Growing Under Lights...

I'm sowing my seeds under florescent grow lights, not heated, but more to mimic the sun. My light runs east to west, my 5 trays all of equal length and size, run north to south. What do I do, if my outer cells of tomatoes, start to bend and try to reach for the light(Sun), even if I rotate them, I'm still at the same dimensions when I started. Is this bad, and can it be correceted? I read to put some cardboard lined with tin-foil, around the outskirts to redirect the light back onto the plants? What's your thoughts, Danny
ps, The title should read, Growing Under Lights, dang technology, where did the good ole' pen and paper go?
This message was edited Mar 19, 2004 10:05 AM

This message was edited Mar 19, 2004 10:13 AM

I'm trying to understand why you are crowding the seedlings? The outer plants will always strain to the light but I don't think you should force them to share the light. My peppers are under a gro-lite that is the same size as the tray with the light 3'' above them. The tray is 11" by 20" and so are the lights that cover a tray of 72 seedlings. For me that is more than enough.

I'm not crowding them, that's the way the flats come. I just have them side by side, they're all of equal lenth and width. I can fit 5 flats comfortably, and that's the amount I have. My light is 4 ft long, but only 7 inches wide, maybe that's not enough, but that's how the starter kit came. Thanx, TPlant.

I use 4 bulbs over the flats. One unit isn't enough. That means two 4 foot units to cover 2 trays. I did the thing with just one fixture for a couple of seasons and finally went and bought enough to double them over all of my trays...works much better.

You're right Melody. I have one over 2 trays and it isn't quite enough. I need to rig one more. I'll be so glad when it gets warmer and I can use the daylight instead of depending on these stupid artificials. But... when you want early plants.................

E_B

i have six four foot shop lights each with two grow lights. it has always been enough for my seeds but then again, i never had that many plants growning at once. why don't you just buy more lights?

I will. I'm going to Lowe's, K-Mart, Wal*Mart, etc., tomorrow and see how much they're on sale for. Sometimes I can get them cheaper there than I can the electrical supply, wholesale.

I'll give y'all a tip: Take the wide aluminum foil and use some spray glue and turn the light up with the tubes out and spray the whole cover of the fixture. Glue the DINGY SIDE of the foil wrap to the cover and let it set up. When it's set (dry) put the tubes back in. The shiny side of the foil will be toward the tubes, hence toward your plants, when you reset it. Just let it drape to where it will cover the trays and you will have more light than you ever knew you could have. I did that last year and it worked great. Not one plant legged out. The mirror effect magnifies the effect and plants stay where they belong until you're ready to transplant them.

As soon as I get more lights, I'm going to do my setup correctly. Right now I just have them propped up on the ends and no foil. But I'll fix THAT! ;o)

i bought my fixtures at home depot for 4 dollars each. they work great

Home Depot is 70 miles from here. Lowe's is 1. I'll see what Lowe's price is and if I'm gonna buy enough, it might just pay me to drive there, but I dioubt it. They;re usually within a few dollars or a few cents of each other.

Thanks for the tip.

Were the tubes with them?

E_B

This message was edited Mar 20, 2004 9:46 AM

I also start seedlings under grow lights. DH set up a bench for me to work on. We purchase our lights at Wall-Mart. The light covers about 3/4's of the bench area, but I also have seedlings that reach for the light.....so I rotate the boxes every couple of days. Am going to buy another light unit to cover more area. I use the APS Starter Kit and germinating mix...purchased from Gardner's Supply Company. Have been starting seedlings, successfully, this way for a few years now.
(http://www.gardeners.com/department.asp?DeptPGID=18248&lstCategory=0&RecGroupNum=2)

Thanks to Mr. Electric_Bob for the tip on using aluminum foil. Really good, useful tip!!

HDD,

You're very welcome. If you do that, your plants will not reach, they will grow straight up, like mine are doing right now with only one 2-tube light over two 11" x 21" trays.

BTW, you may want to look at these. They have 72 cells instead of just 40. I just bought 15 of them and they're re-usable.
http://www.stokeseeds.com/cgi-bin/StokesSeeds.storefront/405c5afa00d1586c2742cf366ce306b7/Product/View/A050 and http://www.stokeseeds.com/cgi-bin/StokesSeeds.storefront/405c5afa00d1586c2742cf366ce306b7/Product/View/PR221

I ordered them Thursday and they will be here... MONDAY. Those Stokes people are FAST. Hope this helps.


This message was edited Mar 20, 2004 10:06 AM

I use 4 foot four lamp lights with half the lamps being cool white the others warm white. For starting you really only need the cool lamps but when you mix those with the warm lamps you add light from the red spectrum which approximates the wave length of the lamps sold as plant grow lights.

I also use 400 watt and 1000 watt metal halide hid lights which work way better than flourscent but for most things on a small scale flourscent will do fine.

Electric Bob have you used a light meter to determine how much extra light you get with the foil? Do you try to keep the surface smooth? My new super sun grow light has a pebbled surface that the bumps are raised on supposedly sending the light down at angles. Just wondered. Ernie

Weed,

No I don't try to keep the foil smooth. The light is better dispersed if it's wrinkled but it cuts down on the strength of the rays, sorta like the B1 Bomber does with radar. The dispersion makes it more even, but weaker. Sooooo... I don't make an effort to do so but I don't cry about it if my foil gets wrinkles, as I do my poor body! LOLOLOL

No, I don't use the light meter. It has lain in the closet for years. Unless something were to go awry, I see no reason to check for anything. The "one cool white and one daylight theory was proved to me years ago and I have no problems with my plants "reaching for the sky" and, AMOF, when I put the lights on the little 3" suckers, they just stood up straight and quit stretching. Now they're working on developing those roots and second leaves.

When you're saying "supposedly sending the light out at angles," this IS dispersion and if you ever saw a 4-tube drop-in ceiling fluorescent without its lens, and then with it, you will see the effect you get and the better light with the crinkled lens, without adding more wattage. The lens evens the light more thereby making it more efficient, not necessarily more "radiant."

I'm using the 4' 2-tube fixtures, myself, right now, although I still have the 8' ones in the shop and will use them for GP lights. I found that with the foil, I don't need all that light concentration, I can diversify and handle things better. You don't NEED a whole building to start seed. You only need a place to keep them until they're sold, after transplanting to the 6-packs and 4" pots.

I would NEVER USE THE 400 AND 1000 WATT halide lamps. Those babies eat up more electricity than a clothes dryer, and THAT'S going some! Never trick me! I have a 500W one and when it's turned on I can see the meter take off.

Unless you have a huge commercial setup, you're wasting your money. Most greenhouses all use fluorescents, here and bottom heat.

As long as I have no problems with this setup, I will stick with it. Go for what works for you, but don't hesitate to try something different. He who hesitates has lost the moment.

The magic word is green house mine is not a true green house even though I call it one.One wall is solid as it is built off the wall of my shop. The roof is about 25 percent sheeted and shingled cutting much direct light out as do the 2x10 rafters and 2x6 studs.

The light stand I start seeds on has heat mats and the lamp light is directed by diffusers the cube type that you see in a lot of offices. I need the hid lights to grow what I have started lots of gray overcast days in Washington . I don't have a commerical operation but do have a lot of flowers and by the time I am done I will have around 100 flats of four inch pots to transplant. Just cant do that with out hid I tried and got poor plants.

I can afford a little electricty for what I get it's cheaper than building a stand alone gh that I would still have to heat as it is heat cost about 25 bucks for all winter so far.

Yep your right always do what works for you different zones make a difference and do try different things well I guess its time to check my carrot crop and plant some peppers Ernie

electric _bob - no, i bought the lamps separately. i think they coast more then the fixtures

Here is my setup for tomato plants. It only shows one bank of lights with two double florescent shop lights. I have two banks set up like this in my 'pantry'. Planting in individual pots like I do, I can get six dozen plants under each bank. Wish I had more room!

Big Red, that's sweet, but I don't have the room, wish I did. I see you start more than or have more than one plant per container. That's ok, and what about moisture and watering, are there holes for drainage in those, or do you do something else? I would love some advise, because your plants look healthy and stocky, that's the way to go. Thanx, Danny

Danny, I usually start 3 seeds per container. I plant them in a moist growing medium then cover them with Saran wrap, put them a dark, warm spot until they sprout, then remove the wrap and put them under lights. By planting in individual pots I don't have to transplant until they're ready for the garden. Thin to one plant, the strongest, after they start their true leaves and show some growth.

I put 3 holes for drainage in the bottom of each cup. I'm a coffee drinker and save the cups for seed starting.

Unfortunately, there is no Dunkin Dougnuts in this area so I guess next year I'll have to by them because I don't like styrofoam cups, just paper. :o(

big_red - you could always try those paper cups used by water fountains.

Herbie43, I'll have to try those. BTW, I didn't get these cups at Dunkin Doughnuts, but rather Green Mountain Coffee, a coffee that is popular in NH & VT at most convenient stores. Just sold in that area I believe.

bump!!!!

I'm passing on a few observations on seedling containers.

I used to buy cheap generic cups from discount stores and drill the holes in them. Even though I'm a cheap Midwest Scandanavian type, I finally broke down and bought commercial trays and tray liners in various sizes and depths. I consider it one of our best gardening investments. My wife and I grow about 1000 plants under grow lights for setting out in the spring. The compact trays and their stability really paid off for us.

Agreed all those different size containers drove me crazy I went to mostly standard 4 inch pots and 1020 standard trays eaiser to light , water , look at, and move about especially when hardening them off. Ernie