MIMOSA TREE SEEDS FOR.....

Have to close the weed seed page, sorry folks. I had no idea Mimosa was a weed in IL. BUT I swear I did not send you folks in IL the KUDZU.

This message was edited Sep 6, 2005 11:59 PM

This message was edited Sep 7, 2005 12:00 AM

Blackwolf, I hate to dampen the enthusiasm here, but you are helping what is a noxious weed in many southern areas find new places to invade. This tree can be beautiful, but in the right (wrong) climate it will take over the whole neighborhood with unwanted volunteer seedlings. It might be a good thing to tell everyone up front that you are sending them the woody equivalent of a dandelion before they decide to try it!

That being said, I have one here in Zone 5 and it hasn't been a weed problem. It barely survives here, and seedlings don't stand much of a chance in our central Illinois winters.

Guy S.

There are microclimates up my way and Mimosa is making it here and I'm about 100 miles north of StarhillForest. They said Kudzu would never make it here and it is already in Cook county just about 15 miles south of Chicago. Salt Cedar has made a tremendous gain.

Mimosa truly is no better than Tree Of Heaven. Kudzu, or Salt Cedar.

From this website but we already know Mimosa is a problem species here in North America-
http://www.phschool.com/science/science_news/articles/cultivating_weeds.html

"Only about 10 species out of 1,000 new introductions will prove weedy, notes Kayri Havens, conservation-science director of the Chicago Botanic Garden in Glencoe, Ill. However, her team's research shows, it takes only one aggressively invasive species to profoundly disturb the natural ecosystem of a forest, wetland, or prairie."

"Yet few homeowners realize that their plant choices and husbandry can lead to environmental havoc a mile or more outside their yard. Contributing to the problem: Nurseries sell some of the most aggressive invaders—usually with little or no warning."

"Fitness or luck
Why do some plants turn invasive? The answer could help botanists anticipate which new immigrant will be the next environmental tyrant.

For years, a leading hypothesis has been that the immigrants left behind the pests and predators that had held their numbers in check. A study in the Feb. 6 Nature now supports this view.
Charles E. Mitchell and Alison G. Power of Cornell University focused on 473 European plant species that have invaded the U.S. landscape. The plants faced, on average, only 16 percent as many fungal species and 76 percent as many viruses as their kin remaining in Europe did.

Other researchers have found another means by which some nonnative plants increase their invasiveness. They hybridize with relatives they meet in their new world. John F. Gaskin, now with the U.S. Department of Agriculture's pest-management research unit in Sidney, Mont., and Barbara A. Schaal of Washington University in St. Louis examined desert salt cedar. In the United States, these trees—initially imported from Eurasia to shade arid plots—rank second only to purple loosestrife (Lythrum salicaria) as the most invasive nonnative plants.

Though desert settlers in the arid United States initially planted the drought-tolerant salt cedars (Tamarix) to shade their arid plots, these Eurasian trees found their new environment so inviting that they often took over. Explains John Gaskin, who has studied their invasions in the U.S. Southwest, salt cedars will often start by lining the banks of rivers and then spread out in a forest that may extend back from the river for a kilometer or more, as shown here along the Gila River in Arizona.

J. Gaskin, USDA

Physically, many U.S. salt cedars look somewhat different from the two main species initially imported, Tamarix chinensis and Tamarix ramosissima. The U.S. plants also repel many pests that plagued one or the other of those species in Eurasia. This suggested, Gaskin says, that at least some U.S. salt cedars were novel crosses of the two imported species.

Using DNA fingerprinting techniques, he and Schaal examined 269 salt cedars—both in the United States and overseas. In the Aug. 20, 2002 Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, they confirmed that the most invasive U.S. specimens were hybrids. Gaskin says that this adaptive crossbreeding couldn't have been anticipated before the trees were imported because their native ranges didn't overlap.
Then there are some immigrant species that appear to be well behaved, but in fact are time bombs, notes Daniel Simberloff of the University of Tennessee in Knoxville. In the book Strangers in Paradise (1997, Island Press), he relates how nurseries imported 60 species of ornamental figs to Florida, where landscapers for decades employed them without a problem.

Growers propagated the plants by hand, since to reproduce naturally, each species needed a particular pollinating wasp—none of which was in the United States. About 20 years ago, however, the first fig wasp—the only pollinator of Ficus microcarpa—arrived from Asia. At once, Simberloff tells Science News, this laurel fig turned aggressively invasive."

SORRY FOLKS!! Looks Like Strike 2 for me huh?

I dunno??? What was strike one for you? I'm on about strike 100. I've made so many screw ups it seems as if I have done more "unplanting" than planting here for the past few years. I am the idiot who went and broadcast 20 packets of Dame's Rocket seeds all over my property so they could "naturalize". The seed packs were pretty and looked "au naturelle" to me so I figured if one pack was good... twenty would be better. I even had to drive around to several Frank's Nursery and Crafts to be able to pick up that many of the same seed packs. Oh they naturalized allrightie. It's years later and I'm still finding them everywhere along with that darn Snow On The Mountain and a few others that come to mind. Here's what's nice about Dame's Rocket... it sizzles and hisses when you toss it on a nice big pile of burning weeds. Music to my ears. The Dame's rocket is one of those- "I can't believe I did that to myself" deals.

I try to touch you with a feather, and then tiny little Equilib hits you with a Nuke! But she does get results, and God help anyone who gets in her way -- she's a living dynamo! The DG forum is lucky to have her here, as a fellow refugee from "that other forum" where bad things happen to good people. If we can entice a few more of the best people from there to seek refuge over here, this forum really will rock.

Guy S.

Strike one was KUDZU.
I was reading a thread on Kudzu blooms...and how pretty they were. I make Kudzu bloom jelly every year...anyways 2 folks wanting some kudzu vines to grow in pots. I offered to send them some....WHAM!!!! Got my chops busted by a few folks. I figured if they grew it in a pot...it would be fine. I kind of felt like an idiot after all the responses. Of course I did not send any...instead I sent each of them Kudzu jelly instead. They were very happy with that. I was not going to send it to start anything...just was trying to help out a fellow gardener with a plant they wanted to try. It NEVER occured to me that I would be starting trouble...honest.
Now Strike 2...the Mimosa. I have never heard of anyone calling it a weed down here, or anywhere for that matter. I was shocked!! And almost decided to resign from DG. I don't want to be known for the idiot who sends BAD plants out to folks, or the person who contributed to changing the USA with noxious weeds.
Now I am kind of afraid to offer seeds and plants , to others. Alot of the seeds I have do reseed and multiple each year...Sweet Hibiscus, Impatients, morning glories, Cannas and so does my ginger. I dont like to upset folks, just wanted to share plants I find attractive with others who also find the attractive.
I do appologize to everyone who I have offended or upset in the past 2 weeks.
Sometimes being new is a BAD thing I guess.


This message was edited Sep 7, 2005 3:33 PM

Don't fret about it -- chances are you won't stumble into strike three for a very long time! There aren't all that many bad plants out there, and you beat the odds by hitting two of them in a row. Actually, mimosa really isn't as bad as some of the others, depending upon location -- I'd say you just hit a barely foul ball rather than another swing-and-a-miss.

Now go back out there and bunt in a run. No, wait -- I think they call that a suicide squeeze, and given your current downer I don't want to be telling you to do anything suicidal!!!

Hee-hee-hee!

Guy S.

Guy! Get rid of your Mimosa- sheesh! Bad Boy Bad Boy whatcha gonna do whatcha gonna do when they come for you Bad Boy Bad Boy! I'm bringing my chainsaw and I'm comin a callin at your house. Think while I'm there I'll snatch me a few American Yellowwood saplings and see what else you have that is a keeper. Come to think of it... I've had my eye on a cannonball for a while.

Blackwolf! I'll see your kudzu and mimosa and raise you with burning bush, garlic mustard, and water hyacinth. Yup, when we first moved in to this house our landscaper sold me on purchasing 12 burning bushes. He said they would "really make a statement" in my front yard. Yup, they made a statement. They made it in my front yard, my side yard, my back yard, the natural areas of the property, my neighbors properties as well as across the street in the forest preserve. I'm still plucking their offspring out every fall and the bushes were removed years ago. Garlic mustard...oh that was a classic. I wanted to try a moon garden. I figured I'd start with those nice white flowering plants my girlfriend had in her back yard along the fence so I went on over and dug up a few. She noticed that I had been very conservative when digging and told me to come back and take a few more. I did. Well a few turned into a few more which turned into a hundred more which turned into a thousand more. I was in heaven until... I found out what they were. I think I have ripped every last one of those out of the ground but I still find little patches of a hundred or so popping up here and there. Water hyacinth, egad. I bought that and put that in my little pond out front before I realized how close it was to being able to mutate to a cold hardy ecotype. To add insult to injury, I then composted it. I might as well admit to having ordered Tree Of Heaven while I'm on a roll here. That never made it in to the ground though. Did I mention the Lily of the Valley or the English Ivy? Think I'll pass on mentioning those but I found some nice Field Bindweed and dug up a few of those and planted those right into my lawn. They were the cutest little things! I could go on.

Now Guy, cover your eyes for this next one!

I bought Autumn Olive, Russian Olive, Bradford Pear, Cleveland Pear, Redspire Pear, White Mulberry, and the Sawtooth Oak and planted it all here the year we started building the house. I wanted to get a jump on the yard. I had purchased B&Bs not saplings. They were so big they were delivered to the site on a flat bed. And we're not talking one of each because I'm one of those people who likes plants in threesies. Special, very special. Once I found out what they all were, we had a big bon fire and my poor husband said he was going to have nightmares of dollar bills attached to tree leaves being tossed in the burn pit.

So Blackwolf, you are amongst friends here. There is life after strike three... and after strike one hundred. Let he who has not planted or traded a noxious weed throw the first stone. Now I think I'll reclaim the idiot crown from you if you don't mind. It's mine mine mine!

Gawd! Garlic mustard? You planted GARLIC MUSTARD? And you seemed like such a nice girl!

I did cover my eyes, but curiosity is getting to me. Maybe I'd better get a good night's sleep first, before looking -- you might give me nightmares.

Now, about that cute little name your husband gave you (I won't say here what it was, unless you care to admit it) -- maybe there was more to that than met the eye . . .

And no, you can't bring your chainsaw. Unless you want to attack Lonicera, Elaeagnus, or Rosa multiflora. Different plants become invasive in different situations, and I tolerate some of those that don't go too ballistic here. That includes Albizia julibrissin, Acer campestre, Acer ginnala (although I'm having second thoughts), Viburnum xrhytidophylloides, and Koelreuteria paniculata. And I don't have the stomach to whack my old Kalopanax, which probably is the finest one in the state -- I just keep attacking the seedlings.

Guy S.

Hummmmmm.....I think I might have a solution for you...Come down here and get you some of our DEAD red dirt...seems like not much wants to grow in it. And some of my green pond water.
I have had 2 burning bushes for 8 years now....never get babies.
Water Hyacinth...have tried it and water lettus for 4 years now...dies within a week. My mother was bringing me garbage bags full of it weekly...and I keep killing it. Same with water lettus. It just will not grow.
Moon vines... I have to Plant them in pots because they refuse to grow in this soil...same with the Mimosas I plant...they die, unless I plant them in pots.
Maybe I should not be a gardener...maybe I should stick to yard art..lol
Thanks so much for the PEP talk folks!! I really needed it!!!
I will try to do a search on seeds and plants before I list any more or at least check out threads with info on them and see if anyone has Red Flagged them before I list them.
Thanks again!!

Yes Dear, I planted Garlic Mustard. So did all of us. She had so much of it she shared with all of her friends. We now laugh about it but it wasn't too funny back a few years after it happened when we all figured out what it was. Now about that nickname... Shhhh... personal friends and family only because I have low self esteem ya know!

Say Blackwolf- Here's what works for me these days. First off, if I can't identify a plant, I send off photos to friends to get their take on what they think it is. If they can't identify it, I post an image here and more times than not, somebody can identify it. I also steer clear of common names. In other words instead of searching the Internet for Morning Glory, I look up Morning Glory and find one or two botanical names which would be Ipomoea violacea & Turbina corymbosa. From there I take the words Ipomoea violacea and put that in a search engine (Google or Yahoo) and add the word noxious. Generally that will bring up if the plant is on any noxious weed lists. If nothing shows up for noxious, I then type the botanical name into the search engine and the word invasive to see what comes up.

This particular example is noxious and if you scroll down at this site-
http://plants.usda.gov/cgi_bin/topics.cgi?earl=plant_profile.cgi&symbol=IPVI
You will find this information-
Noxious Weed Information:
Ipomoea violacea L.
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The related entities italicized and indented below are listed by the U. S. federal government or a state. Common names are from state and federal lists. Click on a place name to get a complete noxious weed list for that location.
Arizona:
Ipomoea L.
morning glory Prohibited noxious weed
Arkansas:
Ipomoea L.
morning glory Noxious weed

And you will also find this information-
Invasive Information:
Ipomoea violacea L.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ipomoea L.
morning glory

The related entity italicized and indented above is considered invasive by the authoritative sources noted below. This plant may be known by one or more common names in different places, and some are listed above. Click on an acronym to view each invasive plant list, or click here for a composite list of Invasive Plants of the U.S.
STATE Assorted authors. 200_. State Noxious Weed Lists for 45 States. State agriculture or natural resource departments.

When I started volunteering in the community controlling noxious and invasive species, this is how they taught me to check plants. Only a percentage of a percentage of all species make the Federal noxious weed list. As far as invasive lists, we're still only dealing with probably 1% of all plants would be my best guess. What never ceases to amaze me is that it always seems as if the most desirable plants are on the lists for noxious or invasive. Seems as if WalMarts, Home Depots, and other big box stores always seem to get the firesale plants that the nursery industry wants to unload. I try to steer clear of them now but mistakes do get made and the lists are incomplete at best so best. Common names are also a problem as 10 different plants can have the same common name. Best to rely on other gardeners (check the PlantFiles here) and find yourself a few quality local nurseries where they have staff that can help you make selections that you are comfortable with.

By they way, I'll take your red dirt and raise you with clay. My clay is so wonderful that I could probably be a potters haven here and they'd have an endless supply to make all kinds of nice vases and such. Container gardening can be the way to go. Either that or amend the soil.