My questioning post was deleted. What is going on here?

My questioning post was deleted. What is going on here?

This message was edited May 27, 2010 2:22 PM

DG admin trying to tamp down near hysteria over a legitimate business deal.

Thank you for responding.

K

No it was not a legitimate business deal.


Dave started another website and IB who now owns DG has ordered him on paper to shut down his new site or be sued. Dave has said that he did not think he was under any restrictions for starting new sites anymore. He previously was with name media, but when NM sold to IB, Dave thought that agreement would no longer be valid. So after Dave spent 3 months setting up a new site, IB threatened Dave w a lawsuit, saying daves agreement with NM was transferred to IB during the sale. Dave says this is the first he has heard of that, and why did IB allow Dave to work on the new site for 3 months before saying anything. Looking at IB's record of taking over other websites they bought, they have run most of them in the ground, and have been involved with multiple lawsuits, not just there threat to Dave. IB has had the attitude that Dave wrongfully leaked legal private information, simply by informing members on his new site, that it was going to be shut down on Friday. Anyone would have told members their site was closing, so Dave did not do anything wrong there. IB has totally ignored everyone's questions on the matter. Well that is it in a nutshell I think.

I'd call that a coconut sized shell.

Oh my, and we gardeners just want to have fun and enjoy our hobby with and through each others experiences!

Sniff sniff, gotta go, I think my iris vase water needs changing :)

K

I won't be renewing my subscription these yr so if anyone wants to contact me d-mail me for my e-mail.

Please do not leave. We all need each other. Let us group together and decide where to go together on normal e-mail and then go. But let us not run away until we know where we are going.

I think Dave should replace his lawyers if he thinks a non-competing clause disappears if company is sold. If that's the case, does your mortgage go away when it's bought by another bank?

I guess the gist of the matter for me, is that IB knew from day one that dave was creating a new site, and didn't say anything to him or others for 3 months. They knew better than that! They have also promised to add lots of new 'technical features' to DG :( If they do, it will ruin it for me, I like DG because it is simple to use.

A mortgage is different, you still owe something to someone on it, so it is still yours. The contract dave had with NM, I think many people would have thought it would no longer be in affect since it was between him and NM specifically on paper. Nothing was said to anyone about it 'transferring'. Besides that the contract said no 'competing' sites. Sure cubits did have garden related material on it, plenty of it. But it had MORE other stuff. Yoga? Prayer and Devotions? Painting? Those are hardly topics that would break the bank for IB in way of competition. So I guess the question is, 1. Are IB's claims of the agreement transferring legal? 2. Was the transfer legal? after all, I mean how you can enter a legal agreement without being told?! 3. Is cubits a competing site?

I guess the lawyers will have to work that all out. But anyway a lot of people are leaving. I don't know yet what I am going to do. I might stay for a while and see what happens. I am still mad that they say we OWN our photos but do not allow us to delete them. It makes me LIVID. I am not ever going to add anymore photos to plant files. I think DG will continue to be a great resource for information, and a place to set up trades or sell through classifieds, but I am afraid the community, friend aspect is going out the door...

FrillyLily,

I want to thank you for all the information you have so kindly taken your time to provide.

I can see where it could get into someone's craw that they knew someone who watched an act they saw to be illegal for three months before trying to address it. It actually looks punative in its own way and even entrapping in the sense that in waiting it even turned into something more potentially legally damaging to Dave. This is why I try to stay away from negative legal entanglements of my own making as much as possible, let alone those of others. The smell just never seems to go away.

I think your approach is thoughtful, informed and balanced. I intend to watch for myself and see if I need to make new choices or not. I have benefitted from DG and had not even been aware of the other site and what it had to offer.

Thank you so very much for your information and rational thoughts on the subject,

K

I don't understand what is going on? Is this something that affects us as members of Dave's Garden?

well yes and no. By IB adding new technological gadgets as they stated they intend to do, the site could become less user friendly. Maybe it will be more user friendly, but I personally see nothing here that is broke and needs fixed.

Many members are leaving or will be spending time elsewhere.

Many are refusing to add anymore pictures to Plant Files, including me. I don't like the policy. I guess it has always been basically the same (?) but now it has been brought to my attention.

Many think IB has been dishonest in it's dealing with Dave. They are accusing him of some very heavy stuff, basically with not much to prove it. Or nothing that we have seen. They have made some comments to dave, in print on this site that are flat out libelous from a legal standpoint. Things that could hurt a person's reputation, accusations of stealing codes ect.

Dave and Trish and some others have all been banned now from the site as well.

IB has admitted that D-mails are sometimes read or censored or whatever, and basically are not private to IB, only private from other members. Of course I would suspect that anyway, even when Dave was on board, but now IB has admitted it in print. Plenty of people are not happy about that. Whether IB will do anything to remedy that or not, I don't know.

Seems that IB may be cracking down a little more on links posted to other sites as they see that as directing traffic away from DG.

There were some prayer requests deleted, and someone posted a thread on other forums just to link to the discussion of all of this on the Daves Garden Forum, so other members using other boards would know what was going on. That was deleted. Really seems IB does not want others to be informed of what is going on, and may be more 'censoring' of things than we have here in the past.

You're guess is as good as mine, as to where this will all end.

Not posting on this site hurts those of us who have questions. It is a great source of gardening information & easy to read.

ditto

I just renewed my subscription to DG to enjoy the forums, not to manage the operation. This is a 'for profit' business and everyone is free to join or leave at their pleasure. The owners are free to operate the business as they see fit. As one who was chided by DG admin for replying to a post on a certain forum, they have the right and responsibility to make certain their announced standards are met.

Members need to let the lawyers and parties to the dispute handle the business contracts and just sit back and enjoy the exchange of ideas and information.

Okay, so let me get this straight. Who is IB and are you guys saying that Dave who owns Dave's Garden has been banned off of his own website?

Short version: Dave sold DG to company #1. Company #1 sold DG to company #2. Company #2 enforcing certain contract provisions made between Dave and company #1.

LLLOOONNNGGG version: Go to Dave's garden community and select Dave's garden.

However #2 is now making untrue statements. Enforcing a contract is one thing, defination of character is another. I enjoy this site & don't care who owns it if run properly.

Just as info the cubits site is still up. Go to cubits.org on your browser. Yes, iris, a lot of accusations and rebuttals flying around and no one has produced any evidence to support their stories. I cannot believe Dave does not have a copy of the sales contract he signed and the present company must have their copies. Everyone needs to step back and take a deep breath and check their flowers. I have my own problems. My JI's are into heavy buds and something is trying to eat them. I noticed some had holes and layers of the spathes?? were chewed as though a worm of some kind was eating them. I gave them a good shot of Sevin which may help the situation.

Oldgardenrose You may be being attacket by an orthacheeta fly. If you can sacrifice a flower, open it up I see what is inside. Do you grow verbena? There is a verbena bud moth (or fly) that attacks pods, not sure if it does buds.

I posted 2 or 3 months ago and it was insinuated that I didn't know what was going on...it was no big deal that David's Garden was sold. It was to me. There are many 'garden forums' that are free. So shouldn't the DG subscribers be given more of a voice? I won't be back either. I'm not sad about this, just disappointed. .

Sharon

Hi everyone.

Dee and I have the Irises cubit as most of you know. The Irises cubit is my baby, and I'm very sad at all the things that are going on here and on Cubits.

But there is a thread on the Daves Garden forum to talk about what is happening.

We have a happy group here, and I hope eveyone can stay a happy group here, and help all the new people. I've always praised the Irises forum, how well we all got along.

May I please suggest the Irises forum here on DG stay the Irises forum, and we talk about the other problems on the Daves Garden forum.

Thank you my friends,

Polly

edited to say, we should have more news hopefully next week, so keep that in mind.

This message was edited May 29, 2010 9:48 PM

I'm waiting to hear what happens before renewing my membership, which is up in August. I've liked it here, though I've checked out Cubits and really like the format there, too. I have not joined any of the Cubits yet. I spend so much time here, just don't have time for more. But some of the things I'm hearing lately here are disconcerting.

BTW, Frilly, seems D-mails were not private when Dave was running the show, too, as he kicked off a friend of mine for saying something in a private D-mail that he didn't like. Before then I had thought all D-mails were private. Seems they were not.

Karen

I hope it is all resolved positively for Dave and Cubits. I think for my part, I will renew my DG subscription next month, at least for another year, and fight for the right to non-censored, honest speech on at least one forum. I understand and agree with the need to keep the general forums free of political, religious, etc. controversy, but we don't want censorship. We come to DG to share the things we love, it is like a welcoming, refreshing and peaceful garden in the middle of a tumultuous world, and I think this ideal is what we should agree to defend.

I am staying on the DG site because I want to keep in touch with friends & I feel that sometimes I can help with plant information. It can be difficult to find it. I know some rose people helped me.

Thank you, Lucy. I feel the information I have obtained from this forum has really helped me, and I would hate to see that change. But I realize that change is a given and we'll just have to see how this all plays out. My hope is for the best possible outcome and that things will calm down, that Dave and Trish won't be hurt and their website will be able to continue, and that we can still have our forum conversations here and move forward. I have really appreciated Dave's Garden since I found it two or three years ago, and I think I've only been a subscriber since February, but I have already learned so much from all of you. So it's my hope that this can continue.

I agree with you, Caitlin. I certainly don't want censorship, and I think you're right, we should fight against it. Fight to keep DG what it has always been. I may just renew after all come August when my membership expires. Still not decided yet, but I have time to think about it all.

Karen

I really do understand why people are leaving, and I can clearly see how they would be very upset over the cubits thing, not to mention the ill treatment of Dave by IB. I do think he has been wronged. But I still don't see how leaving DG is going to help Dave or the situation as a whole. As far as IB, they have a whole heap of money, more than I could imagine what to do with I am thinking. They wouldn't miss a hundred people's membership dues anyway. I like the information here at DG, so I am going to stay. If cubits gets to come back/stay, I will hang out there too. I like them both.
The only thing changing for me is that I won't post any of my good photos. Really I have never posted any good ones, I just have mostly average pics I have put on plant files, might continue that. But I have some photos that I just think are awesome, and no way they are going anywhere on DG. Other than the photo policy, I guess nothing will really change much for me. I hope DG will build back up and keep going.

Did you know that you can post your pictures on the IRIS ENCYCLOPEDIA (a wiki) of The American Iris Society? I've been posting pictures there ever since PollyK made me aware of it, and I believe it will eventually be accessible through the AIS website. You have to register and get a password, but then you can add pictures. The only problem is that you have to reduce the resolution to 75 (can be up to 75.9), but I have a Mac and it's pretty easy for me and I don't know about other computers.

http://www.wiki.irises.org

Oops -- I should have left off the www. part. The website is:

http://wiki.irises.org

I forgot to add that you don't have to be registered to look up a variety, only if you want to add pictures. It's currently being developed and it's really a great resource.

My 2 cents worth!!!

I maybe a computer dummy but I was married to two different programers that owned sites and so forth so I do know a little about what I am about to say.

If you write ANYTHING on any site and think it's private your mistaken. Someone can SEE everything you write if and when they want to. They can change the wording, and so forth of YOUR text without even asking you or in many cases without your knowledge at all. They can change the score or points on games you play and so forth. So please don't ever think your writting something no one else is aware of. Big brother may not be watching over your shoulder but someone from the site your on most likely is. If you have something bad to say about them, they will watch you even closer or completely ban you or worse. Take care dear friends and choose your words carefully so they don't come back and bite you in the rear end.

P.S. I don't get on here very often any more yet I can contact my true friends by email, or facebook. FYI Facebook has an Iris page. LOL Probably will not renew my membership and it has nothing to do with CUBITS.

God Bless each and everyone of you! Happy Memorial Weekend. I'm off to church now.
Marian

IrisMA: Sorry I did not get back to you about the JI problem. I could only find one bud chewed into. Could be the dose of liquid imidacloprid (Bayer Merit) killed that little sucker before he could do more damage. I treated them with a medium dose last fall after reading they are susceptible to borers. In any event, all my JI's are in multiple heavy buds and should open at any time. Thanks to all the JI fans who introduced me to them.

I'm glad the problem is solved. We are going to the AIS convention this week, but of course that is too early for JI.

IMHO, there are two issues here - the conflict between Dave and IB and the conflict among members of Davesgarden. The way that members are speaking to each other in the forums discussing the Dave/IB conflict is painful. I have never seen such venom at this website before. There have been small spats here and there but people are tearing into each other in some of the forums over this. Its seems out of proportion considering the situation.

Luckily after the first upset, the forums I have been on are sensible. What a relief. I am on both sites & both have something to offer.

Badger, I have to agree with you on how much venom has been going around over this in certain threads. People will be people, though, I guess, but it's a shame.

Karen

Note from admin: since the original question has been answered, I'm going to lock this off-topic thread and remove it later today.

The legal issues between the former and current owners of the site will not affect our members' use of Dave's Garden. If and when there are pertinent details, they will be shared on the Dave's Garden forum. As always, we advise all subscribing members to have that forum among your "favorite forums" as it is the go-to place for site questions, suggestions, etc.

irisawe, your original post was deleted due in large part to the email address you included. For your privacy and security, I'd encourage you to not post your email address on a forum thread where it can be read by thousands of people ;o)

Terry