drthor, what is the name of your itoh?
Peonies 2012
Just gorgeous drthor, the color is so rich, with a beautiful center.
Wonderful white peonies, Cem. In fact I found one I love called Wisconsin Cream on Klehm's site.....is it bad to be buying for next fall's planting already??? LOL Donna, am looking forward to seeing how yours all do this year...you have such a gift for growing them!
Donna, all of my Hollingsworth's and Klehm's peonies are up. I agree they all should have shown by now. I have three with no activity and all are Adelman's. I get the bad weather affecting growth but am disappointed at the fact that they're likely dead. The ones that are growing look weak, so Ah I am sure you're right but I didn't expect dead plants from them. Especially since one, LePerle, was one I was really looking forward to and had put in a prominent spot. Oh well! At least my Adelman's Bartzella made it which I am happy about but can tell there will be no flowers this year. Oberon, I will have to try Reath's...I have seen their site and like the fact that you can buy extra-large plants from them.
Now I have an excuse to place a Klehm's order hmm..right about now! LOL
'
This message was edited Mar 23, 2012 11:07 PM
Thanks Steve. I just looked at WC on the Klehm's website. It's really pretty, how are the roots from them? BTW, you are not allowed to order yet, LOL.
Le or La Perle? If La Perle I will look for mine. Is planted in heavy shade and cane berries. If looks healthy can send you a division ths fall. One of several in that area that need to be moved.
great cem thanks for the pictures, i've heard of imaculee... but not the others.
how many peonies do you have ??
i've been checking catalouges and found an itoh called 'cora louis' thats white,
are itoh's easy to grow ?
now i need to come up with a list of white perennials to go along with the peony.
the bed will be close to the patio, so i'm hoping to have fragrant annuals as well.
cheers L
Cem, don't tempt me! I love white peonies, but found that everything I had was white, or, unexpectedly, became white in our sun. That's when, with Steve's help, I started going wild with color. Burma Joy, White Cap (one of my favorites), Lois (wow is she vigorous!) and I pulled up and repotted Kansas. Cornelia Shaylor and Mrs. FDR would morph to white. I started going wild with lily colors too (lots of red - yee haw!)
Drthor, congratulations on your beautiful ITOH. Please send more pictures of that beautiful thing.
Steve, it's weird that my very best peonies every were from The Peony Superstore in Canada, which had bad reviews. The Cornelia Shaylor and Mrs. FDR I got from him jumped out of the ground first season, have a ridiculously high bud count, are fool proof and beautiful. They were so big I couldn't take them with me. It troubles me that the Adelman peonies were busts. They have such a fine reputation, and it seems to me that they should have let their customers know of potential disappointments, and offer possible replacement up front. The thing that is a real drag is that it messes up your presentation. I placed my peonies with a lot of thought to their reliability. That's why Lois is right up front with Festiva Maxima, White Cap and White Frost (which is essentially a Festiva Maxima on steroids - incredible!) but not Moonstone (which took three years to give me a flower). Coral Charm was in a pot, and showed such ridiculous robustness that it got a prominent location. I am utilizing Burma Joy as a kiss kiss to my neighbors on one side (that gorgeous thing can take quite a bit of shade).
But when you plant a new peony in a prominent spot, and one from so highly regarded a supplier, and it does not perform it is particularly disappointing. Yes, White Flower Farm sends the wrong peonies (4 for me) but the quality of them is fabulous.
Donna, have seen the Peony Superstore and also saw the poor reviews...but he did have a great selection and I had considered trying that vendor. You're right about WF; they get a bad rap sometimes too but the bulbs and peonies I have gotten from them over the years have been top notch. I have not bought peonies from them for several years but the ones I got were the very first ones I'd tried at my first home in TX and I remember two of the three plnats blooming first year. Got some spectacular dayliies from them that did extremely well. They are kind of expensive but if you look closely at their selections they have the same stuff many of the major vendors do - e.g. lilies - some of the varieties they carry have I ONLY found with one other vendor and that is Lily Garden which makes me wonder if that is from whence WFF sources many of its lilies.
Thanks Ah for your offer and generosity. Yes, it was "La Perle" so I misspelled. Will see what happens and let you know how things turn out. I have no problem buying a new one, just not something I would have expected from this vendor is all, as Donna mentions. By the way Cem..the roots from Klehm are great....not as "big" but more fibrous than the ones from Adelman, which tend to be very long and thick but only one or two central runners, wheeras Klehm's aren't as long but have more roots that are smaller, almost more like a daylily's. The Klehm and Hollingsworth ones seem to have more eyes though the Klehm roots at an initial glance look significantly smaller than Adelman's. Hollingsworth's are in the middle. All three have been terrific performers and I can see no difference in vigor and bloom between Adelman and Klehm peonies. Actually the ones with highest first-year bloom counts seem to consistently be Hollingsworth's.
Cem - I am so jealous of you and drthor with the early bloom but have to say we are right here with you at least this year. In fact I have some Sir Winston Chuchill narcissus that are starting to bloom here and the normal timeframe in TX was beginning of April. I even have some tulips opening - can you believe that In March in the Midwest??
Oh look I have a picture....Adelman on left (can you believe these are significantly smaller than years past?) and Klehm on right (five plants). You can see a distinct difference. This pic is from last October and I didn't get Hollingsworth's till November. The Adelman roots look healthy so again surprised at the three no-shows. They were planted in the same beds as the others so nothing specific to the planting site like a drainage issue.
This message was edited Mar 24, 2012 8:51 AM
Wow, Steve, the differences are really distinct, in terms of the roots. It's funny - you sent me both Klehms and Adelmans and they were distinctly different, but all were successful. And the fact that you planted them in the same conditions indicated that the roots are truly the problem since you are an expert in the cultivation, and certainly planting, of peonies.
Are you going to let Adelman know? I was so impressed at the peony show that I would have ordered from them, dispite my disappointment with Paul M. Wild.
And yes, it's very bad to be planning for next year now! Naughty!
Reath's I believe is somewhat more expensive than some others, but I swear he just digs up whole plants and sends them. My first order he sent me Red Charm as a freebie. I have an order in to Adelman's for this fall. It will be interesting to see how the ones I got from them last year perform this spring. In the dahlia world the size of the tuber doesn't equate to vigorous plants as has been proven to me over and over. Scrawny little tubers have produced large multi-bloom plants. Not so with peonies.
I just went through my records and realized that I ordered Paul M. Wild and Tourangelle from Adelman in 2003. Neither ever appeared. So I think that sometimes they just have a very bad year.
Reath's pricing stucture is interesting. Iwent to the website and he actually sells some peonies in three sizes. Garden Treasure is listed as $125 for a three year old plant and $200 for a five to six year plant.
Little Red Gem is $18 for a 3 year plant, $30 for an extra large 3 to 5 year plant, and $60 for a double division.
But some come in only one size, extra large 3-5, and are one price, like Mrs.FDR for $30, Moonstone for $90 (!!!), Kansas for $25 and Festiva Maxima for $24. I own these three, and the prices, while on the higher side, don't seem out of line except for Moonstone, which has been in commerce forever (Murawska, the retired railroad engineer from the Chicago area) and which even Klehm, who is hardly the cheapest, sells for $28.95.
Has anyone ever ordered from A&D? Their images got me hooked on peonies, and it was their imaged of Mrs. FDR and Cornelia Shaylor that got me to buy them (for about $15 each from The Peony Superstore), and the above mentioned Tourangelle.
.
Well Donna thank you for the nice words and while I would not consider myself an "expert" by any means I do think I have the planting thing down...I am good at selecting appropriate sites and in planting properly. I did plant these about a half inch deeper than I would have in Texas. I did plant >120 peonies in TX and ALL of them came up and bloomed in a much less peony-friendly environment, bar none, so don't think it is me :-) Your experience helps confirm that..and maybe the Klehm and Hollingsworth peonies are just better suited to us due to climactic likeness and growing conditions' similarities. Or could be just a bad year or issue with transport :-) I think I will try a Reaths plant or two; for the higher price you get a much more mature and advanced plant when ordering the extra-large sizes. If you order from A&D let me know how they are; their reputation is good as are their reviews from what I remember. BTW I just ordered 7 Klehm peonies including Wisconsin Cream :-) And a REALLY cool one named Pink Lemonade. Oh and my B&D lily order just showed up but was short one variety :-( What is going on in the PAC NW this year LOL.
You planted 120 peonies in TEXAS and they all came up?! Wow! I think that's expertise - you're so modest!
Speaking of lilies - a quick off thread. Guard your Silver Sunbursts (which is easy - they multiply like mad and I have given away at least ten, took about ten and have about that many at the old house) because Scott at OHG has on his website that he has not had it since 2004 (I ordered it in 2003, from HIM) and he can't find a reliable grower!
Maybe the Occupy Portland protesters riled up the air too much!
Just looked up Wisconsin Cream and Pink Lemonade. Steve!
You can see the dead peony (Big Ben) to the left of the hole. Couldn't take it anymore so went out and dug up my peony to see if it was there, and yes, fully intact, not rotted or dissolved, just DEAD. Oh well...needed a spot for my lilies that just arrived so I put them there. Will expand this bed later. The two peonies on either side with the green tags are from Hollingsworth and they are doing fine.
Donna, did you like them?? Maybe one will find its way to you if you're good :-) I have an obsession with Bombs now...was Japanese/Anemones.
Here is a closer shot of the dead root.
Now you have me worried Steve. Your dead root looks just like some I got from Adelman's last year. It is such a long winter to find a dud -- if it happens. I know their peonies were late last year due to so much rain. I couldn't resis and ordered two tree peonies from MamaJack's. And determined that Clearview Orca dahlia was dead from last year so found a supplier (new to me -- Clearview Dahlia) for Clearview Orca and ordered three (1 of orca and two others different).
How do Dahlias do for you, Oberon? I planted them in TX and they would overwinter no problem and developed just huge root systems but never grew nice plants because of the heat. Do you dig yours up I assume? When do they bloom? I imagine your less intense sun would work well for them. On the Adelman peonies, I planted 12 last fall from them and 9 are showing growth, this one for sure is dead and I strongly suspect the other two are as well. They are all in different beds and all share beds with the 10 Klehm and Holl. peonies all of which have growth. Maybe I just got some duds but 75% is not very good. I have ordered from Adelman for a few years though and never had this happen with their stock so maybe this is just a fluke. Best of luck to you!
Steve, I'm sorry to see that the root is dead. Is it still firm? No pips at all ? ;-( It's really disappointing when that happens. Will they send you a replacement?BTW, I'll be jealous when you have blooms, and mine are over as we roll from south to north.
Lindy, you're welcome. I don't know how many peonies I have, I'll have to do a count. I added a bunch in the fall, and have a few tree peonies coming from the co-op. I need to write them down in one place to keep track.
This message was edited Mar 24, 2012 5:05 PM
Thanks Steve. Yes, I dig and store the dahlias in the winter. I start them up when they yell at me around the middle end of March in the garage. I lay them in a try with soil so I can get a lot in one tray. That way I don't waste pots work and soil on duds. had a few this year. They start blooming around the end of June up to mid July depending on where they are planted. Then they go nutso for the rest of the summer til around end of September if weather holds. Clearview Orca was a tiny propagated thing from Corralitos. It grew into a 4x4' bush with over a dozen 6" flowers, in a not particularly wonderful. I couldn't hold the tuber over the winter though. The stem was about 2.5" across and even though I dried it out, it rotted over the winter - not the tuber, just the stem. Same with a couple of other propagated. I guess I will steer clear of those for us. Pirl says they work well for her.
CEM9165, you really have to love spreadsheets and databases! Or at least I love mine. It adds to the workload a lot but I would have no idea what, or how, or how long, or when they grew or when they bloomed from one year to the next if I didn't log it in. Just created a new one from a nice chunk of WS data online. Added my own columns for planted, germinated, how, comments, where the seed came from. Some people knit/crochet, some garden, some read --- I do that and databases and/or spreadsheets. Just like a crossword puzzle.
Steve, as they say - what's not to like? I started out with big pale doubles, except that Cornelia Shaylor was a bomb, but now have a single and a semi double. And you know, after tying up the monsters, it's refreshing! I mean, really. Cornelia and Mrs. FDR defied Lee Valley rings. Look at these things - and they're not open yet (maybe I should get a pick ax and go after them) The pic is from last June. Mrs. FDR is in front, and she came with me.
Related to the dahlias, I overwinter my calla lilies by simply withholding water and throwing the pots in the basement. They let you know when spring has come by starting to grow. Then I give them fresh soil (maybe), ferilizer and water and off they go. I started with two pots but the reproduce so quickly I had ten full pots before I transported them in freezing weather in the trunk of my car and left them for a few days. Now I have seven pots, with at least 8 to each pot.
Glads I overwinter by cutting back the foliage, leaving the plants to dry in the garage or sunlight, dust them with fungicide and put them in paper bags. This is another plant that lets you know "IT'S TIME" by growing. I put them back in the ground. Sometimes they are growing sideways but I put the bulb basel plate down and they get with the program.
The great thing about the two is that you do NOTHING!
This message was edited Mar 24, 2012 3:35 PM
Cem, haven't even contemplated asking for a replacement yet. Not sure what their policy is on that but usually they just guarantee for something to be healthy upon arrival and any failure is usually blamed on gardeners' practices or climactic conditions. I will let them know I had three failures and see how they respond, so see what happens. Yes, it is firm and turgid like a carrot (which it should be), but no I could not find any eyes - I have an eyeless peony - and even if there were no eyes I would at least expect some root growth and non of that either. It snapped when I bent it but was not dry or brittle like a dead branch. Inside looked and felt moist. Took some photos just in case I call Adelman's but threw the root out. My La Perle is in the front yard in a prime spot and I will probably do same with it - I have a bunch of stuff coming any time - lilies, hostas, astilbes, and daisies....might plant the daisies there since it is a sunny spot.
Oberon, I track all my stuff too with spreadsheets. Too funny. Everything from bills to what plants I order and when. Really helps me keep track of things.
This message was edited Mar 24, 2012 4:35 PM
Wow Donna what a gorgeous peony. That is what mine strive to look like when they grow up :-)
I can almost smell the poenies. I don't order bombs anymore. Red Charm is enough and it has stems strong enough to hold them up. I love cala lilies but I was told they bloom at the wrong time for us. Like winter rather than summer. When do they bloom for you?
Donna, those peonies are absolutely GORGEOUS!!!! I can't wait till my new ones mature to that size. Come on my little babies, look at Donna's plants and learn, LOL.
Steve and Mary, I'm a computer idiot. If I started doing spreadsheets, the garden would never see me again. I really should learn how, maybe one of these days.
Steve, even if they don't send replacements, at least you should get a credit, you've done business with them for years, they should at least honor that. Could you pot up the others even though no roots if still firm, to see if anything happens?
A few years ago I had a broken piece of a peony root with no pips, i planted it just for chuckles, it keeps coming up every year, tiny and no blooms yet, maybe eventually it will. BTW, which new lilies did you get? Annette
Donna, you're right, I have calla lilies in pots that spent the winter in the garage. They started growing without being watered for months. I just put them outside last week, I need to throw some bulb food on them.
Mary my callas bloomed mid to late summer here. They were planted last spring, I got them from lakesidecalla's co-op.
The glads here are suppose to be lifted. I've been too lazy and didn't do them again, they spent the winter outside in the pot that they've been grown in for the last two years and they've come back again.
This message was edited Jan 1, 2013 11:07 PM
I dig my glads and do what you do -- into paper bags. I just potted them up several days ago and I see pips growing. If I don't stop ordering and growing ordering and growing I will have to tear out all the lawn this summer to accommodate it all.
See this peony.....took this just a few minutes ago....the one peony that was at the home I just bought....it is really moving along.....
Cem, I think you're right. I have spent a LOT of money there over the years and they strike me as an upstanding business. Will see what they say. Most of the ones that did sprout are weak looking. Bartzella looks nice as an exception but pretty sure there will be no blooms this year. My only other Itoh is Garden Treasure from Hollingsworth and it came up after Bart but growth is very strong and lots of shoots coming up. I thought about what you said about potting up the others and might do that just to see what happens. I made three lily orders...one for OT's from B&D, a second with mostly Orientals from B&D, and a mixed order from Lily Garden. Only the first has arrived yet. I planted three each of Paraguay, Belladonna (one of my favs), Dalian, Conca d'Or, and Gerez. I ordered three of Saltarello having had it in Texas and loved it....but was not in the box. So, will be writing B&D a note too. Orientals didn't work well in the TX heat but since Donna grows them so well I am gonna give them a try too this year.
This message was edited Mar 24, 2012 5:46 PM
The peony in the left foreground is Bartzella (Adelman), and in the left background near the door is an incredibly strong White Cap (Klehm) - one of my favs. Looks like WC will produce at least two flowers this year.
Falcon - a red double from Klehm....looking good and likely two flowers on this one as well. Have never grown or seen this one before but the picture looked beautiful
Coira Stubbs - Klehm - one of my very favorites......three buds on this one. My CS in Texas grew and bloomed prolifically too for a young plant.
Regarding callas, by late June they are fully foliaged, and start blooming the first week of July. Here they are on June 28, 2010.
Some of the older doubles become incredible after a few years. Mrs. FDR from the Peony Superstore is just outrageous. The number of buds is astounding. I had four peonies in this advanced stage of development. You can see why I want it again.
And the flowers change shape! And color!
Steve your peonies are looking fabulous already. My first experience with Hollingsworth was this past fall from the co-op, and I'm very pleased with what I received from them. Me being the nut that I am, I acutally counted the eyes on all the roots received,and they numbered any where from 3-7 eyes per root. Many of these new plants have buds this year. Hope your misbehavin' peonies work out.
Sounds like you've also got some nice lilies to look forward to. I've had Belladonna for several years, it is pretty, and Conca d' Or was planted last spring, hope it does well this year. It did bloom but only got to 3ft it's first season of growing.
Donna, I'm drooling all over my computer screen, those blooms are to die for. I'm gonna have to check out the Peony Superstore.
Mary, I'm glad your glads are doing well already. Who needs grass anyway, LOL. I'm slowly but surely takng ours out little by little, I'm gonna have to make room for the new tree peonies coming. The DH and DS don't even realize it yet.
"Better to beg forgiveness than ask permission" - pretty much always works for me. :)
Good point, so take grass now, ask for forgiveness later, will do.
:)
Buds on Lois and Burma Joy.
I so hope they do that co-op with Hollingsworth again. Those roots were fantastic!
Donna, your peonies are to die for!
Good looking plants Donna, you're going to have an early bloom season as well.
Polly, I discovered co-ops last year, and I have to say that I loved the peonies I received, and at great prices.
Wow Donna terrific looking...especially consisering they have been moved a couple times......buds and all - congratulations!
I put Cora Stubbs and White Cap close to the front door...CS has 5 buds and WC has three......those are probably my two favorites. I see where my La Perle was supposed to be and say "arrggghh". Hopefully Bart will make a nice specimen next year.