Oh philcula...come out, come out and play where ever you are

Holidays are over and the festive fiascos are behind us, are you out there in cyber land anywhere?

Even after I took a bunch of lower leaves off to try to root... 'Phil's Giant' is still going strong.

While mine has not flowered, its leaf pulling has netted me 5 lil baby 'Phil's Giants'

You guys are gonna make me blush! Aww gee...

Nice work you two. I should give you both a little background information on this plant especially since Wolf has not flowered his yet.

I won only one plant of Ping. gigantea. This plant was grown from seed by Peter D'Amato and purchased by me when it was a wee 1 inch seedling. It grew for 3 years into a monsterous 14-1/2 inch diameter rosette before it flowered. There were dozens of flowers on it. When it was finished flowering it then divided into 30+ rosettes. I sold most, kept a few and made leaf props as well.

Now the interesting part.

I have heard from other growers who have this clone and have seen in my own collection that the propagules respond differently by maturing at different stages. While some grew and flowered at a relatively small stage, others grew into 12-15 inch monsters before they finally flowered. Laren...it looks like you have one that has matured early and Wolf...bro...you may have one that will get reeeeeeeeeeeealy big before it decides to flower.

I don't know what causes this. At first I believed that plants obtained through natural plant division would develop into the giant rosettes rather than plants propagated via leaf pulls. But this theory proved me wrong. I have had both natural divisions and leaf props develop side by side into BOTH giant forms and more reasonable 8-10 inch rosettes. Who knows why?

So far I have only been able to differentiate the plants by their growth habit. Plants that form multitudes of more upright succulent leaves typically flower at an earlier "smaller" stage whereas those that form broader arching leaves develop into super giants. The super giant form has leaves that develop one or two at a time and tend to arch over until they are lying somewhat flat on the soil surface. Wolf...your plant is clearly showing the giantism habit so far and Lauren's is showing more typical growth habit. But isn't it strange that it is the same plant?? It's one of the reasons I love cps so much.

"Phil's Giant" is not the only species I have that has exhibited such remarkable growth habits. I have been growing Peter D's clone of moranensis 'G' for about 7 or 8 years now and it regularly gets rosettes up to 12 inches across if given enough surface area to spread across. I have a supply of really large plants available that will be offered soon when I post my spring sales list.

Keep us posted on the development of these plants folks. I am most interested in seeing how yours turns out Wolf man!

Phil

Wow I had no idea that the exact same plant could have 2 separate growth habits. Crazy, CPs never fault at amazing me.

From your post Phil its seems like you find that pings need the largest amount of surface area available to get to the largest possible size? So if I am understanding correctly the diameter of the ping will only grow to the diameter of the pot?

Well the 'Phil's Giant' currently is by far the biggest ping I grow I cannot imagine some thing a foot to over a foot in diameter. Now I am excited.

Wolf

bummer. Does this mean my plant is a reject? It's one of my most beautiful pings, it can't be a reject. It does have a more upright growth form and before I pulled the leaves (which rotted on me by the way so I didn't get any ping babies out of them) it was probably only about 10" across. I feel so... so... so....deprived. I'm gonna need therapy now. HE got the BIG momma of pings.

Now let me get this straight, there is a moranensis out there that gets to 12"? Holy moly great balls of fire. My moranensis so far have only gotten to maybe 6" max. Now I am doubly depressed.

Too bad your ping leaves rotted away. What media did you lay them on? The leaves I pulled budded quickly with multiple plants. If one of them appears to have the same growth habit as the larger one I can send it to ya.

P.S. Lauren, did you recieve my latest email or did I mistype the addy?

Oh yeah and nana nana na na.. I got the big one!

Wolf

Wow, Lauren. Bummer. I mean, I WAS going to post that you had a really cool, substantial looking Pinguicula, but then Wolf had to go and compare his. Wolf got the big one AND the babies, too. Even though your Pinguicula is quite lovely, you are definitely going to need therapy.
However, I wonder if the second generation babies from divisions will have the same differing growth habits? Like, can you use leaves from your 'reject' ping to perhaps get a cool one like Wolf's? Maybe even one that grows bigger? ( Was his nose actually in the AIR when he said "The leaves I pulled budded quickly with multiple plants.) Whew! That hurts!

This is a total newsflash to me that plants generated through division might have different growth habits. Very KEWL!

Hey, I want to be cut into this giant Ping action, too! LOL! Funny that the same plant can produce 2 different types. That's okay...I've got a Sarr. named Phil's Giant.....

The lower leaves of the 'Phil's Giant' were absolutely huge compared to the other ping leaves pulled from other plants. I figured they couldn't sustain themselves. All of the other Ping leaves I pulled have rooted except those 'Phil's Giant' leaves which rotted. I used vermiculite which is what I've always used with no problems. I put about an inch or so in a food storage container and then I place shrink wrap over that and put a rubber band around it to keep the humidity up. My vermiculite is damp not moist. Maybe I'll try regular LFS next time.

Don't worry about saving one for me if it looks like it's going to be "reeeeeeeeeeeealy big" because I am actually very happy with the ping I have. The blooms are delicate and exquisitely colored with shadowing for lack of a better term. The blues are very subtle and go from dark to light. My 'Phil's Giant' grew pretty big this year at 10" and maybe next year it will get a little bigger. I was just teasing about being bummed out. Really, (sniffle sniffle) I'm very happy for you that you got the big one. And, you were so gracious and humble about it too.

I mean who better than someone as modest as you to get the big one.

E-Mails??? I'll have to go through my trash can. One of my older brothers is livid about something political going on right now and has been sending me one e-mail after the next to get his point across to me. I swear he isn't even 60 years old yet and if he keeps it up he is going to blow a gasket. Then, my one girlfriend and her wife must have gone through the last two months of their e-mails to clean house and they BOTH started forwarding with wild abandon. They are both superstitious and forward any e-mail that instructs them to do so to avoid cyber evils befalling them. Needless to say I started deleting one e-mail after the next because I was frustrated and I could have trashed you by accident. I haven't emptied trash yet this week so if you e-mailed and I deleted you, you're still there... somewhere amongst hundreds of garbage e-mails. Now, I haven't gotten through all the e-mails that backed up when I was gone so I may have to do digging but I'll find you.

Oh my! Pixie and Dode were both posting when I was posting. That will teach me to pause to go potty before pressing send.

Yes, Pixie! I do need therapy. I'm thinking I'll go and find that thread that had the 12 step program in it that I posted for you and see what I can do about getting my emotions under control.

Well I had to put it to Lauren a little bit. For hers is flowering and mine isnt, I have to get the rasberries in when I can.

And yes I do consider myself a very modest person, I think my fiance would even agree to that.. maybe.

Yeah I know I sent aleast one email maybe 2. If I still have them in my sent folder I will resend.

It will probably involve buying plants. I know that's true for me. LOL

Modest... as in you don't ever walk around home in your underwear? Oh, that wasn't the type of modest you were talking about. Just ribbing you back a little. You are really a neat person. 100% through and through. I don't think I've seen a nasty side to you ever.

Aren't raspberries a slang word for farts? you know... like when you blow raspberries on a baby's tummy and they crack up laughing? I must be losing it. I thought raspberries were fart sounds.

I dug you out. I went back in and dug out something from Dode that she asked me about earlier today. Actually, I dug out quite a few e-mails and then I deleted everything from Lynda and Georgia and John.

Yup Dode... John's ready to blow a gasket... shocking revelation to you I'm sure. He is gonna have a grabber if he doesn't chill out.

I gotta go to bed. Meetings tomorrow and now I'll be dragging my rear.

Umm no I guess that wasn't the type of modest I was speaking of. For I live in the country, I walk out to my mail box in my underwear, no probs there.

I am glad that I am a 'neat' person. In 2nd grade lil Suzy said I was cute too, then she kicked me!

I guess it just depends on where you are from. Around here 'giving someone the rasberries' is slang for giving them a hard time. Whatever you do with childrens tummies are your own problems.

Well I just pulled someone over, let's see if I can give them the rasberries.

Wolf

Good grief you two...I can't stop laughing!! Dear, sweet Lauren...fret not. Your plant is beautifully grown. And Wolf...your plant too is beautifully grown. I mean....I couldn't have done better myself......................
.........well............actually............
......I could..hee hee. now THAT...is a raspberry! Only kidding!

Wolf I have found it to be true in many cases that the larger the surface area a ping can grow...the larger the rosette forms. It seems to be so with plants in the moranensis, agnata group. But it doesn't always happen. Lauren, I have found that the best leaves to use for propagating from gigantea are the really succulent ones that form when the plant has divided into multiple crowns. The base leaves tend to be really thick. Some of these have produced as many as 20 buds per leaf for me. So all is not lost. And yes...you can certainly get really giant ones and typical ones from the same plant. I have on several occasions

I wish I knew what causes this. Anyways you're both doing well with them.

Lauren I do have a moranensis that grows to 12". In fact...the specimens that I have in 4"pots have flapped their leaves over the side of the pot and have adhered to it almost concealing it completely. I don't like when they do this. It makes them look really messy. So I like to plant them in wide shallow containers for them to spread out. And spread out they do. This clone also has enormous deep magenta flowers on stems up to 12" tall. The effect is something like a fireworks display.

Wolf...I'm amazed that you can type and pull someone over at the same time. Now THAT is talent. I have several cop friends who keep wanting to take me on a ride along. Actually they keep bantering me to take me along. They know I'm really afraid of guns and like to tease me that they would take me through the scariest side of San Jose to see some real action! I haven't gotten the guts up to do that yet. One of my coaches at work is going through the process to become an officer and she regularly goes on ride alongs. One night they had her break up an illegal gambling house and this big guy shoved her really hard and 4 cops pulled their guns out! She loved it...but I probably would have pee'd my pants LOL!

Wolf, I kinda live in the country too. The last time I went to my mailbox in my drawers my neighbor threw a ripe fig at me! Go figure! Some people have no taste! Well now you two need to kissy kiss and be nice to each other or else I'll have to send you both a moranensis 'G' and have you both duke it out proper! Hmmmmm....there's that sinister side of me again spinnin those wheels. Kindof reminds me of this time when I was at a cp show and brought a big Nepenthes in for display and this routinely arrogant member walked up to me and said "I could never grow that species that big"..I said.."I know"! TOUCHE'!

Nightie nite folks.

Girls, can't live with them and you can't live without them!

Incidentally, it's a consensus here in Illinois amongst the "guys". Giving raspberries here in my neck of the woods does mean sticking your face on a baby's belly or in the baby's chubby little neck and blowing farts until they squeel with delight and reduce themselves to fits of giggles. I confirmed it at a meeting today. Everyone was laughing because we've all given "raspberries" to babies. Colloquialisms are pretty wild.

My my my, another modest male amongst us. Boys, can't live with them and you can't live without them! That being said, kissy kiss to Wolf and bring on the moranensis 'G'. One for me and one for him. I'm up for a little friendly competition. What was that said by Simba in that movie "The Lion King" when he and Nala end up in the elephant graveyard and have to get bailed out by Mufasa? Remember, just before the hyenas come out from everywhere to feast on the intruders? "Danger? Hah! I walk on the wild side. I laugh in the face of danger. Ha ha ha ha!". Aside from that, I have a really big magnifying glass and if it looks as if my rear is gonna get whooped by Wolf, I can whip that out and take my photo through it to make my plant look reeeeeeeeeeeeeeealy big so I win.

Oddly enough I took a look at the leaves I had pulled and figured I was going to have problems so I'm not surprised. I'll try it your way next time with the 'Phil's Giant'. It will be a while as I have a hard time with what I deem to be mutilating my plants. You'd think I'd get over pulling lower leaves but I still haven't and cringe every time I pluck one off a plant.

I knew there was a reason why I liked you so much. Could this have possible occurred at the BACPS show a few years ago?

I'd go for a ride along with cops in a heart beat... as long as I was allowed to tag along in the trunk of the squad car. I’d feel much safer in the trunk.

On a side note, is running around in underwear some sort of a common trait that we CPers share? I got stuck outside in my underwear a few times chasing off heron and squirrels when doors shut behind me that were locked. We must be closet exhibitionists or something.

Why yes Lauren it was at a BACPS show a few years back. How'd you guess??

Lauren- I always thought a raspberry was the sound made by sticking your tongue out and making fartie type noises. LOL LOL!! I'm amusing myself a tad too much. Need to focus on work...lest I get caught :)

Well I guess I am going to have to start looking for wide shallow pots to grow some pings in. It seems that most pots diameter directly corralate to their depth thus it is slightly difficult. Any ideas on where to look?

Ok ok kissie kiss to Lauren too.. if I have too!

Well Phil I have no idea what a fig is but I dont think I would like one being thrown at me. I am assuming your neighbor was not impressed? You should be all tan from the nice Cali sun. Here are you get is MIchigan pasty white.

Wolf

I'm with the sticking the tongue out kind of raspberry..it's a vaguely fart-like noise, and I'd never get my face anywhere near an infant's anything. Yuk.

I vote for the raspberry-sticking-your-tongue-out thingy. Blowing on a baby's belly is called a 'flurbert' in my house, and dodecatheon, you don't know what you are missing!

Lauren and Wolf, please consider bathrobes.

Wolf, try bonsai pots.

Children who cannot get along together should be placed together in rubber rooms until someone wins or until they can get along. That's my professional opinion and I'm sticking to it. The same with biters. Put two biters together and see if they continue the practice. LOL

Now I know what all the cops are doing when they sit on the side of the road and no one is yet pulled over, because God knows that they have plenty of choices in terms of criminal driving around here. They must be surfing DG. That is hilarious! Be careful out there!
If you want to see Lakewood's finest, take a look at previous year's COPs show. Unknown to the local population, they used to have a contract with the Pierce Country Sheriff's office to do ride-alongs in certain areas of Lakewood. This was NOT very good publicity for our fair city. We were happy when we got our own police force and this practice was promptly stopped.

Well, you know my style when I get annoyed although it doesn't happen all that frequently. I feel relatively confident I know who you are referring to and I cleaned his clock once too.

Hey Wolf honey bunny sweety pie smoochie man (anything to avoid rubber rooms), any low ceramic casserole dish should work well as should glass pyrex bakeware I would think. Those can be picked up at virtually any garage sale. Come to think of it, ceramic quiche dishes would work well too and those are 10" in diameter and only 2" deep. Do you want me to be on the lookout for these types of dishes this spring when the garage sales start popping up at every corner?

Look what I just found-
http://www.corningware.com/products/products_productline_action.asp?pagecount=4&thispage=2&thisstart=5&thisresults=4&results=15&product_line=FRENCH%20WHITE&product_size=#
They sell these at garage sales all the time, this particular line too.

A ceramic drill bit should go through the bottom of that casserole dish relatively easily.

Say Pixie, you better suggest that Phil AND Dodecatheon both consider bathrobes too. Phil has already admitted to going to his mailbox in his "drawers" and he does have this balcony that he probably sits out on in his "drawers" and then there's Dode... she ended up stripped down to her undies over here at my house once when she had a little... er... uh... accident once. Dode, you got some splainin to do girl.

Pixy, point well taken I will look into bathrobes. But I just dont see the point, I am sure I am already known as the crazy man who grows those plants that we send our kids to see. Yes yes alot of police work is public perseption as long as they think you are patroling or running radar then they are happy. They usually dont want you to pull people over just look like you will. So it works both ways, the public gets what they want and I get to serf DG. I do actually do my job when need be though.

humm bonzai and cassorole dishes. Good ideas, I will have to be on the lookout. I was planing on purchaseing large amount of pots so that all my sarrs will be in identical pots so maube I can pick up some special ping pots too. I dont think my girlfriend would be all that happy if I started to put holes in her dishes.

Lauren- Whos clock have you not cleaned? And if you both got to clean someones clocks I want in on the action. No holding out on me here. I have never been in a rubber room but can imagine that it would not be fun. We do have a padded room that we put our crazys in at the jail. I won 40 bucks last week betting on how long he would continue running into the wall... 25 mins quite a fighter he was.

Oh and Phil just FYI I got a hold of Trent and I am now 2nd on his list for a 'Grade A' Viking once it gets warm. Wonder who number 1 is?

Man! Lauren you really tell tales out of school! You were probably the kid who pointed at everyone else eating cookies when her hand was in the cookie jar! Good job redirecting attention to Phil and Dode! Phil probably does go to his mailbox in his drawers, but at least he's probably tan. And it sounds like Dodecathon might have had a good reason to be in her undies at your house - a reason we can all live without hearing I'm sure! I need to be the adult voice of reason and ethical behavior here, I guess!

Wolf, you must have been posting privately to Lauren about matching pots! You are beginning to sound like her! But I would be surprised if Lauren suggested that you put holes in your girlfriend's dishes. I figured she was talking about YOUR dishes? Or maybe you could buy the dishes just for your pings and sarrs? It's been done, you know. You really shouldn't limit yourself like this. We should talk about that sometime.

It's too late for me to be posting to you children! Mommy is going to bed!
Wolf, congratulations on your promotion! That is very cool for you and I know you will be polite about it to Lauren. And Lauren, I just know that you will be very happy for Wolf. Remember, he carries a gun.

HOO HA!~ I love this forum!

No Pixie, I have always accepted responsibility for anything I ate and you can take that to the bank. I like food in quantity, what can I say.

Now now now, Dode can tell you about her little chemical spill. Mums, the word.

Wolf, are you going to be overwintering plants other than your own or do you just like the uniformity of matching pots?

Oh nooooooo, I would never drill holes in anything I actually use and I would strongly suggest Wolf not drill holes in his future wife's casserole dishes until after she walks down the aisle and says I do. I do see lots of casserole dishes and pyrex at garage sales and I'd drill in those in a heart beat. I've seen them for $1 a piece. Can't beat that price. The rectangular shaped glass pyrex dishes are great for drip trays but pyrex has glass pie pans too that work great for drip trays and they clean out so easily because they are glass. I've never tried to drill holes in glass before for drainage but I'm sure it can be done.

So, Mommy went to bed and before she slipped off to la la land she instructed Equil to be nice because Wolf carries a gun? Well well well, I've got a secret weapon myself. Meet Elliott-

Be afraid, be very afraid. That cat has a squirt gun and he'll use it!

He looks positively demonic! Beware of the stalk-cat! Is this, perchance, the CP destroying cat? I don't even want to ask what is in that gun! There are too many liquid possibilities!

Nope, Elliott isn't a plant eater. I have another very old female Siamese that is sort of senile as well as a long haired red tabby. These two are my plant eaters. They eat my plants then they barf all over the house... special. Very special. This is why we keep the doors closed to the rooms with plants. Speaking of which, little Ms Senility would use any plant pot that she could balance on as a litter box. Another good reason to keep the cats separated from plants. Cat urine is potent!

Nothing in the squirt gun (Don't tell Wolf... it's our secret). We found it down in the basement and propped it in his paws. That cat is a slug. You can dress him up in doll clothes if you want and roll him around in a stroller and he'd be perfectly content. Hang him upside down and swing him around... no problem. Elliott is an attention hound. He is not all that great with our dogs though. He will beat them up pretty good and he packs a good whollop straight to their faces.

Equil...Elliot is perfectly justified in punching big, dumb Audrey in the face. Big dumb Audrey is always running around with this huge rubber bone..it weighs about 12 lbs, and she smacks people(me)and other critters in the head with it. So, I figure Elliot is well justified in punching Audrey right in the snoot.

Wolf..ask Lauren about what brand of rubber dog bone she buys for Audrey...I know for a fact that it would work better than a billy club or the mag lite fully loaded with "d" cells(a favourite of Chicago's finest).

The reason I ended up in my undies at Equil's is this...I was out helping her and her lovely husband paint "plant killer" on the stumps of freshly cut buckthorn..a nasty, nasty non-native tree/shrub. Anyway, for some reason, I switched the jar of plant killer to my left hand, which is pretty weak because of nerve damage, because I have a touch of MS...only I keep forgetting my left hand is weak..so, I dropped the whole jug of plant killer, which I thought was glyphosate, down the front of my pants. So, equil had me go inside, take off my pants so she could launder them, and had me get into the shower. I ran around her house wrapped in a towel until my pants were dry. Mind you, Equil had also added red dye to the herbicide, which makes it easier to tell which stumps you have treated. So, for about a week...my left leg was dyed bright red.

Equil later told me that what I thought was glyphosate was really tordon or garlon or something evil like that. My twisted DNA gives thanks to Equil! Thank Jah I didn't want kids in the first place, LOL! April

This message was edited Jan 13, 2006 9:52 PM

I knew that somehow Lauren would be involved with this incident. What a nice friend you are helping paint herbicide on nasty invasive species. Want to come over? My kids are big now. No belly blowing necessary. But I have some nasty holly trees that refuse to leave when asked politely.

It's the Kong brand for large breeds. $24.99 and Great Danes and Mastiffs can't chew it down to the size of a toothpick in a week or less. Worth every penny (keeps them from chewing the doors and stairs and other building materials used to construct homes) and they last at least a month. I never really thought about it until you mentioned it but when one is sitting at the kitchen table... the dog's head with the bone hanging out is at human head level. All the better to get eye level with you so you don't ignore that cute little thing. Are you insinuating that Great Dane Rescue duped us and that Audrey is big and dumb? Tsk tsk, now that dog is going to end up in therapy... she thought you loved her. I do have to admit that I think it is hysterical that Elliott boxes dogs in the faces. He's good sized at around 21lbs but the dogs dwarf him and he still goes at them. Pretty hysterical if you ask me. Little Ms "Deaf as a doornail" Senility has bitten them right in the faces when they rouse her from sleeping peacefully to sniff and slime her and she is all of maybe 6-7 lbs. The dogs yelp and take off.

Garlon 4, the chemical was G4. I had run out of the blue dye. It could have been worse, instead of looking like a big raspberry birthmark for a week... you could have looked like you had the onset of leprosy in a pretty shade of blue. You looked so cute in that towel! Gosh, if I would have known we could have had a toga party in your honor or something. Toga! Toga! Toga!

Pixie, regular Garlon3 RTU will work on those Ilex. The G4 is about $350 for 2.5 gallons (you still need to purchase a surfactant) and you can pick up premixed G3 (no surfactant or powdered dyes needed as it is ready to use). Take a hand axe and knick the bark on your Ilex to expose the cambium layer and paint the area you exposed with the G3RTU. Ilex is evergreen but it will begin defoliating in about 2 weeks after having used only a small amount of chemical, my guess would be the equivalent of a Tblsp or two. Both are short life chemicals and both are deemed to be lesser of the evils which is why the price is so darn high. G3 should take care of those nasty holly trees in no time flat and you should be able to purchase it out west affordably in reduced quantity. You do realize Ilex is not invasive, right?

Oh about belly blowing, don't let Dode fool you, she likes flesh loafs (her word for babies)... and flesh loafs and kids in general love her. Dode is an animal and kid magnet, don't let her fool you. They know mush when they see it.

This message was edited Aug 29, 2006 11:44 PM

Meant to add this photo. It's a portion of a Drosera binata 'Extrema' leaf-

Nice photo!
Ilex may not be invasive in your neck of the woods, but it sure is here. I know there is a fine line between invasive and "aggressive as heck". It spreads through seed distribution as well as runners. You don't want to plant it anywhere near a doug fir forest here. (Not that we have many of them left.) The area I live in, while technically in town, is mostly older homes on large 'estates'. Many of the properties in this area have untouched areas of doug fir and other native vegetation - vine maples, snowberry, etc. The holly invades these areas and eventually shades out the nice undergrowth. It can't really compete with the firs that are established as they are so tall, but it can keep smaller firs from establishing. Mostly it's a pain in the butt. Even English Ivy won't kill it. It's probably not as big an issue in larger areas.

I'd like to try the G3 premixed - any ideas on where to find it? I bet Lowes doesn't carry it, unless it's under some brand name?

I don't know where you can get Garlon 3 locally but maybe my source will mail order- http://home.conservfs.com/