Forest Pansy Redbud

Does anyone know if this tree is produced by grafting. One person on here talks about the "graft" on her tree and another poster talks about it being discovered in a forest, like it was a mutation or sport of the original. TIA, Cam

'Forest Pansy' Redbud is commercially reproduced by grafting or budding scions or buds of a plant of 'Forest Pansy' onto seedling Redbud (Cercis canadensis) understock.

'Forest Pansy' was originally selected in 1947 from a block of seedings at Forest Nursery in McMinnville, TN.

Thanks for the info. Could you go into more detail?. If there is such a plant as Forest Pansy Redbud, why can it not grow on its own? Why must it be grafted onto different stock?

I'm not sure what's the case with Forest Pansy specifically, but sometimes grafting is an easier & more reliable way of propagating vs cuttings, and someone who's growing them commercially is always going to choose the most efficient reproduction method. Or sometimes fancy cultivars have pretty leaves, flowers, etc but not the best root systems in the world so in those cases you'll get a more robust plant if you graft them onto a different rootstock.

Grafting is a more efficient way of propagating a lot of trees (and other plants) than trying to get them to produce their own roots. A grafting "expert" can graft hundreds in a day and 99% of them will probably be successful.

Japanese maples, fruiting trees, a lot of ornamental trees, and roses are prime examples where grafting is used. What is amazing (and awful at the same time) is a double graft where for example a weeping flowering top is grafted on a trunk to show off the beautiful bark that is finally grafted on a rootstock (I had a weeping cherry that was like this and it didn't make it through one year which makes me very leery of doing that again).

I have some seeds and I just was wondering if was worth trying to germinate and propagate. I have a lot of time and patience but I dont want to waste that on a plant that has a poor chance of survival. Your information was very helpful. Thanks for your help. Cam

I don't see any reason why the seedlings wouldn't survive. I know I mentioned poor root systems as one reason why plants might be grafted instead of grown on their own roots, but I have no knowledge of that being the case for Forest Pansy. It's more likely that grafting is just a more efficient method for commercial growers to use since they need to grow hundreds and hundreds of these.

The trouble with the seeds is that Forest Pansy won't come true from seed, so there's a good chance the babies wouldn't maintain the nice foliage color of the parent and you'd end up with boring green leaves. But if you don't mind potentially wasting a little time & potting mix there's really nothing to lose by trying and seeing what you get.

So Forest Pansy is a hybrid, not a mutation, right?

No!

'Forest Pansy' is a chance seedling, showing the genetic variation of the species Cercis canadensis.

The way to retain the exact characteristics of this plant is through asexual or vegetative propagation (grafting, budding). Growing out seeds from 'Forest Pansy' is termed sexual propagation, where there is the likely opportunity for mixing of genetic characteristics.

It may be helpful for you to look up some of these propagation and botanical terms, and then focus your questions.

In case you decide to do some seeds, let me note- I get seedlings of regular old Redbud and the young leaves will have red tones - not sure how long you'll wait to know if they came up really forest pansy colored.
Hopefully if you had a number of seedlings you could compare and see at least ONE with true color. Maybe not!
'Someone told me' they need to be scarified.

Pretty sure they also require stratification.

Viburnum, I understood the terminology but could not seem to find the information which you gave me, ie, "they are a variation within the species". That told me what I needed to know. Thanks so much and to all of you for the helpful tips on trying to grow from seed. Im going to attempt to grow one from seed and then I might try some grafting. Ive grafted roses before so why not try. Cam

There you go - it just took the right trigger word.

Good luck with the propagation attempts. If you have room/time to grow out a bunch of seedlings, send pictures come spring leaf-out, and show us the variation that comes from the natural genetic mixing in seeds.

This is interesting to me. I had a Forest Pansy that was broken off this year, and I was desperate to save at least a part of it. Most of the reading I did convinced me that it had indeed been grafted, and my thought was that it was the graft that had failed. The tree had never done very well, and of course, this was the first year it really seemed to be growing.
Long story short, the tree began to regrow below the break, and it's red. The leaves begin as a much more definite red than the "regular" variety. It has continued as red, almost. Down near the bottom is one clump of green leaves.
So, for me, the mystery continues....

Are you sure that your break was at or below the graft? If you've got some green stuff coming up from the bottom and some red higher up, it strikes me that the graft is probably still there somewhere in between the red & the green. I'd probably prune out the green--it'll be stronger than the red so if you let it go it'll eventually take over.

Ditto to ecrane3's thoughts.

For additional verification, take some pictures of that situation, and post them here for extra eyes to observe. We can all learn something from what you are experiencing.

Start a new thread, if you do so - and link back to your post here.

I'm not at all sure the break had anything to do with the graft. It was jsut that where it broke always _looked_ like a graft.
I have trouble with pictures, but I'll try. As to linking back here, that's even less likely but again, I'll try. *G*