo kookoo) lol... Now I'm starting to think that might not be so kookoo after all. Seriously, is it possible?
Hi,
To get back to your original question: no, you can't "bonsai" anything. The word "Bonsai" means literally "Tree in a Tray". The goal with bonsai is to create the illusion of a wild, growing tree. The pot and tree can be ANY size! SO I guess you could make a 100 ft White pine into a bonsai IF you could get it into a container. Since that's not practical, the Japanese have hybridized some pines to have very small needles. The idea is PROPORTION. A 2-year -old white pine has needles as as large as an adult pine, therefore, white pines are poor choices for good, proportional bonsai. Think plants with teeny leaves or needles, and a big, fat trunk. For indoor bonsai, I collect succulents with barky, swollen caudexes. What I do for my "outdoor" bonsai is visit garden centers and look for nursery stock!!! I just bought an azalea with tiny leaves, and it is already growing cascade-style, so I trimmed it just a little bit. Tah-dah! It looks 100 years old! Even better in fall when nursery stock gets marked down! Best, Melissa
P. S. There are growers that specialize in miniature plants to grow along with your tree. My favorite are the mini hostas. And, people do put figurines in there with the tree, so you could put in that matchbox car. Also BTW, Bonsais DO put forth full-size fruit and flowers.
Melissa
Thanks for your reply. Please pardon my ignorance. I think I'll try it from seed or seeding, whatever I can find. My dad has a nice willow in his back yard. Each spring they sprout all over the yard. Maybe there is one that he hasn't pulled out yet. I like the way the bark cracks and flakes off. There are also Golden Rain trees in the parking strip. I'll look for seeds there too. Thanks again.
David
Dave, no need to pardon yourself for something you don't know! I still think thunder is caused by God bowling.
People do go crazy with miniatures, there are worse things to spend your time and money on. The model railroad people want miniature everything, and they buy miniature plants and bonsai for their set-ups.
I really like the Elvis idea, but only if you have mini UFOs and aliens, too, plus fat, middle-aged housewives passing out.
;-)
Melissa
The accent plants appear to be coming into their 'own' now. Twenty five or so years ago I didn't see them at shows, now they are everywhere. I have a wish list about half a mile long just for accent plants.
Beth
This is Callindra, normally has 1" leaves, but, in this container at this time its leaves only grow to be about 1/4" and the flowers are smaller than an in ground plant. Some plants in containers respond by growing small 'parts' because nutrients are in short supply.
I stand corrected! I should revise my statment that none of MY bonsai have miniture fruit or blooms!!
I LOVE that Calliandra! It is magnificent. Did you grow that?
It is a garden down in West Palm Beach area, built/deciated to a Japanese fisherman who was very successful in life.
It is a garden down in West Palm Beach area, built/deciated to a Japanese fisherman who was very successful in life.
Here is a place called Viscaya, in and owned by the City of Miami, have no idea who or what these people did to achieve success, they built themselves a nice winter home on Biscayne Bay
I'm from Fishtown, USA- Gloucester, MA- and I haven't heard of too many rich fishermen! LOL Unless they were meeting up with company in Itern'l waters... maybe he wasn't just hauling in fish...?
Jax4, thats funny..........probably not hauling in fish. I'm sending a pic of a plant called Carissa (sp)? An awkward growing plant when left in ground, the branches growing every which-a-way. Sooooooo, I decided to bonsai it. It has been in this tuffa pot for about 4 yrs now and has formed into a tiny tree shape although it requires constant pruning. When in bloom, the flowers are tiny, white. The leaves are only about 1/4".
Adorable!
I have had such miserable luck with temperate Bonsai (I only have 2 now- or 6, depending on your definition) that I switched to succulent/caudiciforms. In their native lands, they are shrubs and trees, and they are very easy to grow, but I realize that the ancient Japanese Bonsai Masters are spinning in their graves!
My chip is out of space. I will delete something and post a few pics.
Kittens.
(Sorry.)
(There was a spoof site about doing that: some people took it seriously and it caused an uproar.)
I bonsai all sorts of stuff. And I buy all sorts of Bonsai. I have some that are worth a forune and some that have value only to me. The scary ones are the cold hardy ones because this year they're all in the bulkhead where it gets darn near as cold as the outside air...We'll see how they did in the spring. My temperate ones are fine... In fact I should post some of the better ones..like my bougainvilla that I rescued and repotted. It is magnificent!! And I have a Seju Elm that I won at our greenhosue raffle for the cost of 2 $2 raffle ticket. I've had it 10+ years and it GREAT! I also have little pots with miniature Hostas .. And , oh, by the way, I have been known to kill a few!!!
To "bug me", I want to bug you. I believe that the plant shown is a Serissa, not carissa. If it has a single white blossom (five petals) it is a 'white star'. If it has a double white bloom (like a tiny rose bloom) its a 'snow rose'.
To Dale, your analisys of why the leaves are smaller is close, but not complete.
All plants have and maintain a balance between root mass and folage mass. If you first confine the root system, and then through pruning, defoliating, and other tricks INCREASE the number of leaves over a few years, the leaves become smaller. I mention defoliation, because it produces the most dramatic reduction of leaf size. One thing to remember though, you cannot reduce the size of flowers or fruit with Bonsai techniques. They must be bred down in size as in a miniature, or a dwarf cultivar.
To iblloyd; not to "bug you" but I concur with bugme about the pictured identity of Carissa. It's a 'Boxwood Beauty" carissa. Or commonly called natal plum. I've one. The small 2" single trumpet, white blooms are fragrant and resembling that of a plumeria bloom, somewhat smaller, and perhap not as thick. And they yield lovely small fruits.
Respectfully
Kim
p.s. Thank you for bumping this wonderful classic thread back up. And thank you, for sharing your knowledge with fellow DGers.
Editted to add pf of Carissa's
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/65975/
This message was edited Jan 24, 2008 9:06 PM
i have a huge plant called an umbrella plant i think--indoor ---i need to trim it because it has branched out in such a crazy way that it is in the way of everything--it looks like it could make a pretty bonsai--if i start with a branch is there something special i should look for
planolinda, absolutely there is something you should look for. You need to select a style for the finished bonsai. There are books about how to prune and wire for the differing styles. I recommend (if you don't want to wait to read a book), that you should post a picture of at least 3 sides to the bonsai forum and ask for advice. You should probably just select the most obvious branches to cut right now, and then set the plant aside and let the final design present itself. Start a new thread.
If there is a bonsai grower near you, they all offer pruning classes. I 've taken 3- what fun!!!
Also, google "bonsai umbrella plant"- you may find some finished plants like yours for inspiration!
great advice--thanks
Lily, iblloyd is correct........mine is a serissa with the tiny, white, five-petaled blooms and a real charming tree when in bloom. It has been a real joy to train into a tree from a gangly looking plant, although it takes constant pruning since the natural form of the plant is really awkward if left to grow on it's own. I'll show it in bloom and then a pic to show the tree form.
Sharon
Here it is showing the trunk.......
Appology to lblloyd. Thank you, Sharon for the confirmation and clarification.
A closer look to your tree, the compact compound leave pattern does differ from Natal plum's. Though, the gangly looking trunk is very similiar.
Kim
Here is my novice attempt at the Natal plum into a "bonsai" pot. A long way to go there.....
http://davesgarden.com/community/forums/fp.php?pid=4282221
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/showimage/57874/
Editted to add; Carissa under bonsai training, DG is great, you can look up about any subject, be it plants or bonsai. :-)
This message was edited Jan 26, 2008 1:00 PM
Oooops there I went. Serissa, instead of Carissa!!! Sory folks.
Kim
No, I'm not going to say "_ ____ ___ __"! Seriously, its tough trying to I.D. plants in person, much less when you only have a photograph that doesn't have any scale reference.
Serissa foetida has 3 (that I know of) cultivars: "white Star" which is what Bugme has, "Snow Rose" which is white but has double-blossoms (like a rose bloom), and "Pink Star" having star shaped pink blooms.
All very pretty.
Part of the pruning problem is due to opposing leaves. You cut just outside a pair and the dormant buds at the base of the pettioles both produce new growing tips and eventually you have a series of opposing branches (that, as near as I can tell is what's wrong with the main trunk. In a good Bonsai, the first branch should go to the left or right, the second should go to the opposite direction. This alernating branching should be carried over into the secondary branching forming a scaffolding structure that supports the tertiary branching and foliage.
Wish I could draw on this posting...
The good news is that cuttings root quite readily, and with some practice you can create some very stunning shohin bonsai.
Lloyd, thanks, you reminded me of my Karate Instructor. I ducked when she wanted me to stand while she demonstrated a kick. Needless to say the consiquence of my action.... No she didn't make me doing any push up, but abdominal crunch excercise was to follow our practice that day......
I'll sit quiet, and learn like a good student.
Kim
bseddon,
Seju Elms are great! i got lucky enough to get my hands on 4 of them from a collector that was generous enough to let me me acquire them from him. They range from Mame (3" tall) to about 30" tall with a 3" D trunk I have to re pot all of them to a more porous soil mix due to the different micro climate I'm in even though it is only 25 miles from their former home. They are in silhouette right now and I can't wait to trim them come end of February/early March.