Crisis of conscience :D - opinions please

All summer long I've been waiting for cooler weather to clean out our horrible, "gone to complete chaos" beds. I want to replant with native plants, and for the most part I think fall is the best time for this. My goal is a pretty, natural looking yard that attracts and is a healthy habitat for birds and butterflies. However, now the birds are gorging themselves on all the plants gone to seed and producing berries. I have feeders out year round, and wooded to semi-open acreage adjacent to the yard that we leave to grow wild that provide food. Do I just go ahead, because I'm ultimately providing a healthier environment for them, or wait til spring? I'm cross posting in the bird watching forum. Thanks!

Skalte,

I have gone native here and it was quite easy, since I live out in the woods. I have done a lot of transplanting from down the way up to my beds to accomplished a more dense area of natives.

However, I still maintain some of the old reliables of coneflowers, rudbeckias and blanket flowers. They are all somewhat naturalized and grow in my difficult conditions.

What seed heads I don't manually pull and scatter, I purposefully leave for the birds to eat. They don't really care whether the seeds are native or not and leaving them until they are gone encourages the birds to come to your place.

I don't keep feeders out since they have a tendency to attract grey squirrels and my method of feeding the birds accomplishes this.

The only squirrels coming to my place and are very welcome are the Fox Squirrels.

So, bottom line, can you plant your natives among the fading others? Then after they have been picked clean, remove the plants and compost them.

I've thought about that, it's just that my beds haven't been tended for 8 or so years and totally need to be mucked out, soil sampled, etc. I think I need a clean slate. I may, however, clean it out except for the few grasses and volunteer pokeweeds the birds seem to most prefer, which are next to my fountain (that they flock to.) I'm mostly bummed that I'll lose the enjoyment of watching them, since the overgrown weeds and fountain are within inches of my deck and I can observe them at close range. I planned to clean the beds out this weekend, but decided to hold off until I call the county extension office about soil sampling and a contact a local native plant nursery. I think I can find a way to implement your idea - thanks!

Funny Skalte,

I have a couple pokeweed that grow beside my birdbath. They are quite pretty and when the berries get ripe the bonded pair of bluebirds return from the summer for their feasts. Then they take a bath.

Molly
:^)))

If you are worried about birds not finding enough food, that's not a concern. If it were me, I would go ahead and renovate on my own schedule.

I have the same problem - Birds were enjoying the poison ivy (it's native, but I'm not going to encourage it, russian olive (this is really a bad guy!), and non-native mulberry among others and I'm trying to plant as many natives as possible. I just decided to do a gradual transition - so I got rid of a lot of the bad stuff, but left some.

I have dogwood, winterberry, red mulberry, lots of oaks, pines, elderberry started, but some of these will take a while to get established.

I like pokeweed too. We let the pasture go wild last year and got native daisy fleabane, milkweed and goldenrod.

Well, I'm doing kind of a mix of both options. I decided I really need to start from scratch, so I'm holding off tearing everything out until I get the soil sample results I just sent to Michigan State. I'll clean the beds out once I know what need to do to get the soil in better shape. I may be planting stuff in November and as a result may have to wait until next year to put in some things I'd have liked to have gotten in this year. Makes more sense though, to take the time to do it right. So, the birds get to enjoy the weeds a bit longer, but not all winter. Thanks, everyone!

Well, one good thing is it's really better to not do any fertilizing with natives - our Master Gardeners here say. One thing is crucial though - get rid of the weeds. I'm starting a wildflower meadow (not from a pre-made mix). I've read to take as long as two seasons to spray, cultivate, smother or a combination to really get them all. You can't really weed a meadow. Of course, you can weed a more planed garden.

Hope yours turns out great!

CompostR can you elaborate as to why?

Sure - because natives grew up on your native soil without humans providing any additional fertilizer. That is to say they are ideally suited to your natural environment - whatever it is - they have grown there by themselves for thousands of years.

Now, I hate to make it more complicated, but, to be honest, I have to add: If your native soil has been depleted by some human activity (like heavy farming, removal of the topsoil, etc.) then you might consider trying to amend the soil to what it was originally. Here in Pennsylvania that often means adding organic matter like compost. Sorry, I don't know what kind of soil you have there in Ft. Worth.

Also, remember to fit the plant to the location regarding moisture, sun, and soil type (sandy, clay, loam, etc.). Natives can then take care of themselves which is one thing that makes them so cool to grow!

Thanks.

I found out that I can't leave flowers to go to seed "for birds and winter interest" like the garden books recommend. It attracts rodents here - and I ended up mowing everything down around Christmas the first couple of years I lived here. My birds manage okay with feeders. Since yours have wild areas nearby, they should do well. My conversion to native plants is a slow ongoing process. I think biodeversity - slowly aquiring a lot of different things - has done as much for the wildlife as anything. I have attracted a lot of birds by starting at the bottom of the food chain and planting for insects.

My problem on this 1/2 acre that I am working on to garden is covered with pokeberry plants. I've been cutting, pulling and mowing the stuff down. Some of the pokeberry's in the back of the property are over 8 ft tall and now falling over. I have to get it removed as that is were I'm going to plant my elderberries. I'm down to my last quart of elderberry jelly and have not found any growing wide around here but will check in the summer. I also have wild onions growing here. Before we plow the yard next month, I've got to dig up the wild onions and get them into a big pot to save them. They are small, but tasty.
Mary

Unless you dig around and get the roots, the poke will grow back. I've pulled small plants just starting to grow and It reappears the next year. I really had to grub to get rid of the one I did let grow. They are beautiful tho.

A lot of flowers do better with dry or poor soil. I think it concentrates the nectar.

I've just started to get interested in native plants and planting for the bees, butterflies and hummers. I hope your bed works out Skalte.

Update - I got my soil test results and added some potash to the newly tilled beds (the poke berries were pretty much eaten by the time I had time to till) per the recommendation included with the sample results. That's about all I needed to do since I'm not planning on using any "heavy feeders." Also - I signed up for the MG class being offered starting in january. I'm excited! Thanks everyone!