Please help ID my orchid

This is a prolific flowerer, and when finished grows strong new pseudobulbs, from which 2 flower spikes come, one either side from the base. It had 4 new growths with 8 flower spikes. This is the early stages of flowering, the spikes grew much longer, and flowered for around 5 months.

The flowers are sweetly scented, and strong in the morning. They are fairly small, but long so they could be anything around 1.25" or just over. The reddish colour on the top is perhaps not quite as strong as it looks, it was a little more pink until I repotted it in my own mix.

I only have a little knowledge of orchids picked up from looking around, and this had a label with 'cattleya'. I have two local garden centres near which have deliveries from the co-operative growers in Holland, but also from others, but I have seen Dutch growers listed on the cellophane wrappers, which ones I don't remember.

It has been suggested this is a hybrid of Miltonia. I can also see characteristics of Oncidium and Odontoglossum, but then I could be totally wrong.

Anyone with any clues? Any help much appreciated, thanks.

A full view

The big clues with this orchid are: pseudobulbs, leaves, blossom shape and size, bloom time of year, and scent. I believe this is an Oncidium because of what you have shown and described.

I'm unsure of your growing conditions, but the Odontoglossum orchids need a cooler environment than Oncidiums and Miltonias and not everyone can grow them to blossom because of their temp. requirements.

Most Miltonias and the intergeneric hybrids have blooms that are larger in size than those you are sharing here. And frankly, the blossoms are not like those of the Miltonias that I've seen or grown. Many of the Miltonias have a scent, but it is usually not strongly perfumed. Also, Miltonias are somewhat 'flat' and not as dimensional as the blossoms you have. Those blossoms and the 'spray' of small orchid flowers are very much like an Oncidium.

I'll put my $$ on an Oncidium ID. You have a gorgeous plant!!

Hi Lynn, I must admit I was swayed towards Oncidium when looking at others, the size, leaves etc as you said. The two little angel wings above the lower petals were a clue, and the skirt with its v notch at the bottom. It flowered somewhere around late May to at least end of October, possibly longer.

I had kept it in an east facing window, summer temps mostly around low 20's C, winter temp mostly 16-20C, a radiator below switched off at night. It was getting too big for that position, so I put it on top of the TV when flowering, not much light there but some warmth from it. It had flowered a 2nd time from buying it already, last year, this was it's 3rd.

I think unless someone has one like it, it will prove difficult to ID definitely as to a hybrid name, or perhaps it doesn't have one. Thanks for the input.

Lynn, your description of miltonia sounds like Miltoniopsis; the real Miltonia (eg. M. clowesii, flavescens) have small scented flowers and produce a spray more typical of Oncidiums. Very few Oncidiums impart pink in the hybrids...O. ornithorhynchum is the main one and it is also fragrant...think of the Sharry Baby and Twinkle clones. I'm thinking it might be a hybrid between ornithorhynchum and maybe Miltonia clowesii. I'm still researching.

Wallaby, I found a pic that looks very close to yours but unfortunately, it is unnamed other than the fact that it is an O. ornithorhynchum hybrid!

http://www.orchideepassion.com/vb/images/products/Onc_ornithorhynchum_hybride_200.jpg

Todd the link doesn't work, will type it in, thanks

hey getting close, the petals not right, they are rounded, but looks very similar

http://www.florafest.com.au/OA.Onc.ormithorhynchum.html

found an Ornithophora radicans, it has the red stems and many of the similar characteristics, just a bit different.

http://www.sdahldtp.com/ornithophora.htm

miltonia spectabilis (not attempting the rest) put all 3 together, hocus pocus, and we have it!

http://www.sdahldtp.com/mspectabilis.htm

help I'm going mad, this zygopetalum has similar petals with the lighter edge

http://www.sdahldtp.com/zmaxann.htm

and they are scented!

stir this one in the witches brew and we have it

http://www.sdahldtp.com/onclilacsoap.htm

O' this is getting exciting, the O. o. above is a grandparent of Sharry Baby

Click on 'photo'

http://www.vengers.com/culture/oncorn.htm

wallaby,
for the last 2 hours I have been googling and looking through my books, so far I haven't found it yet. But I will keep my eyes peeled.

thanks RUK, gets you doesn't it, 3.30 am here, to to go zzzzzzzzzz.

The last link certainly looks like a grandparent, a close cousin to Sharry Baby.

Wow....I see that Wallaby was all over the world on an info-hunt! And there's a quest by others to ID this orchid, too. LOL What have you gotten us all into?!

Hi Todd. I wasn't thinking of the Milt species, sorry! I was being lazy and speaking in generalities. I will look up those species you mention -- I'm not familiar with the species, only the hybrids. To clarify for others, the Miltonia orchids are often referred to as "Pansy Orchids". The Miltonias are from Brazil and can grow warmer, in general, than the Columbia Miltonia (aka Miltoniopsis). Hope that clarifies!

I have the Onc. ornithorhynchum and it does have a wonderful scent! Mine is blooming now. Speaking of that orchid, I had taken some photos of it yesterday but I did a Don on the photo of the full spray so I didn't post it. Here's a closeup of the blossom, but it's not a good match to Wallaby's orchid.

Todd, that eepassion.com website is a fun commercial site (especially if you comprendez et parlez!) and they have some wonderful species orchids for sale! WOW!! I had to pull out my "Want List" and add to it. At this point, who am I kidding?! I should revamp my position and just make a "Don't Want List" because it would be much shorter.....

I think we can all agree that your mystery is most likely some O. ornithorhynchum hybrid. The pinched lip, fragrance, size and colour would suggest this. As to the other parents thrown into the mix, who knows! Miltonia spectabilis or clowesii are possibilities. Certainly, M. spectabilis is a VERY popular parent that can be traced back in many Oncidium intergeneric hybrids.

Lynn, the Miltonia vs Miltoniopsis will always be troublesome since the sellers still call Miltoniopsis Miltonias. I guess they should call one group the Pansy orchids and the others the Brazilian miltonias. Now to add more problems, Miltonia warcewiczii, another very popular parent in many inetrgenerics, has recently been reclassified as an Oncidium! As a result, many Colmanara, such as the popular Colmanara Wildcat, are no longer Colmanara but rather Odontocidiums. Orchids may be lovely, but they present many conundrums.

Lynn, I think a good old mixed input can only be good for all, you have learnt to look at species, I have learnt about parentage (well a tid bit anyway), and all I can add to that is the list of possibilities is endless.....endlessssssssssss!

Todd, you are reading my orchid database!! LOL I have Oncid fuscatum and it's cross-listed in my personal database as that Miltonia. I also have one of the Wildcat orchids, too. It's cross-referenced as well. LOL (I had better luck keeping up with my kids....)

Wallaby, this was fun. Are we still getting the ID-exam on Friday??????

found a cross with the onc. orn., another oncidium hyphaematicum. Look at the 3rd from bottom, Oncidium John Louis Shirrah 'Profusion', it is even closer, perhaps a search with the words 'ornithorhynchum, miltonia, hyphaematicum'. I found this by searching 'ornithorhynchum miltonia hybrid'

http://www.evergladesorchids.com/oncidium.html

Lynn, no Thursday, day off on Friday

Getting HOT
Look at Oncidioda Charlesworthii

http://www.krischanphoto.com/gardens/orchid/oncidium/oncidium.htm

This site give the rise to names from cross breeding, Todd look at the Oncidium Sweet Sugar.....look familiar? it has onc. Aloha in breeding, and I DARE you to click on the link to look at its specific info. Think I will have a very close look at my onc. Aloha.....nightmare!

Again I am seeing a bit of zygopetalum thrown in, this Zygolum Louisendorf looks like the influence in the petals

http://www.krischanphoto.com/gardens/orchid/zygopetalum/zygopetalum.htm

good this innit?

LOL.....Who turned you loose on the World Wide Web???!!

a good reference site for names and their species crosses, no photos though

http://www.delfinadearaujo.com/hibridos/nomencla/pageng.htm

OK can't help it, another list of classifications and abbreviations, in the interest of orchid nuts ww.

http://retirees.uwaterloo.ca/~jerry/orchids/MACLASS2005.html

This species link states oncidium incurvum, a parent of the above mentioned Oncidioda Charlesworthii, as a cool grwer and summer to autumn flowering, hey that fits!

Other parent cochlioda noezliana not yet researched.

http://www.orchidspecies.com/oncidium.htm

hi I'm back

came across 'Burrageara', which includes :

Cochlioda
Miltonia
Odontoglossum
Oncidium

just thought these may all play a part, could be a good search option

http://www.orchidlady.com/encyclopedia/hybrids/b.html

Burrageara Buried Treasure, looks similar

http://www.paramountorchids.com/Onc%20Interg1.html

Hmm, I looked at the Buried Treasure last night , but I thought the lip color was off. But I thought too it was close.

I am looking for indicators as to which line to follow, and it has proven useful in google searches. For the moment I have done my head in, need a break.......but these particular 4 look like they could be involved, a bit like the mastermind game!

I agree

Wallaby, forget the zygopetalum angle.....it is a genus that is incompatible with cross-breeding with oncidiums.

You are to be commended on your determination to find out what hybrid you have.

gee ta Todd, see ya in the asylum!

So....it's been several days now. Did ya fall off the end of the Internet or did ya find your orchid???? We need to know!!

yeah, we do!! So there!!

still in recovery, don't know if I'm going to find it,

hey how about some help here???????

Wow, I just finished reading most of the 30+ posts above. It's nice to see all these fine people trying to help you wallaby1. I have 30 or 40 orchids that the hurricanes of '04 and '05 blew the tags off. Being somewhat of a novice, I have no clue what most are. What I'm doing is taking a couple at a time to a local commercial orchid grower, and try to get them to help with identification. So far so good. I also took a few to an orchid show in Melbourne, Fl and got some help there. Most of mine are species orchids, which I believe makes the identification a bit easier. My problem is many have yet to bloom, and with these I will just have to wait. Good luck with your quest.

FishMang-

Where is Valkaria? I have a journal where I write about my orchids and also index cards that list when they bloom, when I repotted them, etc. I don' t take individual pictures, but I know the index cards would help me somewhat if I lost my tags. I also write my own tag and put it in the orchid that says when I purchased it, the name, bloom color, etc.
Sorry about your lost tags. There are so many experienced orchid growers here, so they will be able to help you with some of the identification. Good luck.