Clematis 'round the pine tree project

I have a tall, ugly, bare-bottomed pine tree that I was going to cut down until I saw a Clematis scrambling up a tree in a photo here on DG. I thought maybe I could save the tree and make it more attractive at the same time. I live in Zone 7b, just south of Atlanta. Our winters are very mild with only a few weeks of really cold weather.

The tree gets a lot of shade until mid-afternoon when it gets a few hours of direct sun on one side ... maybe 3-4 hours. It is on the edge of my "woods," a forested area I allowed to grow on its own for the past 21 years. I recently cleared the front 30' of small saplings, leaving an area for a shade garden. I am going to plant more small trees (dogwoods, maybe Japanese maples) to give the area dappled shade.

I want to stick with my colors of rosy red/burgundy, to pink (all shades) to white.

I am new to gardening and have never grown Clematis before. I purchased one last spring, a Montana Broughton Star (still in a pot awaiting a home), which I have learned would be appropriate for this project. Someone said any of the Montana group would work and, after doing a little research, I see they grow higher (or longer) than most others. However, most have smaller blooms. Pirl posted a photo of her Montana Grandiflora which was gorgeous and has medium sized blooms that look like dogwood blossoms. It was beautiful and I think I would like to go with that.

It appears that none of the Montana group has red blooms. Would a climbing rose do instead? I am going to wrap fencing loosely around the bottom of the tree to give the Clematis a head start up the tree and hope it will cling to the rough bark when it outgrows the fence.

Questions:

Do I need more than one Clematis; if so. how many?
Would a rose work for my red color; if so, which one ... or more than one?
Is there a trumpet vine that has a rosy red bloom or are they all orange-red?
How about Hyacinth bean vine?
Should I plant now or wait until spring?
If now, where can I buy Clematis and get them delivered quickly?

Here's a photo of the poor, ugly thing. Reminds me of a teenager going through puberty --- all legs. Bless its heart. It needs a makeover ---BAD! I would appreciate any suggestions or ideas.

Judy

This message was edited Oct 11, 2009 11:07 AM

Here's a closeup of the base of the tree. The stump on the right was a sweetgum. The large root belongs to that stump and will be removed. I may put a pot of something on the stump or cover it with a mound of dirt and plant something on top of it (perennials, annuals). I am open to suggestions. The torrents of rain we have had lately have exploded the mushroom crop. They are everywhere!!

The roots on the upper left belong to trees that were taken down in that area (also sweetgums). The rain from my neighbor's yard and from my driveway has washed the soil away badly there, exposing the old roots. I will add new soil (see dirt pile at upper left) and cover the roots (chop those I can) with sod taken from beds yet to be prepared.

I can line the area around the tree with bricks, rocks, or edge it with an edger (prefer rocks). The clematis will be planted on the shady side of the tree so the roots will stay cool. I know I will have to be very careful about disturbing the roots on the pine tree. Pirl and I have discussed drenching the root area with water to expose the major roots ... just to see where they are. I can then work around them. (That lady is just full of ideas!)

So there it is. Whadda ya think? :-)

Judy

Judy, Is that a tree a white pine? Do you know why it lost all it's bottom branches? Does it have many heavy branches at the top?

Dathen

You could consider pillars for roses and have holes drilled to match the pillar of your choice in the stump shown in the photo.

http://www.jacksonandperkins.com/gardening/PD/30177/

You may or may not want the set of three but they are on sale = temptation. Maybe you could find a good red climber for the pillars and place them so they'd be in front of the screen of clematises behind them.

There is a trellis I saw in my local store that is something to consider. I was looking for a trellis and saw one leaning against the wall. I asked an associate about it because I couldn't figure it out as it was strapped together. It was a trellis to go around a tree (and would fit around a large tree) It was solid, heavy black metal and I almost bought it because it was also under a hundred dollars. It was a handsome trellis and I immediately envisioned clems growing up it. But, alas, I walked on.

Try a Clematis armandii, it is evergreen, highly scented and very vigorous. It will climb up most things, is good in heat and can stand the cold in Britain.
It flowers in the spring with a mass of white flowers that smell the garden out with the scent. sometime, although not as much in the autumn (fall as well.
It would easily go up there.
Here is a picture of mine!
Regards from England.
Neil.



This message was edited Oct 13, 2009 2:18 AM

Here is a closer picture when it took over the washing line, all the back walls and is now going down the other sides.
Although it really likes to climb.
Regards from England.
Neil.

Dathen,
That tree is typical of the pines here in Georgia that just "volunteer" and come up everywhere. The reason mine looks so pitiful is that it has no siblings, as others do. I took some pictures of "groves" of these trees on the way home from the baby shower Sunday but I dropped the camera and it malfunctioned. (Got it working again when I got home. Whew!) When they're all together they form a high canopy covering a mat of pine needles on the floor. Great place to grow azaleas. It didn't look so bad when the other tree was there. And, yes, there are many branches at the top. I don't know whether it's white pine or not. Isn't that awful? Been here all my life and don't know what the native pine is called. Shame on me!

Pirl,
Do you think I hadn't seen those pillars at J&P? You little enabler, you. That is a good idea about putting a pillar on top of the stump. I will definitely consider that. I have an old metal etagere with a sort of fancy top that lost its glass shelves when a heavy Christmas ornament plunged through them. It is square but very similar to the pillars. I have it on the front porch with marble tiles as shelves. Might work out there by the tree. When I saw those pillars I thought about my etagere. I love those arches and arbors at J&P too.

Venu,
I think my old rusty fence would work as well as a trellis around the tree and it's free! LOL I love rusty stuff in the garden. I have to force myself to walk past the trellis/arbor portion of the stores too. I have three sitting in the garage waiting for places in the yard. Lowe's had a sale a few weeks ago. I have wondered what one or two trellises would look like out there somewhere around the tree. I stand at my kitchen window and do a lot of "constructive staring."

Neil,
Thank you for the beautiful photos of your Clematis Armandii. What a gorgeous thing! Evergreen is certainly a plus. Sounds like a perfect solution for my poor, naked tree. Definitely a consideration.

Thank you all so much for the ideas. I fear I may have waited too late to plant anything this year. We are having torrents of rain again and it's cooling down. Daytime temps in the 70s this week. Of course, it could go back up into the 80s many times in the next few weeks. You never know. Last year we couldn't water. This year we're having flood warnings. Feast or famine. Go figure.

I love the idea of the tree trellis that Louise/Venu saw, it is so intriguing. Time to Google it.

That Armandi is beyond description! How old is it?

Judy - take a photo of the etagere and a photo of the tree area and make a side by side collage in Picasa or post them here and I'll do it for you so you can visualize them better.

Dear pirl, the armandii took over the whole of the back wall in two years flat from a 3 foot plant!
I cut it back to about 18 inches every 3 years as it can get a bit leggy at the bottom and it only takes a year to get back to what you see it like now.
My mother says it has a scent like Gardenia and Jasmine, mixed.
It is the only scented Clematis that is a species not a cultivar, and has a bonus as it evergreen as well.
I put one in my mothers garden as she had a large dead weeping willow tree. By throwing some thin ropes over the branches of the tree and anchoring them around the base of the tree, I made the Clematis its own climbing frame!
It took four years to get up this 40 foot tree and smother it. It is quite amusing as the base of the Clematis has gone leggy it looks like a normal tree, from a distance, then in the early spring you have the large leaves of this wonderful and underused plant and the flowers. People stop and are not sure what it is a tree in early spring with lots of leaves and thousands of flowers, giving off a beautiful scent.
I put one in my friends garden as he has a Rugby club with 30 foot fencing at the bottom of his garden, it is not his club, it is just at the bottom of his garden.
It smothered the fence to the top, grew along it and took over the most hated conifer, a leylandii.
I have received a note from someone in Texas saying it grows there in that heat and dryness, but here in England it withstands the wet and in February it was minus 16.2℉ and that did not bother it either.
Kind Regards from England.
Neil.

I don't mean to throw a wet blanket on your plans, but there are a couple of things to consider.

I love your idea of planting dogwoods and Japanese maples in front of the stand of trees. Both are so beautiful on their own and they will be the perfect 2nd tier of your plantings. From the close-up photo of the pine tree, I see many exposed roots already. Are exposed roots common with that sort of tree? Sometimes, trees under stress will raise their roots. Maybe the area is too wet for the pine tree and the roots are raised so it can get oxygen. It would help if you could find out what it is and do some sort of assessment on the health of the tree. You might be landscaping around a slowly dying tree.

If the tree is ok and you want to keep it, do you have a way of getting up 30-35' to tack in some sort of support along the truck of the tree so the clematis can climb to is maximum height? I've never tried growing a clematis up a tree, but I do know that without having something to easily grab onto, the vines will fall down onto themselves and it won't reach the desired height.

I can't tell from the photo, but does the pine tree tower over the other trees and is it leaning? Even if the first 20-30 feet was covered with a clematis, would the rest of the tree still bother you?







This message was edited Oct 13, 2009 9:47 AM

Judy, I understand what you're saying about the trees/canopy/no branches effect - I do remember that they grow that way in the metro park here.

This is the way the roots grow above ground on some of my white pine - I'm thinking it may be a normal thing for these trees. I have pictures of 2 others if this one doesn't come through.

Thought this one was interesting - the roots are crossing over each other.


Edited to say - Yes, thats probably poison ivy.




This message was edited Oct 13, 2009 12:38 PM

Not from your part of the country, but in Upstate NY there are tons of pines that look just like yours, and have lots of exposed roots. The ones closest to the lake we stayed by were raised so much I could sit in them like a chair when I was a kid. My butt's way too big to do that now, but you get the idea...

Julia,
If you're talking about the roots in the upper left in the photo, those are from other trees that I had taken down. The rain has washed away the soil in that area, exposing them. Also, the root on the right near the stump belongs to that tree, not the pine. The only roots I saw that appeared to belong to the pine are the ones you can actually see connected to the trunk.

The tree does not lean. I think I may have tilted the camera a bit when I took the photo. There are other trees taller than the pine. There is a poplar right next to it and more sweet gums behind it.

I was hoping the vine would latch on to the rugged bark of the tree once it got a head start on the fencing wrapped around the bottom.

Dathen ... interesting photos. The root wrapped around your tree is said to be "girdling" I think and is not a good thing. Eventually chokes the tree. At least that is what an arborist told me.

Grrrlgeek ... I have seen roots like that on very old trees. Neat, aren't they? This tree is very young as trees go. It was a volunteer that appeared after I moved in 21 years ago.