give this a look!

this is in an e-mail that I just recieved.....

I guess your friend invited alot od deer freinds over for breakfast..:)
Cute

guess so..thanks for looking..

They certainly are magnificent animals.

I know they are destructive but I would be throwing apples out there.

Boy, they must have been hungry. But is it healthy for the deer to encourage them to herd together in such numbers? They don't naturally crowd together like that, do they?

What a spectacle !!! It reminds of a previous experience that I had at a mountain farmhouse, in northern PA (north of Renovo), probably 30 or more years ago. People would visit this place late afternoon to observe the daily ritual. The gentleman living there would blow a whistle and within 30 minutes his yard was filled with whitetail deer that came out of the mountains from all directions. He walked among them putting down feed at various locations just like this scenario. At one point, he put a slice of bread in his mouth and a buck came to him and stood on his hind legs to take the bread from him. If a doe had young fawns with her she would leave them out in the field until she was finished eating. This event occurred all year round until the gentleman passed away.

Thanks for posting the photo ....

I grew up in a farming community where my father in law was a farmer. They sold their farm to many city people from detroit in Michigan and when he went out to see what they did with the farm he saw a purchaser putting out carrots and corn to attract the deer. The purchaser asked how much would they eat in a winter? My father in Law said about a semi-truck load a week. If you feed deer remember not to plant a garden.

He... Yes they do and decimate the entire foilage of the area changing the echosystem until a thinning of deer IE snow fall deep occurs. We had a herd of deer in michigan where I grew up that herded up every winter and a healthy forest of Cedars, Maples, etc became a field of swamp and cranberries bushes. It used to be a wilderness and now it is a development. man is not the only creature that is replicating too much on the planet. PS I like deer but....

and I thought we had a lot of corn feed deer in Northern Missouri!!!!!!!

cuckoo

the difference between Missouri and Michigan is that you have 130 bushel / acre and we have 65. You fields are only grazed on the perimeter ours are deep to the center.

YIKES!! This pic brings back nightmares to me. Up until about 2-3 years ago we regularly had a herd almost that big. We would see them almost every night bedding down in the pasture right behind our house. No we didn't supplemental feed them- we did nothing to encourage them and everything to get them to leave. This was during the warm months 'til it started getting cooler in the Fall.
Needless to say they regularly decimated our gardens and all our plants.

First of all.....I would like to say that I DO NOT condone this type of feeding......this was simply an e-mail that has been forwarded about a hundred times!! I simply thought it was neat to see them all together like that.......

As far as herds of deer being smaller.....they herd in larger groups in the coldest months here in michigan.....at least in my expirience......in the summer time, I have seen 50-60 (conservative estimate) In the soy bean fields behind my up north place....just grazing at the edge of the field.......so, I guess what I am saying is that it depends on the population and food/water sources in the area.....Thanks for looking in...

edited to say, I just checked the e-mail and it was in a place called eagle river.....most likely in either Iowa or Illinois...from my SIL's family......

This message was edited Mar 18, 2006 10:16 PM

Interesting. Few to no deer in NV (some "mule deer" in some areas) so although I've read about how destructive they can be I have no personal experience with this.

Apparently their recent "overpopulation" is mostly related to the loss of their predators, human caused so.....I don't really feel a great deal of sympathy here. Could re-introduce their predators but of course that might reduce the two-legged population which somehow I doubt would go over well. We get what we pay for, shrug.

I think Eagle River is in Wisconsin.......

I also thank you for the post and I still enjoy watching deer in the wild.

This message was edited Mar 18, 2006 9:48 PM

Love that you shared your email picture! Thanks!

Angele

I love the photo - thanks for sharing. By my observations and according to my reading, white tail deer "herd up" in the colder months after breeding. I've been seeing large groups along the edges of the woods here for the past month.

BTW, it's now illegal in New York State to feed white tail deer. There is a concern that by attracting them, you can create an opportunity for wasting disease to spread.

I had put out feed during the coldest, snowiest times (yes, I was new to the area!), but now that I don't, they just pull down all the bird feeders and eat that!

Julie

The issues raised here are intriguing and complex. We, too, have deer here in the Santa Cruz Mountains not far from a major metropolitan area. We do not feed them, nor do our neighbors. But they come every day to drink from our pond in the arid summertime. I frequently see them out the window where I am sitting now. The are not more than 15 feet away following a clearly discernable trail they have made up the chaparral-covered hill. By most people's reckoning, there are too many of them.

Their predators that once roamed these mountains are, for the most part, gone. Twice in the thirty plus years I have lived here I have had fleeting glimpses of the elusive mountain lion, although there is other evidence of its presence. In recent times some have strayed into urban areas only to be shot because of the threat they pose. Several writers have advanced the proposition that the lions follow their food--deer. As more green belts are being formed to surround urban areas, more deer move in. And they are followed by the lions. I consider myself privileged, to have seen them, but do not spread the word lest panic should ensue. (I also do not hike on the fire trail beyond my house in the early morning or twilight hours. Those hours I reserve for the lions.)

On occasional summer nights when the windows are flung wide open, I hear a pack of coyotes in the distance taking down a young deer. I often see coyotes out the window grubbing for insects in the duff beneath the chamise. I do not begrudge them their feast. We keep our cat indoors (she does not mind it and will live longer) where she does not have a chance to feed on birds or be food for coyotes.

My vegetable garden is enclosed in a fence. From time to time I forget to close the gate. Not always do the deer discover my mistake, but they have. Their pruning of my apricot tree up to the level of their reach did it no harm but they also had appetizers in the form of lettuce, chard, roses and peas. The plants that live outside the fence are fair game, but I protect the ones inside. Of course, their are gophers and rabbits, aphids and hornworms too. Hard to fence them out.

It is my wish to live in harmony with many of the creatures that surround me. The human "advances" we have made in health and human services have a ripple effect that is hard to assess. The issues and concerns that are addressed in this thread are worthy of contemplation.....and it is an amazing picture.

Well put poppy. I had an experience with a mountain lion 4 years ago when I was with friends on a cross country ski outing here in Montana. It was a full moon and everyone was sitting in the cabin playing cards and cooking with the heat of the wood stove. I decided to go down to the river for a quiet time and skiied down about a mile to the river in the thick forests of northern Montana. Well it was a beautiful trip down and when I got to the river I took off my skiis and sat staring out at the beauty of the moment. After a half hour I got up to put on my skiis and go back up the hill when to my surprise there were cougar tracks up to right behind where I was sitting. She had come down the hill behind me and came up to me to smell what kind of meat I was. The tracks dissapeared into the woods on the side of the trail I came down. Well needless to say I had the adrenaline trip of my life walking up the trail with my skins. When I rushed in to the group and told them what just happened they just laughed. They went out and saw that the cougar had been sitting in the woods just outside the cabin and stalked me all the way down. I have often been a predator but this time prey. What a rush!

Whoa, Soferdig! Lucky you, all the way around. That's why I leave the mountain to the lions when daylight wanes unless I am with someone. And lucky for both of us that we have such a window on the world. Wisdom has it that lions (and sharks) find us less than tasty if they have a choice, but I would just as soon not put it to the test.

Being a veterinarian I have seen a foal and an adult horse that were killed by a cougar. I wouldn't have enjoyed it. And I knew this going up the hill. Fortunatly I had a gas lantern and I feel that it saved me. There is little to eat up in the North fork flathead river but me. (never cry wolf)

I am very sorry that there is any issue with this picture, however it seems that with anything, There are folks who dont see eye to eye..I am a hunter myself and try and respect those who disagree...I think there is something to be said for the picture....I think what can be said is that it is an interesting and fascinating picture......I find it incredible just to see these magnificent animals up this close.....

Soferdig, maybe the cat could sense that you care for animals.....LOL..you got lucky..thanks for the story.

Early in my Vet career there was a client of mine who worked for the Humane society and had a mountain lion in a cage on her estate. The people who capsured the kitten tried to domesticate him. Well no need to say he was unable to go back to the wild so she fed him like a king. The trouble was he got a tooth root abcess. Well I elected to help him and had to get in the cage and lasoe him then run out and have her and a tech of mine hold the rope as I injected the anesthetic. He had gone down about 50# with the inability to eat. I extracted the tooth and he recovered for another 2 years of life. So maybe the word got out to leave alone. I'm down 5 lives so far so a few more left.

Soferdig....what an experience...(or rush as you call it)...I would not have survived it.

ceceoh, you have mail.

Gosh doggit ..
I'm jes hopin' that you'll see fit to post the pic (of such numbers), when it's time .. here > http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/581571/

It's counting UP to Spring - and I'll bet that MitchF won't mind nary a bit ...

Ya know .. controvercy, is a part of the human condition. (We) seem to be prone to make somewhat of an issue of half a glass of water!!

It’s all in ones perspective. (and, if the dog packed your slippers off again or chewed up your newspaper that ‘ticular morning) .. LOL ..

- Magpye

thanks for such great insight magpye. there are approximately 93 as far as I can tell....(I printed the pic and marked them off as I went along......LOL)

This message was edited Mar 20, 2006 10:46 AM

I like to look at controversy as healthy intellectual dialogue. It's only when one is willing to listen to an opposite view is their point of view really put to the test. I've learned a lot through life by objectively evaluating another person's point of view. And, as with most subjects, and particularly with the deer subject, there are many variables depending on where one lives. What's right in the suburbs is not necessarily right in the mountainous terrain where snow may get deeper than the deer's height. In years past, we've driven 200 miles to take bushels of corn to the deer so they may stand a chance to survive the sometime's cruel winters. Here we see a photo but none of us have the real facts. One can either watch things happen, makes things happen or ultimately wonder, what happened !!! Rightly or wrongly, whomever was doing the feeding was making things happen ....

Edited to change there to their !!!

This message was edited Mar 20, 2006 11:29 AM

This message was edited Mar 20, 2006 1:20 PM

AMEN! you are right about controversy, but I feel that sometimes life should be allowed to be simple.....

I wasn't trying to be hurtful or controversial to anyone with my comments. I only posted my comments b/c it reminded me of the large herds that used to be here at my place.

no body is saying anything even inappropriate was said or posted, I dont think.....The last thing I want to do is upset ANYONE!! please all, lets enjoy our conversation......no worries....right?

I will go back to saying I think they are beautiful animals. . and I feel sorry for them.

houseplant,
I SHOULD have prefaced my post with "IF anyone has been hurt or offended by my comments"......... sorry its been a long night and am worried about a family member....

My post was in reference to the comments about "controversy/ issues" in a few posts- including yours. I just did not want you or anyone else thinking that my first post was intended to be a dig at your pic or anything like that.

We DID have herds like that [nightmare!] and I commented on that fact.

All is well.
Debbie

(luvin'ly sighing here)

Some folks arise to have the controvercy cereal for breakfast in the mornings !! .. hee ..

A few years ago .. I cleaned out, then welded the lid onto my worry vat. I'm planning on keepin' it that way, fer a good long spell.

(((((a whole mess of huggers, fer all of you))))

- Magpye

amen Magpye! I love controversy and learn from it. Conflict is not something I fear but rather learn about the others perspective. Never judge, conclude, infer, or ridicule a person who's shoes (garden) you have not walked a mile in.

I love the picture and loved seeing the deer..They are so pretty so nice to see them.. and yes gets they maybe a nuisence but lots of us are..lol... sorry had to say that...they just do what they have to survive..