Got leaves, but not much roots: Phalaenopsis

I bought a charming little phal from Walmart a couple of months ago, but after having someone housesit for me while I was away for a month or so, came back to find the leaves with that softish, leathery feeling, and some of the flowers sagging. There's only so much you can teach regarding plant care, when you only know so much yourself and a Special Case arises.

I pulled my little darling out of the pot and let most of the medium fall away, to discover that there wasn't much left in the way of roots. A couple of rotten/shrunken strands were there, which I removed. I'm not sure this plant had such great roots to begin with, actually. I bought it because it had small citron-colored flowers instead of the really gaudy bright violets or huge whites. After this inspection I refilled the medium, and left some upper roots - rather short, really - near the surface of the medium. I cut off the blooms about a week ago (stuck the flowers in a bud vase), in case they were pulling energy from the plant. I've been misting the plant and the surface of the medium every day or two, as it's been very humid here and I haven't thought atmospheric dryness was really the issue; more likely the lack of a significant root system. I pick up the plastic pot out of the ceramic holder every five to seven days, to see if it's lightening up (drying) at all; it doesn't get lightweight as often as my visibly-circling-the-pot phals. After my being home three weeks, the plant seems not to have changed much - neither better, nor worse. The remaining short roots look like orchid roots are supposed to look: plump, green-grey, reaching out. I just don't think that one or two half-inch roots is going to be enough!

Anybody have any suggestions for better recovery care? Mist the leaves with weak orchid fertilizer? Can it get its nutrients and health back that way, instead of just relying on the minimal roots? Perhaps at this point it's just a case of patience while the roots grow, but I would feel tons better about it if I could get those leaves to be turgid. It was such a sweet little orchid when I bought it, unassuming but unique and fascinating, and I'd dearly love to bring it to the robust health my other two have. Bringing it back to bloom would be an ultimate triumph!!!! The last time I had a wilty orchid (one of the presently robust ones), I kept it humidified by giving it its own little plastic bag greenhouse for about a month, until it recovered. It has become amazingly happy, to the point of reblooming from a little bud growing out of the original bloom spike. Is this tenting an OK idea even in fairly humid (for Minnesota) weather?

Joan --> inexperienced with orchids, but observant and willing to learn

Hi Joan. You poor thing with your orchid trials. At the risk of repeating myself once again...the orchids sold at the "box" stores are really the equivalent of live flower arrangements sent by florists. They are meant to be enjoyed in containers and mediums not appropriate for the plants and then get tossed. However, there seems to be a host of stubborn, frugal, nurturing gardeners out there that refuse to throw a green thing in the trash. :>) Rotten roots almost always cause by over watering or a broken down medium. Really it's the same problem because if the medium breaks down the roots are staying to wet. If the bark is chunky it is okay. If it looks like soil, even a little, it is not. If it is in sphagnum and a plastic pot that is usually the eventual kiss of death for the amateur grower.

You sound like you are doing almost everything perfectly. Be careful to not get water down the center of the plant. I think your humidity is a lot lower than ours. Now that you have cleaned up those rotten roots dust the remaining roots and plant base with cinnamon. It is both bacterial and fungicidal. I'd get the plant out of a pot altogether at this point. They grow in trees, not in pots so that's a big part of the culture problem when starting out. You can set the plant and its remaining roots on top of barely moist sphagnum, then loosely tent it so that no plastic is touching the plant.
Laurel

Thanks, Laurel! I'm hanging in there, and so is the orchid. I think one of the roots I left sticking out hear the top has actually grown a little. It looks plump and green, and maybe an eighth of an inch longer. If it were going to give up, I don't think this would have happened. So I'm hopeful.

Do you think I should un-pot this plant again, to get the cinnamon on there?

I do have some new, medium-coarse orchid bark. It would certainly be drier - maybe too dry? I could mix it with some of the old, so it would be airier, but still having some humidity. I read somewhere that new bark takes something like three months until it's "conditioned." And I would be a little concerned about the winter months here, if I adapt the mix to current conditions. It is incredibly dry, once I turn on the forced air heat. My violin, much affected by humidity levels, goes all funny (not in a pretty way) starting in November, and stays that way until May.

Believe me, I do pitch certain box store plants: easter lilies and poinsettias, which my Mom always nurtured to a state of unbelievable, sizable health. But orchids and amaryllis - gotta keep, ha ha! Just too much of a fun challenge, and not too much of a space commitment.

One other thing: my other two phals are on a second spurt of bloom. And... it's August.... I really want blooms again in January. Should I try to shut down the bloom process, to give the plants a little break, before trying to start the nightly cooling in September? January is when I really need the hope and newness provided by blooming plants, to tide me over until spring.

Thanks!!

Joan

If it has no roots be careful its not in to big a pot as the mix may stay moist and rot the base of the phal. In a tiny pot of moss or even bark and don't over water should grow more roots back. I wouldn't mix the new bark with the old bark, you actually should soak the new bark for a while before using it. But i wouldn't be worried to much. I think too dry is better than to wet. Be careful wetting the leaves as Laurel said as this may cause crown rot. goodluck!

Yes, don't mix old and new bark. That puts you on an early road to a half rotten medium. If the plant is spiking off of branches already bloomed you may want to cut them to chill the plant come Fall. If these are new spikes you should not.

I think some of the old medium is pretty well broken down. It looks like damp peat moss, not even sphagnum. Should I smash up a little of the new medium (the chunks are pretty chunky) to about half-iinch size, soak it for a while (how long?), and move the plant over?

No new flower spikes, and I cut off the first one.

No, don't smash.

is it chunky bark? How big are you talking? It should be fine as is. I seive any fines out if i have to use that pre bagged orchid mix and just use the chunks. But i usually buy bags of orchid bark which comes in different sizes and just add some perlite or lava rock/scoria.
Soaking doesn't have to be to long (overnight) but i do a heap at once and leave it for a few days, then drain, then i use it as needed.

Bree, the only perlite available here outside of orchid suppliers is medium grade which is too fine for orchids and should not be added to the bark. Most of the ready mixes already have course grade perlite added.

yeah but most of the ready make mixes here have to many fines in them (like dirt). I think its even to fine for terrestrials. I seive it first if i have to use them. Can use a type of rock instead of perlite like lava rock/scoria, great for benched plants but makes hanging pots heavier.

Thanks, everyone, for all your input. I'm starting to get a mental picture of what orchid mix should look like. The bark I have is "medium" orchid bark, the brand being Black Gold. It's not one of those "orchid mix" bags you can see at Walmart. I've put some to soak. Do you guys really never use anything with sphagnum in it? It's going to be incredibly dry here this winter - 20% by December-January - and without sphagnum, I would be concerned about things being too dry. Does one just water more often then, if all you have is chunky bark?

Status report: orchid not deteriorating, leaves are still leathery but not limp; new root growth is slow, but happening! I shifted it a little and saw what appear to be new roots coming out a little lower down than before, with what I think is about three-quarters of an inch of new growth. It actually looks like maybe 1.25", but I wouldn't want to be bragging, in case it's something I just overlooked before. I haven't watered at all, but it's tented, and I mist the leaves, with very, very weak orchid fertilizer. (No urea, etc.) When I'm ready to re-pot, I'll take some photos of the root system, to assist my memory.

I have another question regarding re-potting. One of my orchids has finished a second bloom for the year, but has yet another "mitten" on the end of the spike, and wants to have another go at it, apparently. There's also a bud on the spike, closer to the crown, that looks like it could send another bloom. The roots on this baby are circling the pot and trying to get out the bottom, and fluffed over the top too. Should I repot at this time, as long as I'm soaking bark? Should I move up an inch in pot size? And how important is it to use translucent pots?

Just my personal opinion, but I would cut off the spike and repot it. I had a phal do that last year and it literaly bloomed itself to death. I think they NEED a break.

Or you could let it flower, how often does it flower? don't repot it if you want to keep the flowers as it may cause the buds to drop.
Yeah i water more in summer and way less in winter. I tend to have problems with rot as my orchids are just under shadecloth and it rains here a fair bit so i use just bark. You can use a size smaller bark and it'll stay moister a little longer(i use small bark for my Paphiopedilums). Plenty of growers do use moss as a medium but you have to get the watering down pat to not rot them as they will easily and quickly if kept moist for a period of time. As most wild orchids grow on trees or rocks they like a good soak then to dry quickly.
Yes when your orchids root have filled up the pot you can go up to the next size pot, they don't have to be clear(though its easier to see if there still moist inside with clear pots). I find the clear pots i get haven't got as many drainage holes as the black plastic ones so i use the shallow black ones. When you transplant an orchid alot of times you trim off any old or rotting roots, some times old bulbs, in this case they can usually go back into the same size pot or smaller in the case of severe root rot.

Where do you Americans buy your supplies, when you shop online? I hear there are plenty of orchid type supplies around Florida, but not so much here in rural Minnesota. I don't have a lot of options but to shop online.

I'm going to need some bigger ceramic pots pretty soon. How important are the Official Orchid Pots with Holes, really? They're so spendy, that I think of getting the less expensive solid ones, but big enough to allow plenty of air down the sides. It's getting to that time of year when there are a few decent sales on here and there.

OCCarol, thanks for that advice. I'm kinda thinking that if I don't get this plant repotted and allowed a bit of a rest, it won't be ready to do the cool-down thing when the time comes. Well. I guess I'll be pulling the trigger on that. I hope I don't put it in a whole year of non-blooming funk - I haven't had orchids long enough to have a chance at trying to get them to shoot out a new spike. That's my next big orchid challenge.

The Phals are all different in their bloom habits it seems. I would not cut the whole spike off with most of them. If you cut it back to the last node before the blooms, they will often form a branch there and bloom again. That being said, the one I lost had continued to put out blooms for 11 months! I had read somewhere that they can become exausted, but I had to find out the hard way.LOL!

Joan, could you please DM me so I can help you find sources for supplies? Be specific about what you are looking for. I'll ask my orchid cronies and make a general post. I can get everything through I need through my orchid society, the vendors that come to visit and my travels so I've not got online ordering experience. Your local orchid society, if there is one, would be a source. Official orchid pots are not all that important but pots that breath are. I don't know what drill bit my SO uses. He has created orchid friendly pots for me on occasion by drilling extra holes in cheap, big box store, terracotta pots.

Okay, so these are things I have never heard, but I do have some sickly orchids. Box store purchased, and I refuse to let them go. I know I can get them to bloom...I don't even know what the blooms look like because I bought them on clearance after they couldn't sell them. (99 cents was really a deal I couldn't pass up). I did get one of them to bloom two years ago.
Cinnamon? Really? Freshly grated or is store bought okay? Any pictures on how to put the plant on the sphagnum and not have a mess on your hands? I will throw my pots away right now if that is all that is holding me back. And, if that is the case, why do stores sell orchid pots? Help please

Powdered Cinnamon in the jar i use whenever i cut a flower spike off. I use a real fungicide spray on the roots if needed.
These big stores usually don't have any idea on growing orchids they just have them in to sell them(there usually overwatered and rotted when you buy them) then they mark them down or throw them away.
Alot of orchids grow fine in 'orchid pots'(shallow with great drainage) but Phals grow in trees naturally and do well mounted. Plus its harder to overwater and thats what 90% of them die from.
Heres one i saved from rot now mounted on a bit of wood.

Albeachrealtor, Go back to the orchids forum, and the 9th thread down the page is an excellent step by step Laurel did on mounting orchids.

Post some pictures of your sickly orchids and we can give you more advice as to how you should proceed, Albeachrealtor.

As Bree says, most orchids you see at the box stores have been shoved into a decorative container that's not at all appropriate for an orchid. Their roots need air, so a real orchid pot has holes not only on the bottom, but up the sides as well. Baskets made of wood or wicker or other natural materials, and even plastic (with lots of holes) work fine too. Or mount them as Bree's picture shows above if you want to hang them.

First thing to do is to haul your sick 'chids out of their pots and check out the roots. You'll often find a big soggy wad of moss in there with some of them, too. Getting some air to the roots and letting them dry out a bit is the first step to recovery.

I got two at IKEA on Labor Day. One has done amazingly well, but the other started looking sad and shriveling up its leaves after about a month. It had a ball of solid wet moss under the roots as big as my fist. Yuck. Re-potting in a proper orchid mix (bark, perlite, charcoal all in big chunks) after trimming off a lot of squishy dead roots and dusting with cinnamon did the trick but it was nearly 6 weeks before the leaves had plumped back up and it popped out a new root. Rehab takes patience, too.

dyzzypyxxy- that Brassavola looks really nice in that white pot.
Another thing when repotting esp. rotted orchids..make sure the pot is just a size or two bigger then the orchids roots, over potting will just keep the medium wet longer and continue the rotting. So if you have to trim off roots you may need to go a pot size or two.