fothergilla

Does anyone know why fothergilla is not grown in the South? There may be a few who grow it, but it is never offered by our vendors.

It is probably a poorer performer in the heat of the Deep South, and it certainly doesn't prefer extended drought periods.

It performs pretty well along the lines of Arkansas, Tennessee, North Carolina, and further north. Probably does OK in Georgia too.

Upon further review, it is a Coastal Plain native - which likely means acid sandy soils with plenty of moisture whether south or north. Texas probably doesn't have as much of that to offer.

Thanks, VV. Ive wanted one for a while but thought that the fact it is never offered meant it would not grow here. I have pretty good soil because I make compost and mulch the beds regularly with leaves. It is not very sandy here but I suppose I could amend the beds for more sand. My soil is neutral but prob on the acid side of neutral a bit. Whatever type of environment you can name, it is probably to be found somewhere in Texas. WIe've got mountains and prairies, beaches and piney woods, limestone outcroppings and swampy bayous. I am not able to grow any plants that like alkaline soil but in the central part of the state, that would be their forte.
Thanks for your reply.

They're not readily available up here, but you can find them here and there. I mostly see 'Mt Airy', but I did run across 'Blue Mist' at a small nursery in MN a few weeks ago. I planted three Mt Airy last spring in a woodland setting, which seem to be doing fine. Very little growth, but they look healthy and the deer leave them alone, which is very beneficial. Hopefully they're just taking their time getting established. Last summer was exceptionally dry and this summer was also quite dry. I'm guessing this has had something to do with the slow development. Mmm, maybe they're not getting enough sun... I've babied them a bit their first two seasons, but this will be coming to an end. Sort of like the parent having to kick their 30 year old "kid" out of the house.

I had five fothergilla gardenii in my old yard which had clay, high ph soil (whwn they were planted, the ph was 7.9). I added lots of compost and would spray them with ironite three times a year - spring, mid-summer and early fall. They were in an area that got morning sun and afternoon shade. They thrived, so Pseudo hang in there. Did very well in the drought year.

The ones in the first photo had been in for 12 years. Taken in May when blooming. On gardenii the growth stays small. They do tend to sucker. I lost one and the others replaced it.

The second picture shows the fall color. It varies from red to orange to yellow.

The third picture was taken in November.

Flowers are smashing. And fragrant.

Pseudo, thanks for the info about their not being very available there either. I guess it's just not "popular". Hope yours continue to do well.



Donna, do you still have access to your "old house". If so could I get 2-3 cuttings of the gardenii? If so D mail me and we can talk "terms".

I wish I did, steadaycam3. I took some smaller shrubs and roses, but didn't think to take cuttings of the fothergilla (such a dummy!)

Oh, I'll hang in there with them. Well, until they start asking for beer money. They're only getting 2-3 hours of indirect sun, so maybe they're trying to tell me something.

They do need more light than that for good fall color. They aren't available at any nursery near my. Everyone has moved on to Mt. Airy, which is too big and which seems to have inferior fall color. The only supplier I can find is Forest Farm, which has five gallons. Kind of pricey, though. I might have sprung for them but I have five (or is it six?) viburnums coming from the VIBURNUM DUDE, Gary Ladman of Classic Viburnums in spring. One of them is in a five gallon container, and the rest are two gallons. I also have a bunch of roses coming. I've been very bad this fall with grasses and roses and peonies. But a gal's gotta have her planst at her new home!

Yeah, I saw the only one they had was $99 and did not include shipping.

OK guys, you need to get your glasses adjusted.
A quick perusal of my 'favorite nurseries' tab reveals f. gardenii or it's cultivars listed at the following nurseries. I'm sure this isn't an exhaustive list, but it shows that it's quite readily available in the trade.
Big Dipper has it for $10.99
Camellia Forest has a dwarf cultivar for $25.00
Fairweather Farms lists 3 cultivars of f. gardenii (all sold out this year).
Girard's has 2 cultivars of f. gardenii listed.
Gossler Farms has 3 cultivars listed.
Greer Gardens has 2 cultivars listed.
Hoot Owl nursery has a f. gardenii cultivar listed I've never heard of, Red Licorice
(reportedly named for it's fine red fall color) in a 3gallon size for $35.
Klehm's nursery has one cultivar listed.
Lazy S has f. gardenii species as well as another hybrid
Mason Hollow has 3 f. gardenii species listed.
Niche Gardens has one f. gardenii hybrid listed.
RareFind nursery lists 3 f. gardenii cultivars and 3 hybrids.
So looks like you can get one, if you really want one...

Some of the nurseries you have listed have failed me in the past, sending me incorrect cultivars (Greer, for example, sent me a 'Cotinus Velvet Cloak' instead of a Cotinus 'Grace' and they are one of them - there are others). And I have used nursery listings that, when I get to the actual nursery, find that it was listed at one time but is not available (happens quite often). And some are so overpriced I don't use them (Klehm, Lazy S.).

All nurseries that list a plant do not necessarily have it, ship a quality product at a reasonable price, or ship what they claim to have.

My glasses are fine. I did find one. And I found one from a supplier I respect and trust, that being Forest Farm, because I have worked with them many times. I prefer not to risk throwing money to the wind by dealing with unknown nurseries. And, by the way, there is no need to be so condescending. You are very knowledgeable, but you could use a better tone in some of your correspondence. There is no need to imply that we are either lazy or stupid, which is exactly what you did.



This message was edited Sep 29, 2013 8:00 AM

I agree with Wee - Fothergilla gardenii and its multiple/several variations have been readily available for decades. It is not as ubiquitous as Burning Bush or Callery Pear, but it should be - where it can be grown successfully.

'Beaver Creek' is a selection from the Klehm family's Beaver Creek Nursery in northern IL; it is likely available through Song Sparrow and/or they could tell you who retails this plant at local garden centers.

Ha! 'Red Licorice' is a selection from Bernheim Arboretum and Research Forest here in KY.

http://www.pleasantrunnursery.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/plants.plantDetail/plant_id/1846/

'Mt. Airy' is the selection most commonly offered because it is easy to propagate from cuttings with a high success rate - and is not protected by patent. It has been around at least 25 years.

'Blue Mist' has also been around a long time, but has not performed nearly as well in the midwest and mid-south heat/humidity. I think it was a selection made for success in cooler moister climates - like Pacific northwest US or upper northeastern states.

Here is a fine article from 2008 by Rick Darke - who couldn't want this plant after reading this...

http://www.rickdarke.com/Fothergilla.pdf

Wow! Some tension here on Sunday morning...

There is room for all sorts of opinions on the performance and quality of retail mail order nurseries and their plants, and no one has cornered the market on perfection. The individual must make their own decisions on whether "once burned, twice shy" applies. This is where Garden Watch Dog provides excellent service for a wide range of reviews.

If this was the only measuring stick, ForestFarm would tell you themselves that they'd be out of business. There is no such thing as being right every time, and plants (being live things) will always vary and sometimes die. FF makes up for it (when asked) by generally providing good service to increase customer satisfaction. Your mileage may vary with other outfits.

All that said: I think some responses here were dealing with statements of finality, like "no one has it" or "you can't find it" which simply overreach. I don't think inferences beyond that are necessary.

Recommendations: when feeling frustrated in finding Fothergilla, do a web search of your state's nursery association (TX, IL, WI, etc.) and see which wholesalers grow it. Then, solicit their customer base to find a retailer near you. I will be amazed if you don't find quite a few that are convenient, especially in the major metropolitan areas.

Sorry, Donna! I didn't mean any offense!
I was just trying to point out that the plant is listed quite often.
I have had good luck with the nurseries listed,
but I realize everyone's experiences can be different.
I'm sorry if I stepped on any toes... no offense intended.
Happy gardening!

Sage advice from the OTHER viburnum dude. I have a strong preferance for going the conventional route of buying plants in person. I know mail order is sometimes the only route one can take for some plants and they certainly have their place, but hunting down that "must have" woody and planning excursions around obtaining it is half the fun for me. Plus, the added benefits are you get to see exactly what condition it's in, strike up a conversation with nursery staff, and admire it on the return journey home. I've been doing this for many years now, and I always look forward to visiting those nurseries that carry the more choice and hard-to-find plants. My job allows me a certain freedom to do this sort of thing, which I understand many people don't have. As an example, a couple of weeks ago I made my annual visit to Edelweiss Nursery in Duluth, MN, where I purchased a nice-sized Abies koreana seedling and Pinus bungeana 'Temple Gem'. The fir was by my side for the ride home and you'd have thought we were on a first date. Peculiar? Yes, of course it is, but don't we all have our little idiosyncrasies when it comes to plants? C'mon, you know you do. :)

Pseudo brings yet another layer of pleasure and complexity to plant acquisition - the Epic Odyssey. We all have our Holy Grail of plants that WE MUST HAVE, and may spare no effort to have it in our hands.

I can vouch for a 1988 vacation trip overland to the penultimate goal of the Halifax Public Gardens, where I'd read that one would find a most northerly location of a Davidia involucrata. Oh, how I salivated over finally being able to covet this plant in person - rather than in print.

Imagine my disappointment (captured on Kodak film) when I arrived to find a well-labeled and neatly mulched...stump.

Such is the Sisyphusian quest.

I'll only add this option to the value of personal inspection that is described above: network with people you know and trust. That doesn't overcome the joy in travel, pursuit, capture, and bringing home the prize - but it makes up for when you can't go yourself. It expands your ability achieve the same result, and defrays the cost of the individual plowing the same ground repeatedly.

"Sisphusian Quest" - love it VV!