looking into goats

has anyone heard of or had experience with Kiko goats? i hear they are very lean & good mothers. can't find anything on them, would like a source

pls 4give my typing, had hand surgery

thanks, tamarafaye

I had Boer goats for 4 years and before I had to sell the herd last year was going to get a Kiko buck and a couple does to compare them with the Boer. I had problems with foot scald and worm infestation with the Boers due to 2 years of record breaking wetness in my area so wanted to see how the Kiko's would handle the same conditions since they are supposedly more adapted to wet, humid conditions. Anywho, I never got a chance to get the Kiko's so really can't tell you anything about the breed in particular. Boer should do well in TX, not sure about Kiko, though it seems I read an article where a breeder in TX changed from Kiko to Boer because they kept sore feet from his dry, rocky ground...just what Boer's like :~) You can see pics of the goats I had here
http://community.webshots.com/user/wvdaisy

And here is a Kiko breeder I had saved in my favs. I know I had more but think I deleted them.
http://www.mountainmeatgoats.com/standard0902.html

Good luck,
Lana

thanks. our ground is nice & flat with prairie grass... when its wet here, its REALLY WET, but when its dry, its a drought!

i really got lost on those links, esp the dog adoption site! your goats are lovely!

I don't know anything about the Kiko breed. But, I do have goats and enjoy talking about them.

thanks. i never had one. when i was young, some friends house we frequented had goats, think they were dairy. remember getting to see twins born, will never forget them, Curly & Moose!

TamaraFaye,
In the days before the Flea Market , they had trading day where we lived in South Carolina. It was like on the first Tuesday of each month from March thru November they would have Trading Day. Grandpa (mom's dad) went and brought us a kid goat. We were thrilled with that little goat. It grew as we grew and we would play with it like we would a dog...get down and butt heards, wrestle with it etc. Time came for us to move to the city(animals were not allowed) and we could not take the goat, which had grown, with us. So, my uncle and a friend came to get the goat; his friend was taking it to the country. They were in a two door Chevy of all things. They would put the goat in one side into the back seat and the goat would go out the other side. This was real entertainment for us kids. It was better that anything we had ever seen(This was before TV) -- reminded me of one of those old movies from the 30s. lol The funny thing that strikes me now is that the goat was smarter than the two adults; it took them a while to figure outsmarting the goat! That is a great memory from my childhood I cherish.
Gary/Louisville

Thanks tamarafaye, I really miss my goats. I work with Anatolian Shepherd rescue. We get a lot of dogs into rescue in TX probably due to there being so many goat breeders in TX and a lot of them breed their livestock guard dogs, then can't find enough guardian homes for them to go to and people adopt them who have no clue how to deal with them or what they'll have to put up with like the blowing of the coat which is quite fun to vacuum :~) Or the barking which is a guardians first line of defense but tell that to the neighbors if you have one of these dogs in the city! They are great dogs but you have to understand them because they are not like other breeds people keep as pets.

My hubby got my digital camera for Valentines about 4 years ago and he couldn't have gotten me a better present. I have soooo many pics of goats that I've had to download to discs to clear up room on my puter. I have pics of does kidding from start to finish, I love grossing out my nieces and nephews with these. Their friends are easier to gross out because most of my family have been exposed to kidding by now. The first year I had goats my nephew was out in the pasture and started yelling that one of the does was having babies, I didn't believe him because I had just turned her out of the shed and didn't think she was in labor so I took my time getting back over there from the house. When I did she had already had one kid. My nephew chased her around the pasture while she had the kids head hanging out until she finally had to stop to give birth! He said he caught it but then dropped it on the ground because it was gross! LOL he was about 9 at the time. My poor camera has been dropped in manure, has had birthing fluid dripped on it and many other yucky barn stuff :~)

Tamara, as long as you don't overgraze and your grass stays tall enough that they browse instead of graze you shouldn't have a worm problem. A good place to learn about goats is http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles.htm I learned A LOT from this site. She also has a couple yahoogroups one of them is here http://groups.yahoo.com/group/chevontalk/ Another great place to learn and ask questions. Suzanne Gasparotto knows what she's talking about. Also, on Fridays people post goats and farm supplies/equip, etc for sale so you may be able to find Kiko's that way. They have some Kiko yahoogroups which I had joined. I'll look for them later and post them for you, too tired to do it tonight/this morning.

Gary, enjoyed the goat story. Mine kept me on my toes here. Sometimes it's hard to be smarter than the livestock LOL!

Lana

thanks Lana, will look into it as soon as possible. after i get some help with the fencing & a shed, as well as running water, then by next year we hope to get some calfs & goats, choickens & guineas.

nice story Gary :-)

here are some nice pics of kikos...
http://www.ansi.okstate.edu/breeds/goats/

after goig to the site, click on "K", then kiko

Does anyone have a goat for milk ? I am wondering if that's a good thing for us, we have recently moved out in the country and want to grow as many veggies, eggs and berries as we can to suppliment our grocery budget. I have no experience with goates and have a lot to learn before I make that decision. We have chickens for eggs, and a great garden, and the FRESH foods are wonderful. Our neighbors behind us have a whole heard of goates and they seem kinda fun, but I'm not sure of how hard they are to keep and milk. Does goat milk taste like cow's ?

Peggie K

PeggieK...
We used to have Nubian goats, strictly for milk and cheese. Loved 'em!

However, if your neighbor has goats I bet you could get milk from them. Otherwise, with your own goats, you're gonna have to milk them twice a day. (How I often wanted to take a day off but couldn't.) (It was easy to get someone to come feed the dogs but very hard to get someone to milk your goats for ya!)

Very good point Horseshoe. We just moved out here to the country not very long ago. As I'm getting more things that I've always wanted, chickens, veggie garden, etc. etc.. I'm beginning to find out that my life is more confined to home by my responsibilities. Everything from making sure the chickens are fed and watered, to making sure the garden dosen't burn up (gets watered) and the veggies all get harvested and put up at the appropriate time so they don't go to waste. I guess a goat to milk would certainly be a biggie on the list.
Now I'm learning that farm life is not as easy as it looks, but it's a very very good life, and I wouldn't trade it back for the city life I grew up in. But I must be careful to take it in small steps.............lest I bite off more than I can handle. We hope to learn enough about living a semi self-sufficient lifestyle that we can retire and enjoy it all someday in the future.
My husband is just now studying and learning about blueberries. He wants to grow them to sell for extra income after we retire. Trying to think of all the ways we can to make it comfortably after retirement, looks pretty frightening for retirees in the future.

We hope to learn enough about gardening to sell some of our produce, and the blueberries, and any other ideas we can come up with.

I'm so thankful for all of my friends here on DG for all the wonderful info and ideas that help us to learn these important things. Gives me great encouragement to keep on plugging away at it.

Living and learning. and loving it, ....................PeggieK

PeggieK,

Horseshoe is absolutely right about milk goats being confining. I had Nubians too and at the time I sold my herd I was milking 8 does twice a day, feeding and caring for 21 kids, 2 herd sires, and assorted wethers and dry yearlings. It was a lot of work! You really do have a tough time going any place. It's sorta like owning a B & B in that it keeps you pretty much at home most of the time.

On the upside though, it was wonderful! I loved milking. It was one of the most relaxing chores I've ever done. And, as a bonus, it completely cured the arthritis pain in my hand...hehehe. The milk is delicious. Each of the dairy breeds has slightly different milk in terms of quantity and butterfat content etc. so you'll want to research the breeds before you make a decision, if you do decide to keep goats.

We made butter and cheese and whipped cream and just about anything you can think of. Some folks make soaps and lotions and things like that from the milk. You can also feed it to your other animals. Just be sure you don't put it out where the skunks can get it (they love it!!). We drank nothing but goat milk during the time we had them. The thing about goat milk is that (like any milk) it must be kept absolutely clean and be processed immediately after milking so you won't have any off flavor. Folks who have tasted bad goat milk will swear that it is just awful. They usually have experienced either milk that wasn't properly handled or milk from goats that weren't healthy and properly cared for. You shouldn't be able to detect much difference at all between cow and goat milk, except of course, the difference that can be detected between unpasturized and pasturized commercial milk. That's something else you would have to decide; Whether to use the milk raw or pasturize it yourself (an easy thing to do). As you probably already know, their milk is very easily digested so it can be used by even those who are allergic to cow milk.

Goats are such charming animals that it's easy to forgive them all the stuff you have to go through to keep them well. I still miss my goats and swear that they are the most underrated of all the farm animals.

I have goats, as pets only.. Can't imagine not having a few around..They are so entertaining and fun.. Remember, they are great escape artists..They love plants and will not clean up your grass, everything but, lol..

Larkie

Love goats milk and cheese, makes good soap from Goats milk also.
Had a goat that used to go places with us. Kids loved him. He kept DHs ashtray clean. LOL
Son used to raise pigmy goats they were a hoot. Love the goats and love farming and miss it.

Good article from NewFarm.org (Rodale) in the Sept. 15 newsletter.
http://www.newfarm.org/features/2005/0905/patchesofstar/kimbleevans.shtml

Since goates are herd animals, I guess it would be wrong to have just one for milking? She might be too lonely. PeggieK

Hello! everyone
I have 2 pygmy goats and i just love them. They are like dogs, they follow me everywhere. I put collars on them and put them on those swinging dog leads and put a 50 ft lead and put them in very weedy places and in a day or so weeds all gone! Then when i clean their pens i use their waste for fertilizer. After letting it age. They are cheap to keep, but i warn you they are escape artists. Build your pens high they can jump!
George

Good Morning All -

I am new to farming and to the goat world. Gary and I just celebrated our first anniversary here in Monaville, TX.

Now, as far as goats, I am new to those as well. As the long-term farmers above have noted, there are pluses and minuses with goats. I think the thing that has kept me moving very slowly with goats is the health issues. It did not take me long to learn how quickly one can get sick and die even when being vigilant. I would not trade the few I have, however.

One of my bottle raised goats, Bella, has given me so much pleasure. She is a riot to watch; she absolutely loves to play and climb on everything; she takes walks with me and the dogs most mornings, and interestingly enough, does not interact with my other goats. She would rather be alone or around people.

Sharvis, I agree with you about the goat being underrated. Recently, I went to a goat and sheep auction in Hamilton, Texas. There I met some goat ranchers who had been with goats for eons. What I so enjoyed was their unspoken reverence for the goat and their willingness to offer their wisdom.

Time to go and feed. Hot here so must get out before sun is too high.

Melissa

Yes Peggy, keeping just one goat can be a terrible problem. She will suffer from lack of company, or she will make you her herdmate and bawl (maaaaaa!!) like crazy whenever you leave her. Besides, in order to keep her giving lots of milk, she will have to be freshened occasionally (some does can go a long time between freshenings) and you'll end up with babies, after all. You can either sell them or give them away or......I won't go into it cause it's just too sad. 8=[

George is right about them being escape artists. We had woven wire fencing around the pasture and once one of them figured out how to lift it up with her head and scoot underneath, she taught all the others. I'd come out and watch a whole long line of goats doing the Marine Corp crawl under the fence LOL. I also had a buck that could climb like a mountain goat so you'll have to pay particular attention to whatever you use to contain them. THEY ARE VERY VERY SMART!

Melissa is also correct that they (like any farm animal) can suffer from a variety of health issues. Feet can be a problem, particularly if they are kept on wet and/or soft ground and if you don't keep up with the trimming. Milkers need to be watched carefully for mastitis. What goats eat is crucial and will differ depending upon what you are using them for (i.e. milk, meat, pets, show or whatever). The myth is that goats will eat anything. Actually, they may taste or smell anything, especially if you're carrying it around in your pocket LOL, but they are very particular about cleanliness and won't drink water if it has droppings floating in it or if it is soiled in any way. When we showed goats we had to take water from home because they didn't like the water in the county of the fair. One of my bucks was so picky that if the donkey licked a piece of carrot and I tried to then to give it to him, he would refuse to eat it. We always said it was because he smelled Fanny spit on it. Fanny was our donkey and that's a true story. Pens have to be kept clean or they may get sick. It's essential to start with healthy stock and it's wise to keep close eye on them and tend immediately to any problems you notice. Learn as much as you can about them before you invest your time and money, not to mention your emotions cause keeping livestock can be heartbreaking. Just ask any farmer.

I recently purchaed an excelletn book for less than 10 bucks, with shipping. The Herbal Handbook or something like that. Talks about preventing disease in livestock, and what to do when they get sick. Don't have livestock yet, but wouldn't sell that book for $100!

got to start slow with guinease anc hcickens, then goats are next on the list. going with Kiko or a kiko cross. they have virtually no foot problems and are excellent mothers. They are meat goats. that all spells a little less work for me!

tf

Hello! everyone
I just had to share my pics.

Hello! Again
now for my feathered friends

That's really a mixed bag, LOL.

That aint half of it! Feeding time is almost overwhelming in person! Neal.

nice to see chickens and goats together. i have a friend who thinks she needs to keep all of her animals separte. I am looking forward to having an integrated farming system, sorta like permaculture.

thanks for the pics willy!

Neal, when i was in school, mcuh of my "spare time" was spent feeding horses. My kids are really asking for more chores everytime they tell me how much they want more guineas and some chickens!

We have two guineas which are 2 1/2 weeks old. Theya re in a cage up off the ground. We hand feed them each a couple dozen grasshoppers each day! In addtion to their start & grow.

As soon as I have a pen, we will get some more fowl. Maybe peacocks need to go on the list, how are they with predators???

My MIL and I hand raised 3 pygmy goats, George, Rosie, and Daisy . They thought we were family and that they were chickens not goats. We let them out of the pasture in the fall to eat the acorns off the drive during the day, well one day we came back from town in my Lumina car and proceded to carry in grocerys,no goats in site, leaving the 4 doors open. Mistake, when we came back out for another load we had goats in the car with the last of teh grocerys, we'd grab one and haul it out and close the door it would run as fast as it could to another open door and jump back in. 3 goats and 2 adults and the goats won... I sure miss them and the twins they had every year. Has anyone ever had the Fainting goats? Those look amusing...Lauri

cute story. i have read about the fainting goats. when i find that link, i'll post it here...

When I bought my 3 acres some 14 years ago, a good 2 acres of it was grown up in brush and blackberry brambles. Off to Lowe's and the animal auction for fencing and goats! It was a mixed bag of mixed goats that I wound up with; Nigerians, toggenburg, alpine, pygmy, Nubian, 4 fainting goats (the only ones with papers) and a few that might have been anything. Of these, only one was a fine looking and friendly pygmy buck. He thought he'd been brought into heaven early! It was no time at all that they cleared the property, and I needed to cut back from about 25 to 10 or so.
While several of the bigger breeds had foot problems, I noticed none of the small breeds did. The big ones were also MUCH harder to handle, weighing 100 pounds and up. So off went the big ones, including the love of the bucks life, a huge rangy black and white mix of many sorts. He couldn't breed her since he was 1/4 her size, but he tried oh how he tried!! she'd just turn and look at him in an amused fashion and walk away, him chasing after her on his hind legs! Funny!
A guy with a miniature horse asked if I'd trade four of my big goats for it, and I jumped at the chance! He got on well with the goats, until one day he decided to chase the fainters around for some reason. I heard them yelling, and got out in time to see one stiffen and fall as they do, and saw the horse stop and paw at it, wanting it to get up and run some more. Apparently he hurt it's backbone doing it, and the poor thing had to be put down. I sold the little horse, and stuck with the goats. But the fainters were also having a bad time at the feed trough. The "boss" girls (one or more in every group) would pick on them, and they'd faint rather than get out of the way, at which point the others would beat beat them up, further scaring them which kept them down! I sold them for their own good, poor things!
I ended up with just a few of the smallest, but through a divorce and an unusual and foolish agreement on my part, I was away for about 4 years. When I returned, the goats had been sold, and the house fields and flower beds were a mess again. I rented the place while I got the property in repair, and when the renters moved, we (I'd remarried) moved in and I had a choice of breeds to start with. What? Registered something this time, so I didn't worry about people buying them to eat... I like them to well for that! Big ones are harder to handle, and seemed to have more foot trouble, and need more room than small ones. Fainters have a hard time, and not a big market. Pygmies have been bred so cobby, they have kidding problems.
So I now have Nigerian dwarf milk goats, and just love them! Up to four kids at a time so far, tiny cuties!! Full grown they are less than knee high, and while I don't milk them, they are known for giving quantities of extremely good milk! They don't dig, bark, bite, or scratch, and I could pick up an adult if I really needed to. And I love the multi colors and patterns, the wilder the better! Blue eyes too! They sell well to good homes at $75 to $250 each (depends on lots of things) and would go much higher if I wanted to fool with the shows, but I'm a homebody.
I love milk, and to me a great comparison is 1/2 &1/2 compared to regular pasteurized cows milk. It's heavier bodied, richer, and seems to get colder, and stay that way longer. But I'd rather let the babies do the milking!
Good luck with whatever you eventually decide on; they are great critters!!

Here is a pic of my oldest girl and her four kids. For size reference, I'm sitting Indian style, and a gold hen, twice the size of the new kids, is in the background.

now that is too precious for words!

we have many predators here, and i have learned to take one thing at a time. so first, poultry, then garden (esp herbs), then goats.

Now you have given me another breed to consider!

tf

Oh, those are so cute. What size pen would be big enough for 2 of the small goats? If one provided milk, I would have to think of a way to get her milked when we went out of town. But I'm thinking, if she were small enough to handle, I could board her at the vet's office and they would make sure she got milked in our absence. We don't go much, but you never know, we might get the opportunity once or twice a year.

Would love to have the milk. I guess what we would save at the store buying milk, would more than pay for the once-in-a-while boarding cost.
We use a gallon every couple days @ approx. $2.89 a gal. That dosen't include the cheese and butter we buy too. I'd like to get a couple of the smallest breed I could find.

With good grain twice a day, (goat chow and sweet feed mix here) and hay (alfalfa/bahia mix, or peanut hay) available at all times, and shelter of course (goats have heard of acid rain it seems, and run like crazy at a few big drops!) I could see two adult does being happy enough in a 12x12 area, especially if they have something to jump on and off of. Thats about the size of a small bedroom. The bigger the better, less worms, and as mentioned earlier, they need to be freshened (have a kid ) now and then to keep up the milk supply; the above wouldn't support a whole goat family, and you would NOT want to keep a buck in with them!
Thats a neat idea about the boarding thing.

Yeah, I don't think I'd want a buck at all. I think maybe just one that gives milk and the other just to keep company. When it's time for freshening maybe we could just breed her in exchange for the baby.
My DD works for a vet and they board dogs, cats, and every other kind of
pet people might have. Surely they would board a couple of sweet little
goats. I'd even let them keep the milk they get while I';m gone LOL.

So you think about 150 sq. ft is plenty for two ? That makes it manageable enough I'd think.

Do you know of any breeders in NE Okla or near ?

As long as the other criteria was met, the space would do. I wouldn't call it Plenty, but it would do well enough. Look up Nigerian Dwarf Goat registries; most have a list of breeders in each state. You can also look them up online in web pages, but most of those are for champion show stock, and start at 400.00 each. Those that don't show don't usually demand such high prices. Good luck!

last year a friend of mine sold all of her Nigerian goats, $15 for the babies, $35 for the adults. i just couldn't take any at the time. some lady came and bought them ALL [about 35!]

Wow, what a deal.

Hi Everyone, I'm new and loved reading everyone's posts. I may breed our nubian mix with a pygmy goat this fall...He's big for his breed and her mix makes her shorter than a purebread nubian. So we're thinking this might work. But after hearing how pygmy's can have problems birthing, I'm not sure if I want that in the gene pool. However, the idea was that my neighbor who has the pygmies said their butterfat content is higher than many goats. That would be good for making homemade cheese, right? Tell me what you think.

The pygmy's have problems with birthing because they are bred to a bigger buck. In most cases anyway. If you're breeding a pygmy buck to a nubian doe there won't be a problem with kidding that's caused by that breed cross. You can't breed a nubian buck to a pygmy doe as you're liable to kill the doe with a too big kid. I've not used a pygmy for milk so can't comment on that.

Lana

I have been away from goats so long, it is amazing how much I do not know. We lived in Nova Scotia for four years. We bought two does, Nubian and Alpine mix, and one of them was a horned, sterile doe. She was very aggressive and disagreeable. The other was a sweetheart. I loved her. Now you must understand, both of these goats weighed almost as much as I did, so it could be difficult sometimes.
Cleo (the sweetheart) refused to breed with the purebred Nubian buck that we drove fifty miles to breed her to. She spent three days running around the field, avoiding him. She fell head over heels for a small scrub goat named "Sir Charles"! LOL! Go figure.
Anyway, she threw two kids, and gave milk. I entered baked goods into the county fair against women who had been baking bread, etc, all their lives. I won ribbons, and I attribute it to the rich naturall goats milk. The cream stays mixed throughout the milk. It never rises to the top like cow's milk does. Therefore, I am curious to know how one would make butter from it? I did make farmers cheese. She gave quite a lot of milk for one goat. Baked goods turned out so much richer, and better textured with her milk.
Sorry to interrupt, but I would have a goat again in a heartbeat. They are wonderful. BAM