A few photos of my 'Hillside Creeper'

I think these are really awesome plants. I like the way they spread out. Forgive the photos, they aren't the best but the plants really are. I bought them at Rich's Foxwillow Pines Nursery this past weekend. I'm in heaven!

Here's another 'Hillside Creeper'-

Here's a close up-

Neat plant. What is that Eastern White Pine?
Does it spread out rather than grow upward?

Will

Hey Equil,

I've been growing that one and "Albyns" or "Albyns Prostrate" for maybe five years now. Both are doing nicely. I knew of a very old one at a nursery I worked at many years ago, very wide-spreading but it was in the shade and foliage only really grew at the branch tips. That, and weeds perpetually growing up through the center really diminished its value.

Will, both are Pinus sylvestrus.

Scott

Yup, some sort of a P. sylvestris sport at one point in time. Then it was grafted onto P. strobus I think they said. Scott, do you have a photo of your 'Albyns Prostrate'? I'd love to see it.

Not just yet, but I'll take a picture tomorrow and post it. To be honest with you, I've forgotten which plant is Hillside Creeper and which is Albyn's Prostate (sic)...love that bad joke. Maybe we can sort them out once I have the photos posted.

Scott

Here are some more close ups of my 'Hillside Creeper' plants-

And another-

Pine Wilt Nematode Heaven . . .

Guy S.

Oh Guy, you killjoy.

Spoilsport!

By the way, anyone know if grafting them on P. strobus makes a difference in their susceptibility to nematodes?

Guy the killjoy!

Where is Resin. He'd know.

I doubt if a graft to a native species of Pine will help provide "immunity". The DNA is going to be sylvestris all the way up. There's no getting around that. Now if there was some sort of a root rot disease out there that native species of Pine were resistant to I would buy that the 'Hillside Creeper' would be less susceptible.

I have not been to Rich's Foxwillow Pines and am dying to take a drive out there soon. Does he have a good selection of smaller specimens at prices a little less than what his website shows. The catalog lists mainly larger specimens for prices that at this time I cannot justify. Had a baby not to long ago so you can imagine where my funds are going. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

The prices they have are very good for the quality of product they offer and you won't find it anywhere else locally. He doesn't have a good selection of smaller specimens... he has the best selection I've ever seen. The prices appeared to range from about $45 to $135 for those and the lower end of the price range would have been the few deciduous species he carried in what they referred to as a 1 gallon pot. I know what kids cost what with day care, routine well baby care, diapers, and formula. In good conscience, I couldn't tell you to drive there unless you wanted a nice drive in the country to visit a nursery that has some phenomenal specimens. I've never quite seen anything like it before in my life. If you are ok with "window shopping", I would encourage you to go. Me, I'm no good at window shopping unless it's Michigan Ave at Christmas time for kids to see the animations. Needless to say, I didn't go shopping at all when the kids were little. I know I have no self control so why risk tempting myself.

About all I can offer you is possibly cuttings from my plants in a few years and I bet Dax would try to graft them for you as he seems like a kind soul. They'd be little but all plants have to start somewhere. Are there any straight species of natives you like? I have a property up north and it has quite a few Pines on it as well as Tamarack. If those two interest you, I could dig a few small ones up for you and drive them home. Based on Foxwillow's pricing, the size I could fit in our vehicle would be about a $150 plant and I could easily fit two in. Of course you'd have to drive up to my house here in northern Illinois to pick them up and I would like to see that new baby if at all possible.

Lauren

Pinus strobus and Pinus sylvestris aren't compatible.

I've grafted up at Rich's Foxwillow Pines and he uses sylvestris for his understock.

It's a real nice plant. I have one and it turns a beautiful golden cast during winter.

strobus and other 5-needled pines are compatible among one another.

sylvestris and other 3-needled Pines are compatible.

And if Resin was here he's tell me to take my "needle theory" and throw it out the door! But, in all honesty this is a very easy way to know what's graftable to what. Then you think of vigor, etc. as other factors that should be thought of when attaching scions to rootstocks, very generally said however without going into the whole 'issue'.....

Dax

They have an area with probably one year grafts for cheaper than what is listed in their catalog. I think they probably have a lot of smaller sizes than what is listed but I would call first. They are very friendly and Rich went ga-ga over our baby when we went.

Rich, unlike Guy the killjoy or curmudgeon, likes human babies. :)

I'd be happy to graft you one next winter senna_fan and it won't be on that sylvestris understock either! Which is good!!!

I use Pinus resinosa as it's much better suited for our climate. Plus, my 'Hillside Creeper' is pretty big and I could graft you a big chunk!

I'll add your username to my 'Things to Do Grafting/Plant List for winter of 2007' right now.

And don't worry Equil, your sylvestris understock will out live me and I'm only 32!

See ya guys,

Dax

Thanks everyone for all the info.

Equil, The Tamarack sounds very interesting, but what I have read about them they like moist acidic soil. Not sure this is exactly what I would have to offer it. How adaptable is it to suburban conditions?

Dax, I might just take you up on that offer. Let me know what you ask for in return.

Glenn

Hi Glenn,

The Tamarack does like moist acidic soil. I would think it would be ok in neutral ph as long as it was moist. My Tamarack are currently growing in and around a quaking bog.

Glenn, seriously consider taking Dax up on the offer. He knows what he's doing. Most people only look for postage in return.

Equil,
I am going to have to have the soil tested. The area I am looking to plant in is actually a common area behind my house that I have been given permission from the neighborhood assosiation to plant trees in. I am trying to come up with a plan that does not include what you see everyday. We are a usual subdivision that when it was built the contractor planted a couple of species over and over again.

Imagine a common green area where a democratic neighborhood association can have some say in what is established for the years to come. I guess we used to call these parks and if we wanted that kind of legacy for future generations the only limiting factor is whether we are "actually" involved or not. But beyond this, the "park" two blocks down and around the corner"; would it not be great if we had some say in whether Joulz's great beech tree stayed in place or Mr T's stupid excercise in urban logging did not have to happen. Kudo's to Glenn for positive planning. Ken
Edit for spelling

This message was edited Apr 12, 2006 6:06 AM

Most soil and water conservation districts have some form of soil testing that is either free or at a reduced rate.

Equil, I stand corrected. 5-needled to 5 needled and 2-needled (resinosa) to other 2-needled.

The 'Uncle Fogy' was grafted to sylvestris as was the 'Hillside Creeper' as that's what they use.

senna_fan, I've already added you to my list. You don't need to do anything until then but wait and be surprised when I email you.

Thanks for the correction, Equil.

Dax

What did I correct you on?

Kandlmidd, I think I heard Mr. T is selling his place where he chopped down all those trees. I went to a seminar on tree protection and construction and they started off with a big image of Mr. T's face. I think the opening speaker was from Lake Forest (I think that is where Mr T's house is). I actually met Mr. T as a child at a Showbiz Pizza by my house. That was at the peak of his fame. His niece was having a birthday party there at the time.

Dax, you wouldn't think so, coming from different taxonomic sections, but I've seen hard pines grafted successfully onto P. strobus. Not recommended, but apparently it works occasionally, if you hold your tongue right and wait for a certain astrological sign! And it does have some cultural advantages.

Equil, white pine is preferred as a rootstock over red pine because of root morphology. White pine is very fibrous rooted compared with red pine and most other hard pines, and more adaptable to less severely drained soils. But if the understock is container grown and rootpruned, or field-grown 2-2 transplant stock, that's not as much of an issue. Nematodes move through the soil, thus I wonder if a graft on white pine roots perhaps might confer some resistance. I have no evidence, just posing the question. Regardless, it would be a good idea to confirm the ID of the understock. Always ask that when you buy any grafted plant.

Willis, I do like human babies . . . but hold the garlic, please.

Guy S.

I looked at my notes. I did ask, that guy named Tom over there told me it was outsourced to be grafted and that the 'Uncle Fogy' was grafted to P. strobus. He volunteered that they had some sort of a deal where they sent cuttings off to be grafted and that they were then sent back 50% of what was successful as their cut in the deal. I didn't ask about the 'Hillside Creeper' because I just assumed it was also grafted to P. strobus.

I feel compelled to add this, Mr. T is an incredibly nice family man. His landscaping practices are much to be desired but he is a sweetheart and he donates a disproportionate amount of his time and money to disadvantaged children in the inner city. His house is a few blocks away from my MIL. The property is still an eyesore.

I didn't write the FOOL! part, it just came with the photo. I have heard about his charity work, just thought it was funny to throw a Mr. T post on a tree forum. Meeting him when I was a kid was awesome. He was totally hamming it up with all the kids at the place and we had a great time. We were always wondering if the other A Team members were waiting in the Limo outside. I also think that him taking down his trees spurred on the very stringent tree ordinances in that community, ultimately saving more trees than he cut down.

His property leveling actions spurred a wave of ordinances across the nation.

First name Mister, last name Tee. He sure saved a lot of trees with that axe. I still wouldn't let him near your new trees from Rich's. Guy said he was looking for volunteers; maybe Mr T can plant some trees down at Starhill to replace the ones he cut down. He is good at advertising also.

EQ,

Here are some pix of my plants. This first shot is of what I think is Hillside Creeper.

Scott

The foliage.

Now, this is the one I think is "Albyn's Prostrate."

Scott

And foliage.

Scott

As you can see, both are very low plants. And I guess that would be my complaint about both of them. They are hard to make work in a border...you can see that even Phlox subulata competes with AP. They also tend to catch every leaf and litter that would normally blow on past. Maybe my enthusiasm will rekindle in a few weeks when they push new growth.

Scott

I like the 'Albyn's Prostrate'. Nice looking plant.