I'd really like to get some chickens this year, I haven't convinced hubby yet, but working on it. I'm thinking about Buff Orpingtons because I like brown eggs, and because they're supposed to be able to handle winter a little better than some. But, I have some questions. I haven't been around chickens since I was growing up...
1. is this a good breed choice? What breed would you suggest if this isn't a good choice?
2. Is it necessary to get roosters too? McMurray offers females only, and I'd really rather only have females because I want the eggs, not to go into the chick business, nor do I want them for the meat.
3. If I let them free range, will they be ok in the pasture with the cows? We'll give them their own separate space for roosting, and will do nest boxes like we had when I was growing up for them to lay in...will they stay in that space, or will it be necessary to fence in a yard for them?
Thanks for any help/suggestions. If I can talk hubby into it, I'll probably order so they arrive in Early to mid April.
Melissa
Chickens??
Hey, Melissa. Fun stuff you're embarking on.
I like a few diff breeds, both for the mix of colors and to see who does best in my area.
1. Buff orps are a very nice choice. They lay well, and make nice stew hens. I've heard some say that they fall off laying more than other breeds after first moult, but I can't verify that. Another good choice for cold weather are the Wyandottes. The comb's close to the head so less likely to get frostbitten (though the hen comb on the Buff orp isn't very high). RI Reds are proven in cold weather, and I think Rocks are too.
2. No roosters needed for eggs. Sorry, guys.
3. I don't know exactly what sort of space you have, but they'll be fine w/ the cows. It's the predators that might be a problem. Everybody loves chicken! Are you locking them up at night? Are there places they can hide (bushes, low trees) from hawks?You could consider a chicken tractor, but with 25 hens you'd need more than one unless it's a big un, and then one person can't move it. As for escaping, my hens regularly hop over our 4 ft fence to roam beyond my little acre. The stinkers.
Hope this is helpful. I have Buff orps, RI Reds, and Ameraucanas.
Thanks Zeppy, I might look into some other breeds and do a mix. I like the color of the Buffs-- so maybe they'd look nice with another color mixed in. :-)
I didn't know if there was some type of Social issue with the chickens that they needed a rooster or not--good to know one is not needed. We always had one, but I never knew why.
If they're in the pasture with the cows, they'll be on about 25 or so acres that is partially wooded and have access to brush and trees to hide in. What we'll probably do, or, rather what I would like to do if hubby is agreeable is close off the part of the barn they will be in from the outside, leaving a little chicken door for them to come and go through. The back side of one of our barns has a machinery shed attached to it. I want to close off a section of the machinery shed for chickens.
That was the setup we had when I was growing up, and it worked well, only it was a regular chicken house, not a part of the barn. That door could be closed at night after they go in to roost.
Melissa:
Just a few ideas I might add:
I have always had good luck ordering chicks from Murray McMurray.
I like the 'old breeds' too.
We keep a rooster, just to hear him crow in the mornings.
Have you thought about a heat lamp for the chicks?
Yes, we have heat lamps, and will make a box out of plywood for them to stay in until they're a little bigger. Shavings on the floor of it, grit/sand with the feed, dip beaks in water when they arrive? I'm thinking about getting a book before I order though, and I still have to convince hubby.... the kids reallywant them, I really want the eggs since we go through about 4 dozen a week here, and you just can't buy them fresh.
It's good to hear from someone who has had good luck with Murray McMurray, I like that I can order all females, and I like their prices compared the the few other places I've looked at.
Friends of ours bought some chicks last year from TSC, unknown variety, and more than half were roosters, but late last summer they started giving us their excess eggs... that is when I started mentioning getting our own chickens on a regular basis. :-) but have been talking about it off and on for 10 years now...
Another question, is there any advantage or disadvantage to having the shots for Coccidiosis done at the hatchery versus using medicated feed?
Melissa:
I always have mine vaccinated at the hatchery. Murray McMurray also sells this stuff.......I can't remember what its called.......its like a yellow Kool-Aid mix.....its a chick booster/starter.......you just mix a spoon full with their water each day.......it really helps them get started. Its like Miracle Grow for chicks. I think it helps a lot. I would suggest putting that on your order when you get your chicks.
You don't have to dip their beaks, they will find it on their own. I think they do better when they can get out of their lot and range free for a while each day. They will forage for food and I think this gets them to lay better. Also, I think that if they are cooped up too much they focus on each other and start pulling out each others feathers or resort to canibalism. Also, if you get 'straight run' chicks, more then half of them will be roosters. Unless you plan to put these roosters in the freezer then they will cause problems......always fighting. It is nice to hear our lone rooster crow as I am heading out in the morning! He has almost 60 hens to spend time with, the poor feller, lol
I'm going to have the hatchery vaccinate for both. The cost is reasonable, the only worry I have is being able to find non medicated starter feed. I'll have hubby ask our feed guy this weekend. I'm planning on ordering all females, I know that there is the possibility of a mix up, but I sure hope not, because I really do not want to get into the chicken butchering business. Even though I've lived on a farm my entire life, I have a problem eating animals I've treated as pets... I can't do it.
Hubby is agreeable.... lots of moaning and groaning, but, he did ask me to find him some type of plans for nesting boxes... I explained to him how to make a roost, he thought that would be easy enough... but he's confused on the nest boxes, he wanted to leave the tops open...LOL I had to explain the nesting idea to him... bless his heart, he was a city boy who'd never even touched a cow til he met me... now he's raised rabbits, cows and pigs, and soon chickens and probably goats. LOL
I ordered this book, has anyone else ever used it?
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/158017325X/ref=pd_bxgy_img_b/002-0880570-5975236?%5Fencoding=UTF8
I've got a copy of it Melissa. Its PACKED with info and well worth the price.
Melissa:
Here is a pic of my nest boxes to show your hubby. Each 'cell' is at least 16" x 16". They can be made of wood too. Even a packing crate can be pressed into use in a pinch.
Thank you Virginian, for all your advice. We'll go with wooden ones... that is easiest I think for us, since one of the selling points for hubby was the relative inexpensiveness for the return. :-) I think that was a really bad sentence. LOL
He thinks it would be better to use one of the rooms in the barn for them, easier access for us to get in and out to get eggs, and poo. Dependent on where he puts the nests, the possibility of cutting small hand holes to get the eggs out without entering the pen--better protection for them, already an electric socket over head... a high window that can be opened in the room for ventilation and a smaller room adjacent where we already store feed, and the room isn't being used for anything else. Horse stall was adjacent, since she passed, we've not used it and not planning to unless we get more calves that need to be hand fed, and the other end is used by the resident cows.
Virginian, another question, how accurate is the hatchery when ordering all females?
Melissa:
I have heard that they are 95% accurate, but my order from Murray McMurray last August was 100% accurate. There was a show on TV last week showing how they determine their sex. It was on TLC or Discovery, a show called 'Dirty Jobs'. It was filmed at the Murray McMurray hatchery. Maybe it will be rerun.
I think chickens need a well lit roosting area, like a room with several windows that face south. They don't need a light on at night......just a room that gets lit up when the sun comes up. Also, its no fun to reach into a nest box to get an egg and come up with a handfull of snake instead!
Yikes, didn't think about the snake... and we DO have those in the barn..... OK, strike that idea! LOL
Melissa...tell your hubby that if the nest boxes are roughly 12 X 12 that is the perfect size for any breed you get (large bodied or even bantams). I have some with tops and also some that are topless. (Referring to the nest boxes, NOT the chickens!) In the pic below are some easy to build nest boxes; please note the "runner" near the bottom, this keeps the chickens from kicking out the straw and also gives them a perch to climb onto, check out the nest box (for previously laid eggs by other hens) and then gently enter to settle down comfortably.
You should build one nest box per 4-5 hens. (Also, don't stress out your hubby...if you are ordering chicks you'll have about 16-24 weeks before they'll need a nest box! Lots of time to build them.)
I have some nest boxes low to the ground, and some higher up in our coop. Chickens have their own personalities, some like the lower ones, some the higher ones!
The "yellow Kool Aid" Virginian mentioned (Love that description, Virginian!) is an electrolyte mix. And yes, it really will help them off to a great start; you have to remember these babies just went thru hatching/birth and also being shipped in a box thru the mail system for a day or so. They can use the extra vitamins. (As for me, I'm a beak dipper, mainly cus once they come out of the shipping box and into our brooder box they are scared, immediately put under a heat lamp and can be disoriented. The sooner they find water the sooner they are happy. And it only takes a second so why not help them out. It also helps them to get used to being handled.)
As for lights, in an effort to keep up egg production in the winter (short days) I have a 40 watt light bulb on a timer. It comes on just before it gets dark and goes off a few hours later...just long enough so the chickens benefit from the "summer time hours" even in the winter time. (As a kindness, I don't run the light very much in January for a few weeks; I'm firmly convinced that not only does it give the chickens a rest but also will help your egg production in the long run.)
Let us know what kind you get. I love the Buff Orpingtons but am most favorable to RI Red, Araucanas, Black Australorps (and this year, because of "rave reviews" am trying out Red Star; and they sure started laying according to schedule that Murry said they would, around 22 weeks).
Have fun!
Shoe.
Thanks so much Shoe...I printed out for hubby--he knows he has time, but he's about as impatient as I am, and now that he's decided it's ok we have chickens, he's ready to get to it. LOL He called yesterday and asked if I had ordered them yet! I was kind of waiting on my book to arrive, but I'm afriad it might make it worse.... after reading what you said, I went and looked at the Red Stars, and now I'm waffling between the Red Star and the Buff Orpingtons... both say they have great dispositions, which is also a big factor... the kids want them as pets... ugggg I'm so confused now! LOL
Melissa, your enthusiasm is rubbing off on me in a big way! I just looked at the MM site again too. LOL I think we'd like the Red Stars but that is just by reading all the comments and the description. I guess it's time to clean out the coup and figure out what's next! I wonder what the survival rate is from the time you get them, until they reach laying size? I'm not sure about the wild life here yet. I know we have possum, racoons, deer and I have seen skunks not too awful far away. Oh yea, there are hawks too.
Melissa, do you actually WANT 25? I am not sure I want to start with so many. LOL We're close enough to split if you want. I'm thinking this is one of those things I better work my way up. We are also talking about some goats. I figure fencing costs less than mower wear and tear.
I like my Buffs b/c they're so pretty, but the funniest/nicest are the RI Reds (granted these are old farm stock, not from a hatchery) and the hatchery Ameraucanas. The Ameraucanas are the best layers (by just a small margin).
The organic farmer I work with (summers) says he tried Red Stars and thought they layed GREAT the first year, and then fell off badly. Just his experience. So he's back to RI Reds. ALL those dual-purpose breeds are nice layers.
I keep chuckling about the term "dual-purpose". In my silly mind, that is manure and eggs. LOL I don't know that we'll be able to eat them.
I also just realized I have two kitchen cabinets in my burn pile. I took them out there but it's been too windy. They are homeade plywood boxes with finished doors on them. Could I use those for nesting boxes? One is 2.5 feet tall and around 3 feet wide and the other is about 1.5 feet wide and 2.5 feet tall. Is there any reason I couldn't/shouldn't use them? One was from the desk nook and the other was from the kitchen.
I need to go inspect my coup next. It is freestanding and about 6x8. I have no idea when it was cleaned last if ever. I do know it has been empty at least a year and probably a lot longer.
Melissa, you done with that book yet??? hahaha
Yeah, that's my dual purpose too. I mean, my chickens'. Sheesh...
Use the cabinets! That would be great! You could use them in the "dark nest" way that someone at Storey Books suggested. I love innerestin nesting boxes. Go and see the gem I found in the Poultry & Livestock forum...
Jealous of your coop. Seems like ours will never get done...
Don't be too jealous! I need to take a few pics and see if it qualifies as a usable coop! LOL Poultry and Livestock forum? Whoops! Here I am lost again. LOL
Badseed, you are getting ready for chicks! You'll love it. They are fun! I am going to order 25 next week. :o)
Hey Tricia! Well, I might be...LOL I just posted pics and a plea for suggestions in the poultry forum. Is 25 a lot? How much space do they need?
Badseed - To me.. 25 is not that lot LOL.. I never had 25 but I used to have 12 chickens. One day, the 2 dogs came and killed 10 of them.. if I have many, I won't lose all at one time! LOL They was in their pens when it happened. This time I am going to get me 25 or more.
I didn't even know there was a poultry livestock forum.....
Chele, I'm just getting home, so I didn't see your post above.
I'll email ya....
awww Zeppy, NOW you tell me! LOL
I placed my order this afternoon before I left, Red Stars and Buff Orpingtons...
Hi -
I ordered 25 from MM in July - I told them I wanted 23 hens and 2 roosters, and they were sexed with 100% accuracy. I also purchased the "Kool-aid" mix. MM recommends that you dip their beaks, and having never had chickens before, I followed their recommendations. I also read the Storey book before the chicks arrived, and being a previous city girl with no exposure to chickens (with the exception of the supermarket :-), found it to be a HUGE help.
My chickens all free range over 6-acres during the day, but are locked up in the evening.
I went with RIRs and absolutely love them. I have 2 kids under 5, and they are even sweet and gentle with them. They'll sit in your lap and let you pet on them, especially if they think you have a treat in your pocket!
As I was reading the Storey book today, I began to wonder, WHAT am I going to do when they stop laying? or their 4,000 ovums run dry.... in a couple of years these chickens are going to be like members of the family.... I can't just keep buying new chickens for the egg production and keeping the old....I'd end up with hundreds of chickens and a really big feed bill. How long, some of you more experienced growers, do they continue to lay?
I had to call my sister to ask what the name of the chickens we had that I was scared of, they were RIR's. They'd peck whenever I gathered eggs, "attack" as soon as I opened the door of the coop, I was never so glad to see a group of chickens gone in my life! LOL Every fall my mom butchered the "older" chickens and any roosters we had, and in the spring we'd get younger birds to replace what had been taken out in the fall.
Having grown up around it and doing it, I know that is NOT what I want to do... so what am I going to do with these chickens once they're finished laying?
I called MM today for advice about chickens that I want to order.. asked them about Buff Orpingtons cause we lives in hot and humid in the summer. They will survive in summer if there have some shades.. waters. They will be fine. Now I am thinking about add buff to my mix order! They are beautiful blonde as my hair is! LOL
That is what I have coming Trisha, mostly Buff Orpingtons and a few of the Red Stars...
I am going to order Barred Rocks, RIR, Americana, Red Star, Buff Orpingtons or Rocks also Single Comb Brown Leghorn rooster to replace my beloved Red Devil which he was taken by hawl or coyota two years ago. (25 chickens). It will be my first time to have 25 chickens instead 12. Many will be fun! I just recieved my rebate check so I am going to order next week but I need to get things ready before order them.
Melissa:
Our chickens seem to lay at least some until they get VERY old. Old for a chicken is 4 or 5 years I think. If a chicken is laying a lot their feet and legs will look washed out. We just let ours live out their life here.. I tried slaughtering the roosters a few years ago but I found it was easier to just buy chicken at the store. The birds I slaughtered were so tough we ended up grinding all the meat up into chicken salad. I could do it again if I had to, or if hard times come, its just easier to buy meat at the store.
MiniSchnuz:
I am glad to hear that you are getting your chicken flock built back up. I think it would do all of America some good to grow something or raise some sort of livestock, just to develope a sense of self-sufficiency. Even if it was just a half dozen 'mater plants out on the balcony!
Mini, what fun! Can't wait to see your pictures.
Our adventure has started. :-)
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/582918/
OK.... more questions.... LOL
I've commented that I wished I had ordered a few "crested" chicks when I placed my order-- we are having so much fun with these chicks hubby told me to go ahead and order another batch. If I do, these will be 3 weeks younger than the ones we have now.
Will they get along OK together when I put them together? Will the regular breed chickens pick on the crested chicks because they look different? Other thing, Mcmurray has a minimum of 25... so that will double the amount of chicks I have now.
It's not a big deal to build more nest boxes..... the area of the barn we've done for them is 12X12 or so with a concrete floor. The area they'll have outside is around 25 acres shared with cows. Will that be large enough to accomodate almost 60 chickens?
M'goodness...it's official, ya got Chicken Fever now! (Don'tcha just love it!)
Yes, you have plenty of room for your chickens, both in the coop and outside! As long as you have ample "stoops" (perches) for them in the coop to sleep on they'll be fine. (And regulated ventilation is a necessity.)
And yes, the two different flocks should get along just fine. Three weeks is not that much of an age difference. If you see any pecking it is usually a normal incident while they determine their pecking order; most likely you'll not notice any damage. However, keep in mind, I would keep the new chicks in a separate brooder box until they feather out, then move them in with the first batch.
Whew, thanks Shoe. Yep, I'd say there are 5 of us here who have it. I just never expected hubby to be so excited about them. :-)
What we're doing for ventilation is this, tell me if you think this is a good idea, because it's not finished yet, and can be easily changed.
We're putting them inside the barn, in what was a Foaling Stall. On the side where the nest boxes will go, (North) we are leaving that side above the nest boxes "open" to the rest of the barn for cross ventilation. Well, not completely open, we're putting chicken wire from the top of the nest boxes to the rafter of the coop. This will be directly across from the windows, (south side) thinking for cross ventilation. It will probably be a space of about 2 or 3 feet above the nest boxes. That area will be open to the rest of the barn, but not directly to the outside. Above the coop is a hay mow, we are closing the ceiling off to keep critters out we don't want in the coop area. The "front" (West facing) area where the door is, the door is a half door, the top we are framing in and covering with chicken wire. The remainder of that wall will be completely closed off. There is a 10X12 area on that west side, before you get to the coop that is for feed storage and access to the hay mow, that has a window, and a door that opens to the outside. Their chicken door will be across-- kitty corner (east facing) from the gate we use to get in and out.
We knew we'd have to keep them separate until they were bigger... but wasn't sure if they'd all get along together once they were "one flock"
Thanks Shoe. I just need a direct "shoeline" for all these questions I've had for you lately! :-) A phone shaped like a foot maybe? :-)
Here is a quick sketch
Melissa
Ignore that sketch, I had my directions messed up. I'm a blonde....
Here is what I think I'm going to get
CREVECOEURS
Black Star
GOLDEN POLISH
ARAUCANAS
WHITE CRESTED BLACK POLISH
BUFF LACED POLISH
WHITE POLISH
BLUE ANDALUSIANS
2 each except for the Black Stars and the Araucana's I'll fill the order out with those 2, or possibly add a few more red stars to make it 25.