Biotechnoloy and Lily propogation

I recently received seeds of Gray's Lily (http://plants.usda.gov/java/profile?symbol=LIGR2) from a DGer and am very excited to try my luck. It seems that they are hypogeal so I know I'm in for the long haul.. however on looking for any references for Lilium grayi and germination across the web I found this article. It's really really not a fun read, however, there are one or two points that are probably things that might peak your attention. In particular, the research into germination.

Might be a good idea to open another window and have the Garden Terms tab open.. http://herkules.oulu.fi/isbn9514276590/isbn9514276590.pdf

The researchers did two types of experiments that yeilded positive results that I would say I might potentially be able to use, and possibly might be able to be applied by anyone (I can't tell yet how technical this would be).. or it might be that application isn't worth the trouble. First, germination was clearly accelerated with both removal of the seed coat and in embryos that were dissected out of the rest of the seed (endosperm). The second showed differing results in three plant hormones, Gibberellic Acid had no effect, something called ABA had an inhibitory effect but the 'antagonist' chemical to ABA called fluridon was added germination was significantly higher and reached 100% in 2 weeks... As long as this is actually the case (ie, the researchers did a good job) that statement sounds pretty powerful.

Has anyone tried this kind of thing? Does anyone want to? I have to make sure this fluridon isn't some kind of controlled substance but I may look into trying it out on some seeds..( as well as trying to cut away some of the endosperm) though so far it seems to be insanely expensive. If you have any interest in hybridizing or are just impatient like me though it sounds like it might be worth it.

OK, I printed this out and had a good read (*snore*). Here's my take on it: the author committed 6 sentences to the findings on GA, ABA and fluridone (a ketone 1-methyl-3-phenyl-5-(3-[trifluoromethyl]-4(1H)-pyridone and I'm not so sure that the author has this structure correct). See page 36 4.1.3. As close as I can figure the author used 2 lilies: L. regale (i.e.) and L. martagon (d.h.). The germination rate of the control experiment (presumably no treatment) was 87% which is not bad. The author doesn't mention how old or fresh the seeds are. In my experience freshly sown delayed hypogeal seeds germinate fairly quick. Some oriental seeds I collected in my garden last fall and sowed on Dec. 21 were germinating towards the end of January. Not bad for "delayed hypogeal"!

I did pick up on some of those shortcomings as well.. but I missed that only two lilies were used... Definitely not enough to make the statements about the entire genus! I'm still thinking of cutting up a couple of seeds and seeing what (if anything) happens.. but maybe I'll hold off on a chemical soak.

I believe that the ID of the species used is connected via the list at the end of the thesis and the "(I)" after the last sentence on page 36. Let us know how it turns out if you dissect into the seeds.

I have to admit, I didn't read anything past the abstract. If grayi is a difficult germinator, than I can see the paper's value here, but otherwise, I think it is a lot of unnecessary futsing. However the idea is interesting, and I see the legitimate application with wide cross procreation. Still, more power to ya, if you are going to try.

Now I'll just shut up, because I may have inserted a foot in my mouth since I may not have all the relevant facts. And I too would like to know the outcome of any experimenting you do.

lol, or you may have had the right impulse since pardalinum is right, using only L. regale and L. martagon and basing findings on them across the entire Lilium genus.. can't be all that powerful of a study.

Still, I found it much easier than I thought to see the embryo in the seed and to cut the endosperm away from each side of it with an exacto knife, or to kindof scrape off the seed coat with a blade as well.

I have nearly all of them in baggies or on soil in chambers where they'l stay humid and warm, and while I don't have the best controls set up I'll certainly post what I find when I see any germination.. maybe it'll point to this being worth it, but also perhaps not.

Either way, my first time with Lilium seeds (I just got L. pyrenaicum in the mail too, and will be starting them as well.. maybe half with excised endosperm and the other half without any prep. *crosses fingers*