Salvia involucrata tbd

Some time back in the last century, I was browsing amongst the salvias of a well-known nurseryman and spotted an unlabeled involucrata that was significantly different from those I was already familiar with - Bethellii, Hadspen, Boutin. On enquiring of the man he confidently named it as Bethellii. Although I pointed out it was nothing like the Bethellii I knew, having no sign of the very round terminal bud cluster, he remained adamant about it's pedigree.

I bought the plant anyway and it has proved to be a very successful purchase. Compared to Bethellii, it has turned out to be more hardy, more vigorous, more early to flower, resistant to spider-mite (which often totally decimate my Bethellii). It has leaves which are slightly more fleshy than Bethellii and somewhat greyish-green. In the pic there is a Hadspen in the background just infront of the guaranitica. This shows the somewhat more green leaf typical of it and Bethellii.

I have seen a similar plant to it at Wisley RHS Gardens and it was labeled as S.involucrata var. involucrata and so it is possible that my plant is infact the type plant. Whatever, if you get a chance to buy one that looks like mine, don't hesitate.

Jim

I wouldn't hesitate to buy it...regardless of name. It's a beauty.

I agree, it's very beautiful!

Perhaps this could be the true species of involucrata. There are SO many cultivars.

Likewise, I recently obtained what just might be the true species of guaranitica...great plant, but the word "invasive" would be a masterpiece of understatement!

Robin.

I suspect this is a hybrid because of the elongated involucre, which is nearly spherical in bethelii and all of the puberula subspiecies forms I am faomiliar with. These include the one I collected in Hidalgo, near the type location for puberula (when it was considered a separate species), the Yucca-Do accession, and El Butano (way out of the range for both puberula and involucrata.

In fact, this looks a lot like the form I got from Wave Hill which I thought might be Hadspen. Can anyone tell me about the shape of the involucres of Hadspen and Boutin?

If it is the same as Wave Hill, the axillary growth will droop and layer a lot. IBranches will tend to break off from the leader rather easily

Here is the image of Salvia puberula from Hidalgo

Whoops, here is a closeup of the spike, hopefully without the text overlay

Here is a scan of Salvia involucrata from Wave Hill. This is a juvinile spike/involucre. Note the elongation. This is why I suspect it is a hybrid. Marco Stufano of Wave Hill in New York City said the plant came from England when I got some cuttings from him..

I was looking through my Random House Book of Indoor and Greenhouse Plants when I saw a photo of a Salvia involucrata that looked very similar to yours. It was called 'Mrs Pope' and here is what was written about it..."Has elongated loose-flowered inflorescences, bracts ovate, acuminate often curled at apex."

It also mentioned another elongate flowering form which is very pubescent called 'El Butano.' *edited to add- after looking El Butano up on google, I don't know what they were thinking when they said this was elongated! *

I don't know if that will be helpful or not but it's something to look into.


This message was edited Aug 8, 2009 1:56 PM

Rich - you may well be right that my plant is a hybrid since it would seem that involucrata is a plant of loose morals - happy to change it's appearance if the occasion demands or intimately mix with others when the mood is right. It is thus difficult to decide who it really is. I guess that until we explore it's innermost secrets, i.e. it's DNA, we will have to guess at it's origins.

Until then I can only repeat that my plant with it's slightly rougher to the touch, grey-green leaves, has never let me down. It obviously has some 'good' genes.

Jim

Danita

I also have the book you refer to and the pic of Mrs Pope is very similar to my plants with its elongated inflorescence but the terminal bud on Mrs Pope semms too globose - as also seen in the pic at http://www.gapphotos.com/imagedetails.asp?imageno=148326.

I haven't seen El Butano so I cannot comment.

Jim

Here is an image of Salvia puberula El Butano, growing in full sun. Note the light green, pubescent leaves, very different from S. involucrata bethelii, which has glossy foliage and red-veined leaves and red stems. When grown in nearly all shade, El Butano seems to get darker and larger leaves and resemble a giant form of the Hidalgo and Yucca-Do forms of puberula.